{"id":27597,"date":"2013-06-16T00:21:15","date_gmt":"2013-06-16T00:21:15","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/alternativejonestown.com\/?page_id=27597"},"modified":"2024-07-17T14:36:18","modified_gmt":"2024-07-17T21:36:18","slug":"q807","status":"publish","type":"page","link":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/?page_id=27597","title":{"rendered":"Q807 Transcript"},"content":{"rendered":"

Transcript prepared by Fielding M. McGehee III. If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you.<\/strong><\/i><\/p>\n

To return to the Tape Index, click here<\/a>. Listen to MP3 (Pt. 1<\/a>, Pt. 2<\/a>).
\nTo read the Tape Summary, click here<\/a>.<\/p>\n

Jim Jones Jr.:<\/b>\u00a0(unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Music<\/strong><\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014 are not<\/i> carrying. (Pause) There are some voices that carry<\/i>. And we all know who those voices are. But there are some back here that (unintelligible) mumble and you can’t hear. Most people\u2014 most<\/i> people you can\u2019t hear. The best they can do is to go to microphone. Reb [James Edwards] has a voice, you have a c\u2014 a loud voice, I don\u2019t know, there\u2019s a few more, I hear them, but uh, most<\/i> of you think you have a voice that carries without a microphone. It does not carry. (Pause) (Mumbles under breath).<\/p>\n

Dee Dee Lawrence<\/b>:<\/b> I had\u2014\u00a0I had ate\u2014 I had ate some, too, Dad.<\/div>\n
<\/div>\n

Jones:<\/b> What\u2019s this?<\/p>\n

Dee Dee:<\/b> I ate some too.<\/p>\n

Male in crowd:<\/b> How much? How many?<\/p>\n

Dee Dee:<\/b> It was\u2014 it was about\u2014 it was about four\u2014 John\u2014 somebody gave me some\u2014<\/p>\n

Marthea Hicks:<\/b> Excuse me, and Dee Dee, when I confronted you about you sitting there eating<\/i> whilst the other children wasn\u2019t eating<\/i> anything, you<\/i> said well, I\u2019m not the only<\/i> one to eat \u2018em. Other peoples are eating \u2018em too. I think you should name those other peoples also.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Lois Ponts, would you come back to the back, so that Marceline can see you? Medical matter. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Jack Beam:<\/b> Who gave it to you, sister?<\/p>\n

Dee Dee:<\/b> Uh\u2014 John Gardener. That\u2019s all.<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> Where is Mister Gardener?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s what I don\u2019t like, that one of these people that just hold back. (Pause) These people that don\u2019t<\/i> come up. (Pause) John Gardener give \u2018em to you.<\/p>\n

Jim Jones Jr:<\/b>\u00a0Stutters, unintelligible<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I\u2019m a sonofabitch. (Pause) All you people get drug out of here now, one by one, you\u2019re gonna get drug out, you think you\u2019re going get your ass covered, but you won\u2019t. And you\u2019re going be in lots of trouble, I\u2019m getting\u2014 I\u2019m getting more pissed<\/i> by this.<\/p>\n

Jim Jones Jr:<\/b> (fades into mike) \u2014something about John Gardener. Um, he\u2013 he\u2013 he\u2013 he knew he was there, (stutters) he was telling us about them, but what I\u2019m saying, (stutters) he didn\u2018t get them. (stutters) We went up and got them, okay. You know, I mean, I hopped up on the trailer, I was the first one\u2014 (stutters) the first one up there, okay? You know what I\u2019m saying, he<\/i> didn\u2019t get \u2018em.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Resigned) You don\u2019t know what you put\u2014 pull down on the image of that uniform. (Pause) You have no idea how many people are going to use this. (Pause) You don\u2019t have any idea. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Man:<\/b> I want to ask Poncho and Greg\u2013 Greg Watkins. When y\u2019all, when\u2014 when you went inside the tangerines, how many tangerines was in it? Was it a big bag, a big box, or just some laying, or what?<\/p>\n

Poncho:<\/b> When\u2014 when I saw the bag, Dad, it was laying\u2014 laying down on the trailer, and it was\u2014 looked to me like it was about halfway full, and I\u2014 all\u2014 all I can say that, you know, um\u2014 (Pause) I\u2014 I know\u2014\u00a0I know that (stutters) if\u2014<\/p>\n

