D-2-G-4A<\/p>\n
Meeting with U.S. Embassy official Doug Ellice<\/strong>, likely late summer 1978<\/strong><\/p>\n Meeting with Doug Ellice:<\/p>\n Debbie [Touchette], Tim [Carter], Terry [Carter Jones],<\/p>\n We talked with Doug Ellice and Dan Weber las time it was the lady vice counsul he evidently doesn\u2019t want to talk to us alone, we also no sit on the couch which is a twist, Doug used to sit there and often times look at papers and sign them while talking to us.<\/p>\n We started off by asking about Tina he said he wanted to know what kind of set up of radio we had, he at first wasn\u2019t going to admit that they had a radio then I think he realized we knew they had one. I asked him if they had a radio or he would have to come over, he said \u201cNo, there is no radio here, I\u2019ll have to come over, then he said, well we do gave one but I don\u2019t know if can carry as far as into the interior so you tell us what kind of mega watts and what frequency you are on and I\u2019ll let you know, I would prefer to do it from this radio.\u201d<\/p>\n He started off being very defensive and saying it is not true no officials ever make comments at any social party, they sworn to secrecy, the he went into a little trip about if some was a dope smuggler and smuggled in hashish even if he was an obviously criminal they would have to protect him and keep his affairs secretly etc. We told him this didnt relate at all. He then said he categorically denied that anyone said anything and Tim backed him down by saying you might categorically deny about yourself but you haven\u2019t been here that long and you can\u2019t categorically deny for the rest of the Embassy when you haven\u2019t been to every social function. He said \u201cIt would be wise to tell you opinions about someone in a formal social gathering for instance I might not want to discuss a thing with you at a formal gathering but if I were with you on a Sunday drinking a beer I might tell you I think Jimmy Carter is a horses ass. Just as you would not go around sayi-g you don\u2019t like the US etc. if you did feel that way, but to your friends you might honestly say you would prefer to live here in Guyana. It was all BS like boxing he would throw a punch and then we would. He findally did say there was no way he could stop people in the Embassy from forming opinions of having control of what they say at oustided functions, he told us to get the names and he would do something, and until he had them he wouldn\u2019t be able to do anything. We told him about Malcom and he didn\u2019t deny it or even make a defense so obviously we touched some tows there\/<\/p>\n Debbie told him about that there was really no difference between alchol and marijuanna and he said \u201cAccept it is better for you to smoke marijuana\u201d we said whatever we make the pack that Adults don\u2019t drink we woun\u2019t smoke, He said this is a new one, I didn\u2019t ever hear that no one smoked before you mean to tell me no one smokes?\u201d He said yes but we are not pious etc. He said I hope I won\u2019t be bothering anybody by my smoking. (He smoked a pipe contiously)<\/p>\n When we told him about Mazor and it was very general we just said that somebody was going to step forward and tellsome things. He wanted to know if it was an ex-members we said no, but he had contacted ex-members to get their testimony, he said false-testimony of course. He said yes. He said I hope you\u2019ll let me know before this comes out since I will be directly involved you wish not to, but since I\u2019ll hear about it you might as weel teel<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n D-2-G-4B<\/p>\n me ahead of time. He said you don\u2019t know anything else at all? We said no we really don\u2019t he said well did this person try to go after reall testimony of false testimony we said false but that was all we knew right now. He was obviously very concerned and to be definitely in-formed of what is going on..<\/p>\n He said he would have to make it to J\/town by the end of the month but he might have to go by way of Matthews Ridge and then take the train. He ended by him telling us he would call if he needed to come over.<\/p>\n I am even sorrier about this one I don\u2019t know if it even makes sense because I am pretty tired and I am not thinking to clearly.<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n D-2-F-1A<\/p>\n Sharon Amos meeting with Doug Ellice, October 10, 1978<\/strong><\/p>\n Sharon Amos<\/p>\n Doug Ellice 10\/10\/78 CL [Carolyn Layton], Sharon, Jimmy Jr.<\/p>\n \u2013 he started by showing us a pile of letters from members of PT in the US, Margaret Elsey in San Mateo, Jackie Carrasco, and David Smith<\/p>\n \u2013 there were others but these 3 he read to us<\/p>\n \u2013 we told him about JJ not feeling well but that he was sorry about it and would personally contact each person if we had the name and address<\/p>\n \u2013 he said it was not necessary and in fact he didn\u2019t think that would be a good idea to have JJ tell people not<\/u> to write letters as it is their right to do so, but it seemed like an organized campaign to him as they all made the exact same mistake on his name (spelling it Ellise) and they were all dated on the same date, there were copies sent to each one to his Ambassador and copies sent to Dick McCoy<\/p>\n \u2013 we said we don\u2019t have control of what people might say<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that someone in Guyana must have written the information to SF about his name and about the rumors that his Embassy was supposedly saying and