{"id":27406,"date":"2013-06-16T00:19:59","date_gmt":"2013-06-16T00:19:59","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/alternativejonestown.com\/?page_id=27406"},"modified":"2014-04-06T23:40:50","modified_gmt":"2014-04-06T23:40:50","slug":"q273","status":"publish","type":"page","link":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/?page_id=27406","title":{"rendered":"Q273 Transcript"},"content":{"rendered":"

Transcript prepared by Fielding M. McGehee III. If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you.<\/strong><\/i><\/p>\n

To return to the Tape Index, click here.<\/a>
\nTo read the Tape Summary, click here<\/a>. Listen to MP3 (Pt. 1<\/a>, Pt. 2<\/a>).<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> And every time somebody fixes something special for me, everybody<\/em> takes the right to go into that goddamn kitchen and make<\/em> what they need. The rest of you that let you do it to you, they\u2019re buying something from you, they\u2019re buy\u2013 (tape edit) had the health problems I\u2019ve got, I wish I\u2019d never had<\/em> to think about \u2018em. Now I won\u2019t think about them. We\u2019ll just take our chances, because I\u2019m not gonna go through it anymore, I\u2019m sick of it. If there\u2019s any substantiation to it, and I\u2019ve heard it rumored<\/em> through this place that it\u2019s being done. All through this place. And it will not be resolved by changing supervision. It\u2019s not a supervisorial problem, although there are those who are supervisors who have participated in it very much. And I\u2019m afraid of making shifts, even though there now is something on the floor about making a shift, and they want to put another sister joint, white and black, responsibility in the kitchen, I think that\u2019s very good, but I seen the sister they w\u2013\u00a0recommend, and her children can manipulate anything<\/em> they want out of her. And I don\u2019t want to see anybody in that kitchen that will be (calls out) manipulated<\/em>.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> Right. (Applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> But<\/em> that may be perfectionism talk. That may be uh, my ass<\/em> talkin\u2019, because my mind knows better. Because everyone<\/em> in there is guilty of it. (Pause) So well, my friend, my good comrade leader, uh, that\u2019s\u2013 that\u2019s humanity. Uh, isn\u2019t gonna be my kind of humanity because I watch these babies, and I look at them, and I\u2019m sure they like a little diversity in their food. I\u2019m sure they would, and I just don\u2019t like it. (unintelligible word) I\u2019ll not drink any more of that<\/em> shit, too, I\u2019m going outta business, something I have to take for uh, release of indigestion. I won\u2019t take that<\/em>, because I am not going to allow you<\/em> to manipulate what you want<\/em> to do<\/em> out of some excuse<\/em> that you\u2019re helping Dad<\/em>, and while you\u2019re fixing Dad\u2019s<\/em> food, you\u2019re fixing your own<\/em> food. So, whatever comes off that dinner\u2013\u00a0dinner line, I\u2019ll be right there with you. I enjoyed the meal tonight, anyway. I don\u2019t know what it was kick about. Lotta people kick kick kick kick kick, but if you had to eat the high protein that I have, you\u2019d welcome<\/em> it. And I\u2019m so sick of flesh, that I\u2013 I don\u2019t even want to look at it. I don\u2019t even want to look<\/em> at flesh. I can stand the whites in the eggs to some degree, and I don\u2019t know whether there\u2019s any protein in it or not, but uh, I\u2019m sure that we all have to have protein, and we\u2019re going to all have to balance the protein, and I\u2019m going to have to balance mine right along with the rest of yours, \u2018cause that\u2019s the way the ball game\u2019s going from now on. (Pause) That\u2019s the way it\u2019s going. And I uh, hope<\/em> that we will be\u2013 of one of the facts, be able to straighten that kitchen matter up, that we\u2019ll be able to integrate. There\u2019s a f\u2013\u00a0there\u2019s a\u2013 there\u2019s a feeling here uh, that it\u2019s not based on any of the racism\u2013\u00a0no racism on the part of the leadership, that there\u2019s a black front force and a white front force. So we gotta integrate this. We can\u2019t have whites in the front and blacks in the back, even though it may be just nothing but an accident<\/em>, it may mean that they got no white cooks that can cook worth shit. And that\u2019s possible<\/em>. But we better find<\/em> one. (Pause) We\u2013\u00a0we surely can find some white dishwashers. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> (Applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Peace. (Calls out) And we will.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> (Cheers and applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Peace. By Monday morning, that k\u2013\u00a0that whole<\/em> program will be integrated. I don\u2019t know how you\u2019re going to do it, but I\u2019m ordering<\/em> it. I don\u2019t care if you like<\/em> me, love me, lump me, love me, I know you don\u2019t like me, I don\u2019t give a shit, principle\u2019s<\/em> all that matters to me, Monday morning, the fuckin\u2019 place\u2019ll be integrated, and everybody\u2019ll be peaceful.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> (Cheers and applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Everybody\u2019ll be peaceful. (Pause) Peace. And that\u2019s what this organization lacks, in coordinators, in the supervision, some don\u2019t have enough voice perhaps, but you won\u2019t wiel [wield] responsibility, because you don\u2019t want to be hated. And we\u2019ll starve to death, we don\u2019t stop it. We\u2019re faltering in our pro\u2013\u00a0production of vegetables, faltering in even the report to me, that the vegetables are not coming up out of the ground. This report was not given to me\u2013 you can\u2019t gi\u2013 expect me to go through 84 manuscripts. I had a manuscript to go through today on problems in the United States. I<\/em> can\u2019t\u2013 I<\/em> can\u2019t uh, possibly weigh these things, these have got the high points of dangers have got to be brought out, and underlined or s\u2013 whispered in my ear, \u2018cause all those manuscripts now, I\u2019m administering the home front. The difference in administering (tape edit) this, if you don\u2019t move just wisely, you\u2019ll be open to a number of criminal actions. If we move out of there too quickly<\/em>, those fuckers will see uh, an opportunity to take criminal actions against some of our people. If we don\u2019t move out in time<\/em>, we\u2019ll lose our property, and\u2013\u00a0but\u2013 st\u2013 you can certainly get rid of property without losing your people. This idea that our people there can\u2019t sell this San Francisco Temple, they have to have it. That\u2019s bullshit. They don\u2019t have to have it. They don\u2019t have to have it, they can function without it, and we\u2019ve ordered it be done. But they\u2019ve defied<\/em> that order on a\u2013\u00a0on several occasions. And that\u2019s what made me so down and say again, I\u2019m gone take a few more days to see who\u2019s coming<\/em>. Why in the hell would they want to come<\/em> and not realize that we need a 300,000 or at least 250,000 dollars out of that church<\/em> building. Obviously we need that. Huh?