Voices cry from audience, unintelligible.<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd:<\/strong> It was halfway full.<\/p>\n

Poncho:<\/b> It was halfway full, what I\u2019m saying is that is\u2014 I know there\u2019s nothing I can say that\u2019ll make Dad stop\u2014 not wanting to go on this, this fast, because\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Nothing in the world can stop it.<\/p>\n

Poncho:<\/b> \u2014and I\u2014 like I feel really guilty because I know like I\u2014 I took more than my share of special privilege, I been taking and\u2014 taking and, you know, and, um, I really feel bad that (stutters) you\u2019d have to take there because it\u2019s the chance of your life, Dad, and\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I doubt that. I wouldn\u2019t do that to the collective. But it isn\u2019t\u2014\u00a0it isn\u2019t going to make me the best<\/i> with all the strain I\u2019ve got on me.<\/p>\n

Tinetra Fain:<\/b> Poncho, I\u2019d like to say to you, as fat as you are, it gave you no<\/i> right to take 12 oranges. There\u2019s people here that pregnant that needs those, there\u2019s people here on special diets, and your fucking ass don\u2019t need \u2018em. You<\/i> the one that needs to go eat\u2014 go without eating for two days.<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> There is\u2014\u00a0There is indeed a point of the\u2014 (struggles for words) There are mothers you could curse to death, their babies to death by this business, or that are under control diets. They didn\u2019t have them in the States. Still, it\u2019s better. We\u2019ve not yet, ever, faced the insufficiencies in diet, our mothers have all done well, our babies have been born, I\u2019ll not tell you a lie to manipulate guilt, they\u2019ve had the best health care, we get supplement vitamins, but when you do this, that means we have to put in expensive<\/i> vitamins that come all across the ocean at horrible<\/i> prices, and this one (unintelligible word) not going to be able to be. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Tinetra:<\/b> Don\u2019t hand Dad no bullshit, either.<\/p>\n

Poncho:<\/b> I\u2019m not, I\u2019m not, um\u2014 (stutters) I didn\u2019t mean to, uh, I didn\u2019t really know what was happening and like, what I was trying to say is that\u2014<\/p>\n

Man in crowd argues (possibly Lee Ingram), Jones talks over: \u2014 You better not say anything<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I don\u2019t\u2014 I don\u2019t want to debate this, all over. Did he\u2014 he\u2014\u00a0Did Gardener just tell you where they were? What\u2019d you tell him, Gardener? I still<\/i> think he\u2019s responsible.<\/p>\n

Gardener:<\/b> (Struggles for words) I just told him, they was\u2014\u00a0they was\u2014\u00a0that they was on the\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Why?<\/p>\n

Gardener:<\/b> Just\u2014\u00a0just to make myself look good.<\/p>\n

Someone whistles. Someone says Bullshit.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> To get yourself in good with all the people, and our pregnant mothers with little babies in them that could be born dead, one of them sometime. (Pause) (Unintelligible phrase) \u2014you don\u2019t realize the ramifications of this fruit situation. (Pause) We once had all the fruit up a week\u2014\u00a0up a\u2014\u00a0two weeks ago, we had all the fruit, it was coming out of our ears. Now we won\u2019t have<\/i> it. And\u2014 I told<\/i> you so. I told you how difficult it was. (Pause) It\u2019ll be difficult until the new harvest comes in. (Pause) (Unintelligible word) \u2014 wax out of your ears, you heard me.<\/p>\n

Male in crowd:<\/b> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Please radio Georgetown to see what they can do to pick up pineapples and that sort of thing. They ought to be doing<\/i> that this week, heavily. (Pause) Yes?<\/p>\n

Woan:<\/b> I wonder, why would you go and tell them that the fruit was on the truck anyway, and you know that if you\u2014 if you<\/i> were snitching the food, then you think somebody else might go into it too and wasn\u2019t thinking about the rest of our family here at\u2014\u00a0back here in home?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You see the ramifications of this all the way down the line. You<\/i> take fruit, more money has to pay\u2014 be paid out for vitamins, and that costly \u2014 multi-vitamins are terribly<\/i> costly \u2014\u00a0which we have to give daily by the\u2014 shows in their blood anemia or insufficiencies, that money<\/i> that you pay out means that uh, you\u2014 you\u2019ve got a sister that wants to come in two months. How would you feel if your sister didn\u2019t make it here?<\/p>\n