whoever pushed the button should be told it just aggravates Doug and he thinks it\u2019s a irritating thing to do<\/p>\n \u2013 he realizes we have communication problems at times with him but he said he is available for us to come in directly to tell him and work it out as we are the people who he serves, the Americans in Guyana, and people living in SF have nothing to do with his job<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that if we think it\u2019s going to change anything we are mistaken<\/p>\n Regarding rumors:<\/p>\n \u2013 he said there are situations in which he doesn\u2019t feel he or anyone else at the Embassy should be talking about PT such as places where it is obvious that they represent the Embassy, such as a cocktail party where government people might be present<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that there might be situations in which in a private discussion we might come up and it would be alright to discuss us<\/p>\n \u2013 however people ask him or might ask him about us as they say they hear our radio broadcast and he would explain that we are a group of Americans living in the jungle in an agricultural project\/we said we had no objection to such a discussion as this<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that if he thought we were a bunch of kooks and he was talking to a friend of his he would feel it was alright in a private conversation to say such a thing<\/p>\n \u2013 let him read the enclosed written message and got it back. He said that the first part was correct about the embassy being bugged, it probably is in the phones and the phones tho can be used to bug the whole room<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that in regard to wanting us expelled from Guyana, that\u2019s not true<\/p>\n \u2013 he said his dept. has no interest at all in having us expelled but that if anyone might be talking like this it would be Guyana as any country with such a large group of foreigners is going to have some reactions<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that maybe Guyanese would be upset about or jealous of the medical care we give saying that (the people) that we provide better medical care than the govt., that people might wonder what we are doing with the Amerindians in that area (we had asked him why Guyana might be concerned about us being here)<\/p>\n \u2013 I said that it sounded like from his conversation that he had been talking to Guyanese about us and he said no he hadn\u2019t.<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that he didn\u2019t think the CIA or the FBI would be interested in us or concerned about us being here growing cassava\/<\/p>\n \u2013 we said that we know there were some that were interested in us because of documented proof that we had\/ mentioned the Dennis Banks situation with the agent from a couple of agencies<\/p>\n \u2013 he said well maybe the IRS would be interested in us because we had some money<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that if [Joe] Mazor wasn\u2019t out to get us we must be OK\/ said he talked to Mazor before he went up to see us and Mazor admitted he was an adversary of us tho he came at our invitation but on the way back Mazor told him JT was just what it was represented by us to be and he really was praiseworthy of the project<\/p>\n \u2013 we told him we\u2019d like to have him write the procedure down for contacting local notaries as this was quite costly bringing in everyone on the boat and the cost of gas for a special trip\/ we said we had been expecting him to come to JT for his regular visit\/ he said he had scheduled it twice but had to cancel it both times as we asked him to delay for Charles Garry and then I guess he said he got sick so he couldn\u2019t come (or he took a trip, don\u2019t remember exactly which)<\/p>\n \u2013 I asked him to write out the procedure for having a notary that is Guyanese notarize our stuff then run it thru foreign affairs and the US Embassy\/ he wrote it out but wouldn\u2019t sign it\/ I asked him to do so, so that we wouldn\u2019t be stuck with a group of things improperly notarized\/he said<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n D-2-F-1B<\/p>\n [Reverse side of page is scratch paper]<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n D-2-F-1C<\/p>\n Doug Ellis [Ellice]<\/p>\n He couldn\u2019t do that because it is up to the person who wants a certain procedure done\/ like a jungle or lawyer as to what kind of process is kosher \u2013 if it is a not always the same\/ in some case it requires a notary and some cases a different process (CL [likely Carolyn Layton] might have the details on this) \u2013 but he said he is empowered to notarize something even if a Guyanese notary has been the one to witness it<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n D-2-F-2<\/p>\n [unsigned list]<\/p>\n 1 Get notary to sign<\/p>\n 2 Get MFA to authenticate his signature<\/p>\n 3 Get me to authenticate MFA signature<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n D-2-F-3<\/p>\n Anonymous undated memo<\/strong><\/p>\n Shown to him & taken back<\/p>\n We have been told that you are bugged. We don\u2019t care for ourselves. We don\u2019t mind dying or going to jail. But we don\u2019t want to see our people unnecessarily hurt.