<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd:<\/strong> (too soft)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> They w\u2013\u00a0they<\/em> might be, that\u2019s true. But one<\/em> thing, we need<\/em> the money. And we\u2019re not going to let that building\u2013 because one thing we can\u2019t change, unless you want to negotiate, and I thought about that. If this\u2013 If this organization had its leadership, I\u2019d\u2013 I know<\/em> what these fuckers want. They want the death of Jim Jones. That\u2019s what they really want. It\u2019s Jim Jones that showed them themselves. It\u2019s Jim Jones that made them have to face themselves. It was Jim Jones that made them have to take a look<\/em> at themselves. That\u2019s<\/em> what killing them. Now they had\u2013\u00a0they couldn\u2019t live with looking<\/em> at him, and when you don\u2019t continue trying to love, that will turn to hate. That\u2019s why we call it the love\/hate syndrome. Then they want to rationalize that all those years they coulda been livin\u2019 it up, because they finally become creatures\u00a0 of lust, and then they hate<\/em> me for those years they lost. And I\u2019m easily understanding that kind of phenomena, even though I don\u2019t understand the lowness<\/em> of their character. I can understand their departure<\/em> from socialism. I can even empathize with that, but not their cruelty. Not the barbarous<\/em> cruelty. How they can now go so far, that they set up headlines that two young blacks molest an old drunk white woman [Kathy Hunter], making it uh\u2013\u00a0punishing<\/em> every black person in California. Making it unsafe, as sure as h\u2013 there is no heaven, as sure as the sun rises and sets, some black going through Redwoods is gonna get hurt<\/em> because of this. We were getting hurt when we were traveling up there, when everybody was speaking well<\/em> of us. They surrounded us in a restaurant or a parking or a gas station, and nearly did our drivers in<\/em>, in Santa Rosa, where the\u2013 the\u2013 the heat of this is coming from, the Press Democrat<\/em>. And to think that Jim Cobb and all those black and white people had no more awareness<\/em> or concern. They have awareness. They had no concern<\/em>, goddamnmit. To suit their own vendetta of hate towards me, they will risk every black person\u2019s safety<\/em> in the whole of Sonoma, Northern California, Mendocino County, or anybody going through<\/em> there on their way to Washington. That\u2019s a cruel<\/em> bunch of mother fuckers.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> And I\u2019ve uh\u2013 I\u2019ve uh, thought of the exchange. This place is where it ought to be, I\u2019d make an exchange. You drop your goddamn suits\u2013\u00a0You say you\u2019re concerned about the well-being of your relatives, you drop your goddamn suits, fifty some million dollars of them now, trying to stifle our people, and you can have me. No, I\u2019m talking of what I\u2019ve felt. I know that\u2019s not feasible<\/em> because the place won\u2019t function<\/em> now. But I sure wish it would. \u2018Cause I\u2019m a tired man, and I\u2019d give them me, and I could say, do with me what you will, \u2019cause I don\u2019t give a goddamn. I\u2019m in hell anyway, and if it would get you out of some hell, I\u2019d gladly go back and say, suckers, now you\u2019ve got the person you want to kill, now you\u2019ve got the person that troubled your conscience, now do\u2013\u00a0destroy<\/em> him. (Pause) But I can\u2019t do it. The organization\u2013 Well, I can\u2019t do it, not for the reason you<\/em> have, not out of sentimentality, I\u2019m not sentimental, not about myself. I couldn\u2019t sacrifice your<\/em> life, but I can sacrifice mine. I wouldn\u2019t have debated hour after hour about whether your<\/em> life be spared, but God, if I had\u2013 only had the right to act on my<\/em> su\u2013\u00a0assumption, my own self esteem of\u2013 uh, my estimation of my<\/em> value and the historical process, we\u2019da had it over in ten seconds. I wouldna debated it. It\u2019da been over with. \u2018Cause I don\u2019t see myself in these sentimental terms as some of you do, as an important soul. That\u2019s what you\u2019re projecting on me. You see your importance<\/em>. So you say, don\u2019t, you\u2013 No, no, Dad, don\u2019t go back, don\u2019t let them do what you\u2013 they will to you, \u2018cause I\u2019ll suffer. If you would be where you ought<\/em> to be today, in growth, you wouldn\u2019t suffer when I was gone, somebody else could step in my shoes, and I could do<\/em> that and get these hounds at bay. And I\u2019ll bet you they\u2019d recall their suits to get me. That\u2019s how much hate<\/em> they\u2019re on. There\u2019s no love in them, there\u2019s no mercy, there\u2019s no compassion, there\u2019s not even human decency anymore. They\u2019re not concerned about their relatives. Obviously, they\u2019re not, or they wouldn\u2019t try to cut us off from the amateur radio, try to get our money so you can\u2019t eat, (calls out) they\u2019re not concerned about you, (voice calms) they know nothing but pandemonium<\/em> can come out of that. If they succeeded in getting done what they want to do, stopping us from medicines, informing all the doctors not to talk to us, so you can\u2019t anybody to talk to you on the\u2013 on the radio, even though we backed up\u2013 the FCC at least backed off, and we still have our license, but they\u2019ve gone so far as to keep doctors from talking to our doctor [Larry Schacht]. So we\u2019re having to go on a whole new meter band, having to think about beaming our signal towards the Soviet Union. That\u2019s how little they care, your goddamn relatives. Say, well, mine care, they weren\u2019t involved with it. They shoulda rose up and protested it then. They know what\u2019s happening, they can read the newspaper.