Calvin Douglas:<\/b> Um\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> How do you feel, somebody\u2019s<\/i> sister may not make it, because you\u2014 you guys screwed<\/i> up and took oranges, that mean we have to go and buy more<\/i> drugs which will mean there\u2019s less<\/i> money. The air\u2014 airplane fares going down down down, our fund is going down down down. We have to hide it, because we don\u2019t know what time the government will come down on us. (Pause) Can\u2019t even keep it in\u2014 in the banks. And it\u2019s going down down down down. What will\u2014 How will you people feel<\/i>\u2014 How do you people feel<\/i> about that? You\u2019ve had a chance here. How do you feel? How do you seriously feel<\/i> about somebody, some<\/i> person down the line is not going to be able to afford a ticket unless we get off our asses and quit stealing and start producing.<\/p>\n

Douglas:<\/b> All right, I\u2014\u00a0Dad\u2014\u00a0Dad, (stutters) I know me myself, I feel sorta bad that\u2014 that\u2014<\/p>\n

Crowd reacts derisively.<\/p>\n

Douglas:<\/b> I feel\u2014\u00a0I feel\u2014\u00a0I feel bad about it. I feel bad I took\u2014 I took the three that I took, and it\u2014 it seemed like I was\u2014\u00a0I was\u2014\u00a0I was worrying about my\u2014 I said, I was worrying about my own ass at that time, and\u2014 and I know I got a free place right now, and they\u2019re over there suffering, you know, trying\u2014\u00a0trying to get over here and stuff like that. I feel bad because I\u2014 I feel like I don\u2019t have to suffer no more and they over there\u2014 they still over there suffering and stuff like that, and so\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Your mother\u2019s<\/i> one of them, (Pause) who chose to stay back to help, and so, it\u2019s a\u2014\u00a0it\u2019s a, it\u2019s a heavy<\/i>, you got\u2014 you got to calculate<\/i> some place and weigh<\/i> your opinion. All<\/i> can\u2019t be done by fear, surely. Somebody\u2019s got to get moral. It isn\u2019t that you\u2019re bad people, done good things, but I\u2014 particularly perturbed with the night crew because you weren\u2019t<\/i> getting adequate diets, I know<\/i> that, then I took care of it in a very special way, and then you go and set an example like this. (Pause) You, all of you that\u2019re in my, in my security force. (Pause) People will use it for the next several weeks, because they love<\/i> to have an excuse. They love<\/i> to have an excuse to cut me down, and you gave them the ammunition. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Greg Watkins:<\/b> There\u2019s no excuse, I brung it on myself, uh, when I (clears throat) I took the grapefruit, and I have no feedbag, uh\u2013 It\u2019s my fault, and when\u2014 I wasn\u2019t following, I just ate it, for selfishness, that\u2019s all.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You know that people went to Georgetown did a good service and worked hard, and you had to do it, you were in that group, had to train hard, had to train when there was no lights, and put on a good performance, but even then<\/i> could you have not thought of all<\/i> the people? All the people that were in, uh\u2014\u00a0what about a Moms Mabley [likely Bertha Cook] that went on (unintelligible word) act, and broke a rib and stepped off that boat and kept on, and did a act that caused everybody to, uh, to be uh, thrilled (struggles for words) middle, and in their senior years. What\u2014 what\u2014 what is this? Where is the spirit of equality? At least<\/i> you\u2019ve could have distributed with some degree of fairness<\/i> amongst those that had had some hardships in Georgetown, \u2018cause it was<\/i> miserable in Georgetown. But you didn\u2019t do that<\/i>. You selected who<\/i> you were going to share it with. You picked out who<\/i>. Did you tell everybody, Gardener? Did you tell all the people who\u2019d been to Georgetown?<\/p>\n