<\/p>\n There are people in the United Nations who are critical of Guyana. People in Guyana have been good to us, but we need to know the answer to this question. Did you say that you\u2019re trying to get us expelled from this country. Since Dick McCoy left we have learned to like your warmth and directness. Any time anything like this is said, we don\u2019t believe it until we talk to the person directly. Is it true? Three people are telling us this, all good friends of the government. Why would you think they would tell us this? We speak only good about the United States, but we have nothing but bad said about us. If the situation was reversed, I bet you would be speaking as highly about us as we do of you.<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n D-2-M-1A<\/p>\n Sharon Amos Contacts with U.S. Embassy official Doug Ellice, October 12, 1978<\/strong><\/p>\n Sharon Amos<\/p>\n Doug Ellice 12\/10\/78<\/p>\n \u2013 he called and said that he had a strange request for us\/ I said that was fine<\/p>\n \u2013 he said that the US govt. had been called upon to give vitimons and food to people in jail\/ supplements to their jail foods and that the US had had a problem with affording this<\/p>\n \u2013 he said also they are interested in the problem of deaths and moving bodies to the US as the cost is so great so he needs to get some information as to how many people died in Guyana in 1977 and he only have 1 person listed<\/p>\n \u2013 I said I\u2019d check on that<\/p>\n \u2013 I did some calling on Vivian Anderson\u2019s cremation and called Sase Naraine to see if it is done at the Hindu temple\/ he was very friendly and said it could be done and gave me another person to call<\/p>\n \u2013 this other person told me that you need 2 doctor\u2019s certificates, approval from several ministries<\/p>\n \u2013 I told Doug that it was so complicated that I felt that if the husband wanted it he should do it himself<\/p>\n \u2013 Doug said well is this man Vivian\u2019s husband or were they divorced. I said I didn\u2019t know. He said she didn\u2019t even claim him on her passport application and I said I knew that and I wondered too if he was her legitimate husband<\/p>\n \u2013 Doug asked me if Vivian had asked to be buried in JT and I said yes and that she had asked to return to JT to die and the hospital had written us a letter<\/p>\n \u2013 he said he didn\u2019t know the legality of uprooting a body unless it was a legal relative and that he\u2019d check with the funeral parlor that had been making the arrangements for the husband in LA<\/p>\n \u2013 he asked about our burying people in JT \u2013 if that was approved\/ I told him our site had been approved by Ministry of Health<\/p>\n \u2013 he wanted to know who did the burial and I said that we did the burials<\/p>\n \u2013 he wanted to know if the bodies were embalmed and I said no<\/p>\n \u2013 he said fine when he heard the site was approved<\/p>\n Doug Ellice 10\/10\/78<\/p>\n \u2013 Paar took some of us to dinner and Doug and his wife were sitting at a table where we went to (Pegasus)<\/p>\n \u2013 when we passed by them I said hello to him and he was friendly<\/p>\n \u2013 after he finished his dinner he and his wife came over to our table and he introduced his wife to me<\/p>\n \u2013 I introduced them to everyone at the table (made a joke about me blocking out names when I introduce them, I made the joke and he laughed)<\/p>\n \u2013 She is Chinese, small and very friendly sort of like Daisy [Jonestown resident Daisy Lee] is but less reserved. Reminds me of the wives of American servicemen when they married Asian women who would be submissive but she was kind of bubbly<\/p>\n \u2013 she siad \u201cwelcome to Georgetown\u201d<\/p>\n \u2013 I told her that we had a Chinese young woman in JT who taught Chinese (as well as the other language we are learning Portuguese, Spanish etc \u2013 I didn\u2019t mention Russian)<\/p>\n \u2013 I said Wo Man Chot knee wha hey \u2013 she said that was Catonese and she speaks Manderin but said if we teach Chinese we should teach Manderin as most of the people in the world speak that<\/p>\n \u2013 she was very enthusiastic to talk<\/p>\n \u2013 I told her that we have Koreans and people of all races<\/p>\n \u2013 she said that was wonderful<\/p>\n \u2013 maybe she\u2019s lonely or something\/ she was not in a hurry to run on \/ he stood there \u2013 friendly but she and I mostly chatted and he listened<\/p>\n I wondered what he thought of our gathering \u2013 we didn\u2019t look like the usual radical group\/ Jack Beam, Paar, Jean Brown, Joyce Parks, LeFlora Towns, Christine Young and myself (more like a middle-aged group) also Richard [Janaro] was there<\/p>\n —–<\/p>\n \n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":" D-2-G-4A Meeting with U.S. Embassy official Doug Ellice, likely late summer 1978 Meeting with Doug Ellice: Debbie [Touchette], Tim [Carter], Terry [Carter Jones], We talked with Doug Ellice and Dan Weber las time it was the lady vice counsul he evidently doesn\u2019t want to talk to us alone, we also no sit on the couch […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"parent":88241,"menu_order":3,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"footnotes":""},"class_list":["post-133460","page","type-page","status-publish","hentry"],"acf":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/133460","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/page"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=133460"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/133460\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":133461,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/133460\/revisions\/133461"}],"up":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/88241"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=133460"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}