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> Right. (Applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Peace. It\u2019s in the newspaper, black and white, what they\u2019re doing to us. Black and white, how they\u2019re getting all these agencies to investigate and harass our people and cut off our funds, and try to stop our money, and any fool<\/em> could know all those 55 million dollars suits, frame-up suits, are just to see that the properties will be fixed and our bank at\u2013 counts ta\u2013 attached, so you won\u2019t be able to eat. So don\u2019t<\/em> kid yourself, and say, my relative not in it. Well, you don\u2019t know. Say, well, isn\u2019t. Well, the Medlocks [Wade and Mabel Medlock] are, and a lot of black people are, and a lot of white people are, and if yours wasn\u2019t in it, then, if you\u2019re not<\/em> of it, you should be against<\/em> it.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> (Scattered applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> How many of your relatives\u2013\u00a0Peace. How many of your relatives have written you offering to stand up against them? How many of your relatives have written offering to write the press on our behalf? How many of your relatives were at our protest march, and all of \u2018em were offered and contacted<\/em>. (Voice drops) None. Face it, children. We entertained one woman here for eight days, Vivian Davis, eight dav\u2013 days, you don\u2019t want to face it, but she would not come. She was afraid. Said, send to Jim and Marcy [Marceline Jones] my love, it\u2019s such a beautiful place, but I\u2019m afraid. Then she promised to come to her daughter, \u2018cause she couldn\u2019t stand to lie to her daughter over the radio, but she didn\u2019t come the next morning. (Pause) Don\u2019t tell me your relatives are any different. They see what\u2019s happening to us, (Voice rises) and they know you\u2019re over here. If they weren\u2019t approving of you suffering, if they weren\u2019t approving of it, they\u2019d stand up and scream<\/em>.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> Right. (Applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Peace. They\u2019re not helpless. They\u2019re not helpless. At least they can scream. They may not be able to move newspapers, but at least they can scream. (pause) Well, I don\u2019t know how I got into all that. I presume it needed to be said. Are you willing to be hated? The organization\u2019s not moving as effectively as it ought to. (unintelligible sentence) Not moving as effectively as it ought to. By no<\/em> means is it moving effectively as it ought to. (Pause) This has some merit, and I\u2019d like for you to consider it. An executive authority. Who should be the chief administrative officer? We do not like the term \u201ccoordinators.\u201d It doesn\u2019t uh, mean enough responsibility. It connotes responsibility but not authority, and not enough of a\u2013 uh, either one. The person chosen should have as many of the following qualities as possible: fairly young, and in reasonably good health, with lots of stamina<\/em>, because the job will be taxing. Two, accustomed to think of the socialist movement or organization as a whole, rather than of one department, no matter how vital that one department may be in their own (unintelligible word, sounds like \u201ctalented\u201d), their preferences. Three, proven in heavy responsi\u2013 proven in heavy responsibility. They\u2019ve gone through the test<\/em> of heavy responsibility. Frugal<\/em>. That means saving, penny-pinching, as I\u2019ve been, since I was a child, to give you opportunity, for some of you to throw away our cups so we can\u2019t have enough punch, and throw away our plates so we don\u2019t know whether we\u2019re gonna feed you every night. That\u2019s a fuckin\u2019 mess I went through. Sometimes my heart aches. I know why I can cry for those people in Roots<\/em>, and it isn\u2019t beyond your capacity to cry. For yourself, yes, you should subdue it. But when you look at that, and you hear those people, which Kitler [Kunta Kinte] died, he said he\u2019s free at last. Uh, oh how\u2013 how\u2013 how I envied uh, what that old man had had happen to him, because I\u2019ve been a slave all my life. I\u2019ve been a slave. Nothing they coulda done to me in that picture\u2013 That may sound hard for you to deal with, but nothing I saw in that picture is as horrible as what I\u2019ve had to be. To feel, for a thousand people, and then when you learn how to feel, to worry about them night and day, to have Bobby Stroud for two and a half hour\u2013 two and a half hours or so last night \u2013 two hours \u2013 to have to worry, is he gonna be all right in that terrible tragedy that happened to him, when he hit\u2013\u00a0thrown off the truck right on top of his head. That\u2019s a hellish, hellish situation. Yes, I know, I know, it\u2013 there\u2019s nothing wrong with it, the arm that was uh, said to be broken is not broken now. Only keeping him in hospital just to be safe for observation, because he doesn\u2019t even have a headache.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> (Scattered applause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> But yesterday\u2013 but yesterday, he was unconscious, and he grabbed his neck before he went into that semi-consciousness and \u2013 you may be seated \u2013\u00a0he\u2013 he was unconscious. Delirious<\/em>. And to worry about people, to constantly have that fear and\u2013 for your people, and your love for them, and watch them come by and wonder about this<\/em> child being a little underweight or that<\/em> child may need this or that or the other thing. Seeing the socks not matching, and seeing some parents give more concern than others. My heart breaks so many times every day that I can barely stand to see the light of day. It has not been my plan to avoid the sun, but just nature calls, the duty of that radio\u2019s taken me all night into the morning, but there\u2019d been one advantage in the last two days I\u2019ve had to be around this place, and (stumbles over words) I see so much. It pains you. On top of us being up all night and dealing with it on that radio, to have to see so much.<\/p>\n