Gardener:<\/b> No, Dad, I just\u2014 I just told some\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You picked your friends, the ones you wanted influence with, security, to cover your ass sometime.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> Dad, when they were loading on the trailer, they told \u2018em to take all the luggage and bags off of the trailer, and they threw the luggage off, but they did not take the fruit off, because they wanted to devour that, and he<\/i> was on that trailer at the time.<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> Who didn\u2019t you tell\u2014 tell your Mom about the oranges? Or me? We were sitting right there.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Your mother spent many of\u2014 a day of sacrifice, put a lot of money in this cause. He\u2014 There\u2019re some of these people that risked their lives. (Pause) (Taps mike) Is it to be youth against age<\/i>? (Pause) It wouldn\u2019t have been morally right to\u2014 for you people to decide (unintelligible) against us. Although you did have discomforts there. We don\u2019t have that right. If one takes the decision to distribute the food other than through me, you<\/i> one day may have somebody take your<\/i> food, because it can come back to you.<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> \u2018S very true, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And it will. (Pause) Thievery has to be one of the worst<\/i> crimes in a socialist community. If you don\u2019t feel the immorality of that, you\u2019ll have a fucking million people going through here. They\u2019ve stolen, they\u2019ve stolen everything\u2014 we went through a period, they stole everything, you have to watch it, you have to carry<\/i> it to keep it from being stolen. Some of you griped about your tape recorders? Shit, they\u2019da been gone, they\u2019da stole them right out under your nose. (Pause) They sure<\/i> stole them. They stole<\/i> \u2018em. And they can\u2019t play \u2018em? Dump \u2018em. Don\u2019t you realize that you wouldn\u2019t do that type of thing, but the\u2014 that very<\/i> immorality leads to some other sucker saying okay, hellsfire, I\u2019ll play the thing one time and throw it in the bushes. We\u2019ve found stuff ruined. (Pause) I know we\u2019ve<\/i> been conditioned in capitalism. (struggles for words) All I can do is set an example. And I\u2019m gonna tell you, when I don\u2019t have anything in my stomach, my ars\u2014 ulcer will give me a lot of pain, and that\u2019s about all I\u2019m going to suffer. Terrible pain. And I\u2019ve got enough<\/i> pain in my brain. Enough headaches from blood sugar. I don\u2019t need the pain in my stomach. And I will not have it. And I\u2019m gonna see what that<\/i> does, because I\u2019m sick and tired of having to see, knock bang crack\u2014 shit. If that has to be sometimes, that has to be. It can\u2019t be predictable, I realize, \u2018cause people take advantage. But uh\u2014 (Pause) What is it? (Pause) What\u2019s the problem?<\/p>\n

Man in crowd:<\/b> Thought you said shift.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Oh, well, shift if they want to shift. Shift. Shift.<\/p>\n

Marthea Hicks:<\/b> Dad, I think it\u2019s inexcusable because, when we were in Georgetown, Mother made it possible that everybody would have enough to eat. And these<\/i> people, like Poncho and uh, Dee Dee and Calvin were and\u2014 They were the ones that gave me the biggest problem. Dee Dee, she was always saying, he had some, I didn\u2019t\u2014 You know, I give her a cup of tea, she wanted in a big, you know, in a bowl. Everybody got the same amount of everything, a cup and a half, whether was in a bowl or a cup\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Mm-hmm.<\/p>\n

Hicks:<\/b> \u2014and Poncho, he was a big problem. He kept making nasty remarks about, I was trying to be, you know, revitalize my old ass, and all that, running around, trying to be young with my old ass. And he was saying all this\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And (unintelligible word) Marceline said you did a very good job of distributing\u2014<\/p>\n

Hicks:<\/b> Well, it was\u2014 it was enough food. They ate from 8 o\u2019clock that morning to 8 o\u2019clock that night. They had as much<\/i> to eat as they wanted to. They had peanut butter sandwiches, grilled cheese sandwiches, and plain cheese sandwiches, so, there was no<\/i> excuse for them eating anything after they got off of that boat.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Yes, they distributed and planned in all the boats so you would eat properly, as one should, and my\u2014 want done from now on, not to have empty stomachs when you take boat rides. It\u2019s very<\/i> stupid to eat everything right a\u2014\u00a0right away and then go for a\u2014 22 hours on an empty stomach. That\u2019s why you get sick.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> Yeah, I\u2019m glad you said that. People have the mistaken idea that what you do for seasickness is to keep an empty stomach, which is entirely wrong. And uh, it was arranged so you\u2014 we tried to arrange it and, Marthea [Hicks] was in that kitchen all<\/i> day so that you would have something<\/i> in your stomach during the entire trip. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Low-voice Male, could be Lee ingram:<\/b> \u2014Mike Lund, call about security.<\/p>\n