Oh, it\u2019s a perfect society compared to other US societies, but it is not my idea of what I wanted. Neither did I have any idea that we were going to be faced with 55 million dollar suits, nor did I\u2013 but could I possibly know when you\u2019re good, the unlimited potential for evil that some people have. It\u2019s an unlimited potential. When people can set up that mess, and appeal to white hate out of a vendetta to get Jim Jones, I\u2013\u00a0I\u2013 I ca\u2013 I can\u2019t understand this.<\/p>\n

(Weary tone) So I died on May 13, totally. And you better hear it this time, \u2018cause I want to see if you hear it, \u2018cause remember what I told you about tonight. I died on May 13. Up until that time, I\u2013 I thought my goodness surely could be communicated if you were close range with me, you couldn\u2019t help but see it. But on May 13, I died. Because a woman [Debbie Layton Blakey]\u2013\u00a0because I refused her sexually<\/em>, tried to cause<\/em> me purposeful pain, no doubt, by leaving on my birthday. \u2018Cause I don\u2019t believe that there\u2019s some God up there, or some devil, doing it. It\u2019s humans. She chose my birthday to bring all that hell. That was significant. That taught me a very good lesson. Here\u2019s somebody I\u2019d given to, I\u2013 I saved her from drugs, debauchery. I met her in an hour of need when I was under such pressure, I don\u2019t know how I ever did it, till my joints would not hardly get me up and down the steps. I was a good friend, a trusting comrade, and she never saw unprincipled behavior, other than just a human\u2013\u00a0human characteristic of being irritated, and then<\/em> I always explained \u2013 and it\u2019s always<\/em> associated with insulin \u2013 I always explained that uh, when it passes, you can tell, and the sweat stops and the palpitations stop, then the calmness comes. And I don\u2019t have much of that anymore. And I don\u2019t know what\u2019s happened. Maybe it helped to die on December [May] 13, I don\u2019t know. Because I don\u2019t have as many attacks. (Pause) (tape edit) I may not feel good, but I\u2019m glad for one thing, I don\u2019t have as many attacks. Not because of relief, but because it\u2019s uh, handicaps your administration. But on May 13, I died, because at that point I gave up that you could communicate goodness. I don\u2019t know whether any<\/em> of you are ever gonna understand me, and I don\u2019t know whether it\u2019ll ever be possible<\/em> for anybody to get the good that I have, or the good that others have here, and<\/em> take that good and put it in yourself. And you<\/em> that are good\u2013 and uh, and I use that conservatively, carefully\u2013 I mean, where we know we\u2019re going to give of ourselves, no matter what we feel inside, that we will give, we will push, that we will not neglect our duties. The\u2013\u00a0As much as I hate that radio, I demand, no matter whether I\u2019m here, and I can\u2019t even enjoy TV because I have to interpret it, \u2018cause people won\u2019t sensitize, they won\u2019t feel. You got to constantly bolt in and give new ideas about the movie, or point out propaganda, but I let the radio people come and go. I never leave them\u2013 leave them with that shit alone. And I force myself in there, the sounds of that things are so full (electronic distortion for several words) (Silence)<\/p>\n

\u2013in your world, your child, your little games, whatever you\u2019re doing, sidetracking your thoughts. Then you wouldn\u2019t feel so bad about what your lot is. Billions have gone before you, suffered so far more than you, that you have no reason to complain. No reason to complain. But some of you are gonna have to learn that, \u2018cause I\u2019m not gonna live the rest of my life pointing a gun at people to make them work. I do not want guns in our midst to force us to work. That is not my life. I cannot live it any longer. I have lived being an authoritarian all my days. When I was a gentle, understanding father, and I do not want to have to go up and down these roadways, personally<\/em>, policing this place. If there\u2019s not enough goodness in us to come to the duty, if there\u2019s not enough principle in you that\u2019re around me, to come to duty, this not\u2013 still not over that P.A. system, (Pause) there\u2019re people that need to hear, they\u2019re always gone<\/em>. (Pause) If people\u2013\u00a0and you tell everybody that\u2019s not here or working, you tell them all what I said. Your roommate, your companion, be he male or female, or several. (Pause) If people can continue to practice their elitism, if they can continue to take special privileges, not to assume certain work responsibilities, not to clock themselves in like others\u2013 and others have the nerve, who are younger, and they\u2019re younger<\/em> than me, and they expect that when I can\u2019t take the radio any longer, they<\/em> automatically have the right to leave the radio.<\/p>\n

I\u2019ve been in this struggle since I was a teenager. Ever since I was a child, I\u2019ve been carrying somebody else\u2019s problems, and it puts one hell of a weight on me, so when I have to leave, when my health can take no more that I have to do something else, I have to diversify because I have a blood pressure problem that gets out of hand, that people will automatically wait<\/em> for me to make a move so they can make their move. And some won\u2019t even go through the pretenses<\/em> anymore of giving the appearance of work. They\u2013 (tape fallout for several seconds) \u2013ever they want to do, take special privilege, get special foods, yes<\/em>, down to little things. Little things. Let other people work, let other people dictate while they read a newspaper or a book, whatever they want to do, go out and walk or stroll. Um-hmm.<\/p>\n