Middle-aged woman in crowd:<\/b> Get up there and talk about it.<\/p>\n

Low-voice Male:<\/b> (unintelligible) \u2014 to the bathroom\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Tonight?<\/p>\n

Low-voice Male:<\/b> That\u2019s what\u2014 that\u2019s\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Mike Lund was found by security in the\u2014<\/p>\n

Low-voice Male:<\/b> \u2014the kitchen\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Voice is tiring) \u2014kitchen drinking tea while the rally was going on. (Pause) He told security that he will\u2014 he was just going to the bathroom. Rob Ransom discovered this. Rob Rankin discovered this, and I remember (Pause) Mike Lund, I\u2014 oh, you break the father\u2019s heart. I appreciate, Father, you put my trust in me, then you put me back in the job and I\u2019m going to live up to that trust. What kind of a trust were you living up to over here in the kitchen, taking tea tonight? (Pause) What if\u2014 there\u2019s\u2014 there\u2019s a thousand people here that\u2019d like to take some tea. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Low voice male, unintelligible<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You people think you\u2019re better than others, that\u2019s why you do it.<\/p>\n

Older white male:<\/b> (comes to mike, voice fades in) \u2014 Mike, all\u2014 just because you\u2019re white doesn\u2019t give re\u2014 doesn\u2019t give you any special privileges. You better talk. And talk straight.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Goddamn, he hit it. He hit it. You make it difficult for us all again. (Pause) I\u2014\u00a0I want to get some coal and dust my\u2014 there\u2019s a lot of black selfishness too, but you make it mor\u2014 we\u2019ve, we\u2019ve had a long crime<\/i> of history. Just happens to be the historical process. Light-skinned people. (Pause) Now, how many times you have to be up here, son? (Pause) Take all these r\u2014 you ought to take his\u2014 all these privileges. You take these privileges all the time. (Pause) Six babies. You don\u2019t carry guilt \u2018tall. You don\u2019t carry \u2018em. Six babies that I<\/i> had to raise from the dead. (Pause) You could\u2019ve been charged with negligent homicide, son, if they\u2019da died, if I hadn\u2019t done something. You\u2014 I don\u2019t know what the goddamn law would have done.<\/p>\n

Woman in crowd:<\/b> \u2014at the piggery, \u2018cause Brian Bouquet said that he observed you being careless again. You and Tarik [Baker] while he was uh, digging in that compost, you were shooting the spray before he could get back up again.<\/p>\n

Man:<\/b> Damn.<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> I don\u2019t\u2014<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> (unintelligible) \u2014wrong with you, that I was not there.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> There\u2019s Brian.<\/p>\n

Younger<\/b> Woman:<\/b> Why don\u2019t you let him answer (unintelligible phrase), did he take the tea in the first place?<\/p>\n

Hubbub.<\/p>\n

New voice:<\/b> Um, Dad, we came down to the bathroom\u2014<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> Shh, shh, shh! Let\u2019s\u2014 Let\u2019s deal with the subject that\u2019s on the floor, I mean, and, and not drag up a whole bunch of crap that he\u2019s\u2014 that he was reported about him drinking tea, so if we can address ourselves to that, and deal with that without uh, dredging up a whole lot of stuff. And for those<\/i> of you that are, are on the floor behind him, if you can just deal with the items, have a quick, brief statement, and you know, get on with it, so we can move on. (Pause) Answer the question, Mike.<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> It\u2019s true. I had had a cup\u2014 I was\u2014 I\u2014 I had gone back\u2014 I had gotten it to stay awake in service, and\u2014<\/p>\n

Crowd:<\/b> Awww. Hubbub.<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> Shh! Folks, if you have anything to say, please don\u2019t make any side comments. Come to the floor or on the mike. The side comments m\u2014 make the meeting drag on. You want the m\u2014 meeting to move on, come to the mike and talk, if you have something to say.<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Uh, I didn\u2019t see Dad getting up going to go get a cup of tea to stay awake, and he\u2019s been up for days, I mean, days.<\/p>\n

Tish Leroy:<\/b> I don\u2019t think he went to bed last night at all, he was up all night long, and he went under strain and pressure last night that I\u2019d hate to see anybody go through, I don\u2019t think I could endure what he goes through.<\/p>\n

Stephan Jones:<\/b> I don\u2019t think you could either. Uh, the thing is, it\u2019s obviously psychological, because uh, one cup of tea wouldn\u2019t make any goddamn difference, so your whole problem is obviously psychological. (Pause) So why don\u2019t you just work on that<\/i>? Why don\u2019t you drink some water and tell<\/i> yourself it\u2019s tea, if that\u2019s all you\u2019re gonna do?<\/p>\n

Unintelligible voices<\/p>\n

Tish:<\/b> I said there\u2019s no caffeine in that tea, it\u2019s just an excuse for you anyway.<\/p>\n

Unintelligible male voices<\/p>\n

Tish:<\/b> I don\u2019t know how you expected tea like that to keep you awake. It\u2019s ridiculous. You just wanted it, that\u2019s all.<\/p>\n

Another<\/b> Male:<\/b> Did he say to stay awake, and (unintelligible) that\u2019s why he took advantage of\u2014<\/p>\n

General crowd assent.<\/p>\n

Male away from mike: <\/b>\u2014plus one cup of tea wouldn\u2019t make any damn bit (fades off)<\/p>\n

Tish:<\/b> Mother said there\u2019s no caffeine in that kind of tea.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And I wanted to correct one thing, Tish [Laetitia Eichler], that you dropped out here, I want to tell you, nobody<\/i>\u2014 you couldn\u2019t even\u2014 don\u2019t think\u2014 nobody, nobody<\/i> could put up with what I go through. Nobody. \u2018Cause I look at all<\/i> this, and I see the ramifications of it, and I\u2019ve tried so desperately hard to set an example, and it doesn\u2019t get communicated, people hate you, nobody could\u2014 nobody could stand it. (Pause) So there\u2019s no use, no even to reference\u2014 no any need to make reference, just maybe a slip of the tongue, but don\u2019t even put out, there\u2019s no way<\/i> you could stand it. Couldn\u2019t take it. (Pause) If crying would do any good, I\u2019da long since cried, but crying doesn\u2019t help the matter. I\u2019m trying to be reasonable and find a solution. (Pause) Here we stand up here\u2014 That\u2019s all right, that\u2019s all I have to say about that. We stand up here and we talk, we\u2019re ready to fight an enemy. (Pause) But you don\u2019t fight the great battles until you fight the small<\/i> ones. And the small ones are the unjust things we do to each other. We\u2019ve got to change<\/i> that, or the big battles, some of you, will lose<\/i>. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> Dad, that wasn\u2019t all he had. When he went down to the bathroom, he was coming back, he stopped by there, he poured the tea and gave it to Jeff [Carey], and Jeff put the sugar in it for him, and then he left and went on up, \u2018cause you gave Jeff the cup. Now washing it\u2014 I reported it to um, security\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (unintelligible word) Jeff who?<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> To Jeff.<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> That\u2019s not true. That\u2019s not true. In fact, when I got it, Jeff had told me you better not take it. He didn\u2019t give me anything.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> He had the cup.<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> He did not. That\u2019s not true. (Pause) He\u2014<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd: <\/b>Where\u2019s Jeff?<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> He\u2019s down at the back of the kitchen, working.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> It\u2019s\u2014 it\u2019s\u2014 it\u2019s\u2014<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> He\u2014 he\u2014 he didn\u2019t do it. It was all on my own, Dad. He didn\u2019t do it.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And Jeff Carey\u2019s on duty, that\u2019s what you\u2019re saying, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> Working\u2014 He\u2019s working in the kitchen in the back right now.<\/p>\n

General hubbub.<\/p>\n

New voice:<\/b> Mike, you just told me other day<\/i> that uh, you had learned<\/i> better and you would not<\/i> even take extra sandwich or anything<\/i> like that anymore. You<\/i> just said that the other day, since you came off of Learning. And you\u2019re right back in the same rut you were in before, if not worse.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014may think it\u2019s not serious, but it is so damn<\/i> serious when we got so much on us. A few oranges, a few c\u2014 cups of tea, multiply them by a thousand times, if everybody takes a notion to take what they want when they want it, and your movement is dead within weeks.<\/p>\n

Single voice:<\/b> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s just how simple it is. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> Dad, um\u2014 (Pause) I\u2014 I\u2019m not sure what to say. I\u2019ve been working on my job hard, and I\u2019ve been doing the other st\u2014 my school and I\u00a0just\u2014<\/p>\n