Gets down to a lotta little things that some of you people have. You take fans in your home, use your fan, particularly of\u00a0 yourself and thinking nobody else. That\u2019s why I\u2019ve got a fan that for the most part doesn\u2019t work, but I don\u2019t feel good about it. \u2018Cause some in\u2013 the most<\/em> part, I think\u00a0 I turned that big fan on today, just briefly, because I was sweating so badly at midday, giving the news. And that\u2019s the first time it\u2019s been on in weeks. I just as soon it was gone, out, but we need it for guests, because I have to give up my place when guests come. To be used by someone else.<\/p>\n

I don\u2019t like using anything that other people don\u2019t have. And there some, that doesn\u2019t bother you at all. And the way you can avoid it not bothering you, I guess, is to seal yourself off from other people\u2019s suffering. Walk through the geriatric section where senior, ninety-some years of age, don\u2019t have a fan. (Pause) So. Ninety-year-olds that stood on a street corner, and fed you. They held a little cup in their hand, and had people go by and insult them. Spit on them. Held that little cup out there so you could get your food and your clothing, and you could be protected and have a lawyer and could get your education, and some of you don\u2019t give a goddamn. You go around, right in front of \u2018em, run by them and nearly knock them over, I saw today. Children don\u2019t even give a shit, don\u2019t give a shit. Throw down peelings in front of them, these fruit, and let a senior reach over and pick it\u2013 as I saw today, 80-some years of age, picking up your peelings. I\u2019ve had it. If people can\u2019t be appealed to in goodness, then somebody else has got to take on this executive administrative role, I cannot be in this role anymore. I can\u2019t be in it. It\u2019ll kill<\/em> me. I would like to think that some people could respond to goodness, I can\u2019t for the life of me understand why people can\u2019t respond to goodness. But I made a commitment, when I died on my birthday, May 13, that<\/em> if nobody<\/em> ever understood me, if nobody ever copied me, I\u2019d long ago given up the idea than anybody would care for me, but if nobody understood me, I said, if three billion<\/em> people go against communism in this goddamn world, one Jim Jones will not. I\u2019ll be a communist, because communist is\u2013 communism is right. I cannot morally live in a world where two out of three babies go to bed hungry, and that\u2019s always<\/em> an abstraction to you people, so many of you, you\u2019d never deal with a hungry baby.<\/p>\n

I looked today at a cat, I was sitting there grading papers and reading a manuscript, and I looked at the cat, and there was a hundred other people in this auditorium, but nobody saw that cat. The little cat was digging here, tryin\u2019 to find anything, a bug, and I wondered how in Jonestown a cat could be so poor as this. Why wouldn\u2019t somebody think of that little cat, and give it\u2013 uh, that cat would\u2019ve loved the gravy and the rice if you\u2019da fed it. And you get plenty of that. Nobody\u2019s restricted how much food\u2013 I know, I sent the cat to you. That why you\u2013 that\u2019s why uh, I knew it would be taken care of, I sent it uh, by Jim Arthur [Jones] to\u2013 but the little\u2013 this little kitten is not where it ought to be. And everybody here oughta be concerned now, about every child that looks underweight. I\u2019ll go by and I\u2019ll say, that teen looks like he\u2019s losing weight, or that girl looks like she\u2019s losing weight. It bothers<\/em> me, it pains<\/em> me, why are we not our neighbor\u2019s keeper. We oughta all<\/em> be concerned now, uh\u2013\u00a0What do we have\u2013\u00a0what kinds of greens did we have tonight?<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> (unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Well, then, uh, if we got eddo\u2013 have we got eddo greens enough to get us through? Eddo greens. Those were delicious. I could eat them every night.<\/p>\n

Male in crowd:<\/strong> (unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> What\u2019s that?<\/p>\n

Male in crowd:<\/strong> (unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Well, then, now, I see. Well, I want to see uh\u2013 I\u2013 I don\u2019t pay much attention to food. (Reads) Food available for the six\u2013\u00a0the next six weeks back of the apartments, eddoes. Field 11 has six acres of uh, volunteers, young, uh, and can supply greens. Three banana and eddo fields, two acres. One half acre in West Garden. R-1 and L-1, one acre. New garden, five acres. Some in windrows. Some in the front of the nursery building, mostly volunteers. I\u2019ve seen some okra falling off of the\u2013 the okra got big enough back over there on my one\u2013 one route to the East House that uh, I don\u2019t\u2013 I don\u2019t understand why we let food just drop before our eyes. Sweet potatoes, five to eight acres that needs weeding. Five acres, starleaf. Well, what did\u2013\u00a0how\u2013 how\u2013 are we going to be able to have greens, is what I\u2019m asking. Are we\u2013 (electronic bursts of distortion, tape silence for several moments) (Reads) \u2013try to buy vegetables which we can\u2019t afford. We\u2019re gonna have to buy things that we could turn to greens. You\u2019re gonna have to give us some idea. Rheaviana [Beam] and her will have to be given some idea, because we got fruits, we got to be sure\u2013 we got to be sure that people get enough vegetables.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> (unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Well, she\u2019s coming over there. (Reads) Storage in the drums is critical to us. Need to get more drums for storage and see about the valves and seals and adhesive. Have replacement order in the States now, should maybe order much more valves, seals \u2013 I would think so \u2013 and adhesive. We can perhaps get the drums here, but the valves and seals are very hard to locate, and were after many tests and failures that we succeeded. Need to find out if the government will let us impo\u2013 import any beans from the States for table consumption. (Pause) Not likely, since they want us growing them and have this mass program underway. (Conversational tone) I\u2019m not sure. You could order them in some barrels, I\u2013 I don\u2019t know whether beans, uh\u2013\u00a0how much is he\u2013 Gonna pay a price ordering food from out of this country, though. (Tsks) Your price on beans, anything\u2019s gonna be much<\/em> higher abroad than here. (Pause) I can\u2019t think of anything<\/em> we could uh, hardly make it worthwhile. (Pause) In food. Is there anything at all in food?<\/p>\n

Male:<\/strong> I couldn\u2019t tell you about that, Dad, but I was going back to tell you about the green situation. Within about six weeks, we should be able to have greens, wherever we want them, every day, we could, as to\u2013 as according to the weather, and it\u2019s getting better, looks like.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Greens every day in six weeks, then we won\u2019t suffer, will we, doctor. (Pause) (Reads) Summary analysts feel that the problems were uh, ignorance on part of planters, weather and poor management. At this stage, agreed we are not yet communist and need a strong person at the helm of the farm that will take firm lead. (Conversational tone) That\u2019s another person, I guess, that\u2019s\u2013 The committee\u2019s report, analyst report.<\/p>\n

All right. Now let\u2019s go on with the criteria for the (unintelligible word under electronic pulse) director. Shift, please. (Pause) Proven in heavy responsibilities, frugal, that\u2019ll be willing to save like Dad has. A high level of personality stability \u2013 you may be seated \u2013\u00a0with little emotionalism and little personal or selfish motives. This should be written up as goals for all<\/em> of us, but that should be in front of every coordinator, these should be put in their writing and put on the walls. A high level of consistence. Proven loyalty to\u2013 to the socialist leader and to socialist principles and practices. Proven administrative capability with a high level of follow-through. That\u2019s our biggest weakness here, is follow-through. A capacity and reputation for being hard-working\u2013 A capacity and reputation for being hard<\/em>-working, who won\u2019t get sidetracked by sex or any other diversion. (Pause) who\u2019ll put the responsibility and welfare of the people, as I have, knowing that people\u2019re not enlightened to take the same load that you ha\u2013 you will take. Uh\u2013 Not being irritated that some will persist forever, it seems, to set in a movie and not come to work, have to be called, as I hear one name called every night, makes me so sick, I hear that woman [Marcia Ann Simon?] every night called to her duties. (Pause) You disgrace the m\u2013\u00a0name of your mother. To hear Marcy called every night, damn near every night, Marcy, go to work. You got the name of your mother. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Male 2:<\/strong> That\u2019s\u2013 that\u2019s partly my fault, \u2018cause the time was mixed up between the coordinator and dispatch, and they were calling her too early.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Fine. Thank you. I knew it used to be a pattern, I\u2019m glad to her it isn\u2019t still.<\/p>\n

Male 2:<\/strong> (unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Not\u2013\u00a0not now? Yes, that\u2019s good. The capac\u2013\u00a0The capacity and reputation for being hard<\/em>-working. Not depending on whether somebody else is setting around in a movie or reading a novel and won\u2019t work (pause) or goofing off, with their fingers up their ass, talking out in open day when they could be producing. Historically, n\u2013 now\u2013 Now or historically meshed in any faction<\/em> or power group which may now exist and which might\u2013\u00a0or might have existed or would be possible to come into existence. A person who is obviously<\/em> loyal to the leader, because you can obviously know the leader will dismiss himself, you\u2019ll never have to dismiss him. If there was a strong leader in my place now, I would bargain with these people in the United States and give them myself for the guarantees that no more persecution \u2013 yes \u2013 no more suits and drop the suits that they now have. And I\u2019d let them do exactly<\/em> with me what they wanted to do. Reasoned judgment and the ability to receive input well from others, to take criticism well from others, but<\/em> still be able to g\u2013 make a decision, you have to be proven wrong and go ahead. There\u2019s too much democracy now, it would bog down in everybody\u2019s opinion, and we don\u2019t get anything done. That\u2019s overburdening democracy.<\/p>\n

Please don\u2019t be battling bugs. There\u2019s not a bug here that\u2019ll bite you in the nighttime. Little mosquito, and you won\u2019t see him. (Pause) The bigger the ones, the better. Don\u2019t worry about them. they will not bite you.<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd:<\/strong> (unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Reasoned judgment, as I said, and the ability to receive input well from others, the ability to give instructions without the appearance of being on a power<\/em> trip. That\u2019s important too. Such a person should have the respect of the whole community or at least of its leadership. A reasonable level of experience working closely with youth so as to be familiar with your thought and the ways that you handle things. A concern for people without any personal involvement in any person or group. The ability to be disliked without being repressed by it. The person should not be out front with the people nor heavily committed to counseling programs or responsibility. One safeguard in leadership is the development of the administrative head as separate from the popular<\/em> head. That is, clearly such a person should have a good foundation in Marxist-Leninism. These qualities are not expressed in any particular order of importance. Now we have to come down to the decisions of those who you feel qualified. (Pause) We\u2019re started down the analysts, who you\u2013\u00a0who do you think is qualified for this job? (Pause) Yeah.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/strong> (unintelligible) (tape edit)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> What? Couldn\u2019t get any males in the\u2013 in the party, so wh\u2013 the white women had to go out and get black men, and fuck \u2018em into the party. And that was principle<\/em>. If you don\u2019t understand that as principle, you don\u2019t know anything about revolution. Sit down. We got some of the best\u2013 some of the best black leadership today, the black h\u2013 head of the Communist Party was fucked<\/em> in, he was fucked<\/em> in by a white woman, who chose to give her body\u2013 and that\u2019s what Paul<\/em> said. You should\u2013 you should give your body as what? That was\u2013\u00a0that was a\u2013 that was a socialism remote to some of our present day communists<\/em>. He said you should present your whole<\/em> body as a living sacrifice, wholly and acceptable to your<\/em> God. And what is your God? Communism. Then you should give your vagina<\/em>, your penis<\/em>, or your asshole<\/em>, if it\u2019s called for\u2013<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> And if you can\u2019t, you\u2019re not a dedicated communist.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> You should be willing to fuck<\/em> anybody, whatever you had to do with, suck \u2018em or whatever.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> And I mean, if it would save your people or get a revolutionary achievement, if it\u2019d save someone\u2019s life or build this movement, you should do whatever your ass to do. Is that not right?<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> (Stronger) Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> I saw too few amens of that down here in this front section. What the fuck\u2019s the matter down here? I\u2019m not talking about young people. I\u2019m\u2013 I\u2019m getting nervous \u2018bout some of you older people, you don\u2019t get with this<\/em> shit. (Pause) Don\u2019t act like\u2013 You say, I don\u2019t\u2013 I don\u2019t know why they do that. Hell\u2013 Hell, you forgot your sex feeling 25 years ago. You ain\u2019t felt<\/em> nothing. So how would you know whether you\u2019re attracted to anything. Sit down.<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/strong> (Stirs)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> And don\u2019t think these are the only two, male or female. So don\u2019t think the on\u2013 the only two, and they were all for a purpose, to bring them to a higher order, because I don\u2019t know how to selfishly use anybody. I wouldn\u2019t know how to do that. I couldn\u2019t<\/em> do that. I\u2019ve always seen my ro\u2013 self in a role of giving. If I receive<\/em> anything, it won\u2019t be long, because the giving will be outweighing the receiving. \u2018Cause that\u2019s me. And you mess with me, that\u2019s the way you\u2019re gonna get. \u2018Cause I always gotta give. I take on more worries about you than you\u2019ll ever take on about me or anybody else. I hope that changes. And it can<\/em> change. But that\u2019s why the\u2013 life is hell for me, because you don\u2019t get<\/em> anything, you have to pay, you have to pay, you have to give, you have to give, if you\u2019re a communist. \u2018Cause you never can give enough. He never meets all the needs. All right. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Female 2:<\/strong> Uh, I know you don\u2019t like being scheduled, you know (unintelligible word)\u2013<\/p>\n

(tape edit)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Some sensitize in your guilt, talk to someone you like, someone who likes you, whoever that is, uh, Karen, I guess, uh, and you have been talking. Yes. Have you not? Okay. Whatever. You uh\u2013 you\u2013\u00a0You uh\u2013 You need to see a film that sensitize you?<\/p>\n

Male 3:<\/strong> That\u2019s true.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> You need to\u2013 If you need to do something, then you talk to us. But don\u2019t you take it upon yourself to break out of that schedule that all of us are in.<\/p>\n

Male 3:<\/strong> Yes, Dad. I realize that\u2013<\/p>\n

(tape edit)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Timed in. Clocked in. Pulled in. You\u2019re vital to the whole program. And uh, what is life, you know? What is life? Let\u2019s not let people down.<\/p>\n

Male 3:<\/strong> I won\u2019t.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> It\u2019s a day-by-day occasion. The least we can do is to stand by each other. That\u2019s the most fulfilling thing we can do.<\/p>\n

Male 3:<\/strong> I\u2019ll stick by it to the minute.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> I don\u2019t\u2013 (tape edit) \u2013willingness to commit themselves with the unknowns of the future. \u2018Cause for so many years, I have not known one day to the next, what\u2013\u00a0what was coming, for me or the people I love. Now the horrible part is that it has grown, not<\/em> from just a family of an ordinary size of the children I adopted, or the natural born that I have [John Victor Stoen], and I know have\u2013 I don\u2019t have one of them, only by the day. You know how it is to feel to have a child by the day, because if the countdown comes, I have not made up my mind what I would do. And Debbie would say I\u2019d put a whole organization at stake. And I have that, not<\/em> knowing from one<\/em> day to the next. Now I have a thousand<\/em> children, a thousand to worry about. (Pause) And uh, I know what I would do if it was your<\/em> child. But I hope the test doesn\u2019t come over my<\/em> child. And I\u2019m sure it probably will. Because life has always dealt me the worst possible blows. I\u2019d have no trouble putting this whole organization on a\u2013\u00a0on the\u2013\u00a0on a\u2013 on the line, for anybody\u2019s else child. But the press has so abused and distorted, and Debbie \u2013 the audacity of her \u2013 saying that I only threatened to die over my<\/em> child. She later changed<\/em> it, but not in the UPI. Then it was later that anyone that attacked us, we would die. But no communism was mentioned in the UPI, no socialism, nothing, it\u2019s gross. She planned<\/em> it that way, the one that had the biggest coverage \u2013 The Press-Democrat<\/em> \u2013 then she talked about my communism, then she mentioned vegetables and other foods, but it was rice<\/em>. All we eat is rice. Gross kinda shit. Beat old women. Outrageous shit. Bury people alive. (Pause) So now if the\u2013 the trial ever came, I don\u2019t know what I can do. I don\u2019t know what I will<\/em> do. I\u2019m not saying I\u2019ll give up, and I say you better develop some leadership, I\u2019m saying you people better develop some leadership, but for 47 years, I\u2019ve sacrificed sacrificed sacrificed sacrificed. When it comes to my child<\/em>, I will not make a decision, for you to\u2013 if it ever came again. If there\u2019s any question about it ever rises again. Say, well, do you think it will? I don\u2019t know.<\/p>\n

(Weary tone) I don\u2019t know anything but the fact that everybody dies. We uh\u2013\u00a0Used to be, you say, everybody paid taxes, but we don\u2019t have to do that anymore, but everybody has to die. It can be prolonged, and I have, it\u2019s uh, can be resurrected, and I have, but everybody has to go through pain and suffering and death. So why not make it for a revolutionary purpose, a beautiful goal, something that makes us above the animals, \u2018cause there\u2019s no way around the suffering. And the only thing that can make your life uh, feel a bit noble<\/em> is that you found the best idea and stand by it bravely through all<\/em> the stormy weather. And communism, sharing, if it is unobtainable<\/em>, is the right\u2013 the only right way to live. That no other moral consideration with two babies going to bed hungry tonight while we\u2019re sitting in here. Hungry<\/em>. They\u2019d be glad to get anything. Rice. They\u2019d be glad to get a double portion of rice. They\u2019d be glad to get a tea\u2013\u00a0teaspoon<\/em> full of rice. (More animated) But they\u2019re starving<\/em> while some of you set out there, not identifying with this doctor while he has to search himself for his elitism, but tomorrow, if you were to go, we\u2019ll have to take you out of your shell and look at you on the searchlight, right up on the stage, we\u2019ll have to put the spotlight on you, because you never<\/em> can identify with somebody\u2019s else\u2019s problem. You never<\/em> learn anything indirectly or vicariously, it\u2019s all you gotta drag<\/em> your ass out and put you here. But you are doubly worse than this doctor tonight. The vast majority of this organization is doubly<\/em> worse than this doctor.<\/p>\n

End of side 1<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

Side 2<\/strong><\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> (Calls out) I want you to know that. Anything I said to him, I could say it doubly<\/em> to you.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> (Quiet) That doesn\u2019t make him right in any his elitism. But you have sucked<\/em> and you have drained<\/em> and you\u2019ve been inconsiderate<\/em>. Oh, yes, you have.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> So don\u2019t\u2013 don\u2019t exclude yourself and try to learn from what he\u2019s going through. You don\u2019t work, you don\u2019t schedule, I went out\u2013 I haven\u2019t cried in a long while, I went out and looked in the east field, and I saw a group of workers out there, and I wept. I watched them for 15 minutes, and I wept. I said, they don\u2019t give a fuck. Just kickin\u2019 dirt, throwing things, they didn\u2019t give a fuck. And I wept. If I ever understood anything about anxiety and hurt, I wept. A proverb come to me, Oh Jerusalem, Jerusalem, how oft I\u2019da gathered you under my wings like a hen doth her brood, and you would not. How much I try to protect you, how much I try to build, but if you don\u2019t help yourself, there\u2019s nothing I can do. To think that I\u2019d given, all the years and the sweat, and all the painful sacrifice facing, maybe having to give up my child or committing suicide with my child, because I\u2019ll never have you commit suicide over my child. But I\u2019m not<\/em> going to promise you that I\u2019ll send him back. I will not<\/em> do that.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> I\u2019ve\u2013 I\u2019ve gone a long way, and I\u2019m entitled to some peace.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> I\u2019m entitled to some peace, and I will not give\u2013\u00a0I will not commit murder. I don\u2019t have the right to commit anybody else, but I do<\/em> have the right to see that my<\/em> child is not murdered.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> You say, do you expect that to happen? I don\u2019t know what<\/em> to expect. The great big Yankee giant, nuclear war comes first, I think, there\u2019re no problems. The economy begins to teeter and totter, there\u2019s no problem. But I know this is a small<\/em> nation, and Yankee imperialism has a great weight. And I know the court case has not been resolved, and it\u2019s been six months, and I\u2019m still sitting here with it not resolved. And there may be all sorts of diplomatic reasons for them not doing it, but if they\u2019re forced to have to do diplomatic things by putting it off and putting it off and putting it off, I say what\u2013 in the back of my mind, what kind of option are they really weighing? Sometime they may have<\/em> to do something, so they don\u2019t want to make a final decision. But I can warn them this\u2013\u00a0and I think you should raise a lot of hell, because if it happens<\/em>, if this court system does not respond to its government, or doesn\u2019t behave<\/em> somewhat independently as it should (unintelligible word, either \u201cnot\u201d or \u201cnow\u201d) in this socialist setting, uh, you gonna have to make a lot of hell. If anybody ever come to get me, you\u2019re gonna have to raise a lotta hell, you\u2019re gonna have to raise a lotta hell.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> If anybody comes to get one of \u2018em\u2013 I\u2019ll tell you why. I\u2019ll tell you why. Because your life, I\u2019m afraid at this stage, would be finished.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> So if they come for John, you better raise a lotta hell.<\/p>\n

Voices in crowd:<\/strong> (More forceful) Right. (Applause, some ululation)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/strong> Peace. Peace. Peace. Peace. Peace. If there anybody else they come for\u2013\u00a0don\u2019t forget, don\u2019t forget, anybody else they come for\u2013 you may be seated. The last three people or four people who were arrested, they were none of them\u2013\u00a0one of them\u2013\u00a0not one of them a relative of mine. Other than (word garbled with mangled tape, FBI summary says \u201c[my] adopted\u201d)<\/p>\n

End of tape<\/strong><\/p>\n

Tape originally posted June 2012<\/b><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Transcript prepared by Fielding M. McGehee III. If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you. To return to the Tape Index, click here. To read the Tape Summary, click here. Listen to MP3 (Pt. 1, Pt. 2). Jones: And every time somebody fixes something special for me, everybody takes the right […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":6,"featured_media":0,"parent":27291,"menu_order":134,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"footnotes":""},"class_list":["post-27406","page","type-page","status-publish","hentry"],"acf":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27406","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/page"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/6"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=27406"}],"version-history":[{"count":5,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27406\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":60047,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27406\/revisions\/60047"}],"up":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27291"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=27406"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}