General derision.<\/p>\n

Brian Bouquet:<\/b> I thought you were pretty lax today, the way you sprayed, at least two times uh, the spray got on the other brother\u2019s face while he was down in the, the hole, and he wiped it off, the first time you said sorry, the second time you\u2014 you didn\u2019t say anything, and that was all I saw, because then I moved away.<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> Um\u2014 The\u2014 the noz\u2014\u00a0the spr\u2014\u00a0the spray nozzle that you use, it\u2019s a\u2014\u00a0it has a\u2014\u00a0it\u2019s a hose<\/i>, so when you spr\u2014 it\u2019s made to spray along with, and as you turn it off, it, it goes from a straight, a straight stream out and it\u2019s\u2014 and it\u2014 the spray\u2019s direct\u2014\u00a0directly out\u2014 and\u2014<\/p>\n

General derision.<\/p>\n

Bouquet:<\/b> You weren\u2019t being uh, careful at all. If you\u2019d\u2014 if you had had any consideration at all, you would have told the person that that\u2014 that that piece of machinery does have that problem, and you would have told them to stand<\/i> clear. You weren\u2019t concerned about him at all. You didn\u2019t want to do your job at all\u2014\u00a0either. You\u2019re not changed, and until we see th\u2014 you do change, we\u2019re going get\u2014 keep staying on your goddamn ass about<\/i> this bullshit. You know, you\u2019re stak\u2014\u00a0taking special privilege because you think you\u2019re going to get away with this shit. And I am tired of it.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (World weary) Everybody better report it. Everybody better report everything they see, or we\u2014 we\u2019re in a desperate period. (Pause) Our brothers and sisters in Georgetown don\u2019t even have lights, and don\u2019t have water to flush the shit, so I don\u2019t\u2014 no f\u2014 no way to cook<\/i>, no way to see, write in the night. One of the reports came in, Mike Prokes was writing me, was writing like this, catawampus down, he said, I\u2019m sorry, there\u2019re no lights, I can\u2019t see.<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> \u2014 outside trying\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> He was outside un\u2014<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> \u2014 outside get\u2014 and it was dark.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Yes, trying to get light from the sky. Writing, to get a report out. It isn\u2019t fair, folks, for some to take a heavy bear\u2014\u00a0burden. And he not perfect, but by God it\u2019s a\u2014 whatever. We do\u2014\u00a0We should judge ourselves, and the minute\u2014 the thing Jeff<\/i> should\u2019ve done, he should\u2019ve told you, yeah, you\u2019re not going\u2014 you shouldn\u2019t<\/i> do it and he shoulda said, I\u2019m going to report you.<\/p>\n

Jeff:<\/b> That\u2019s\u2014 that\u2019s true, Dad, I didn\u2019t say, I\u2014\u00a0I told him. (Gets to mike) I told him a couple of times, I told him not to get into the coffee, and I\u2014 and he started to get it, I said, and you better get out of here with it. Yeah\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Coffee?<\/p>\n

Jeff:<\/b> \u2014there was some leftover coffee back there, which the people on the night crew, you know, drink coffee, ah, and those that work nights but\u2014\u00a0but other people that aren\u2019t working nights aren\u2019t supposed to get<\/i> it. And ah\u2014 so I told him not to go in the coffee, and then he\u2014 he went into it, and I said, don\u2019t drink it, said, get out of it, but I didn\u2019t<\/i> say, I\u2019m going to report you. (Pause) And uh\u2014\u00a0(Pause) Um\u2014 he, he asked for some sugar and I said, that you shouldn\u2019t get into the sugar, but I\u2014 you know, I didn\u2019t say that and I\u2014 I don\u2019t know\u2014 (Pause) At this point, I don\u2019t think I\u2014 I would have reported him, but from now on, I will. I\u2014 you know, anything I see like that.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> All of you realize, uh, that you think you secure yourself by this, but if we would secure ourselves with honesty, then we would be in much better CYA position, cover your ass position, than we are by letting all this stuff go by.<\/p>\n

Sound of child being sick.<\/p>\n

New voice:<\/b> We have a rule, Dad, uh, we made a rule that no\u2014 nobody\u2014 we try to keep \u2018em all completely<\/i> out of the kitchen. That\u2019s not working. And surely everyone know that they\u2019re not supposed to go in that big barrel of sugar, but they\u2019ll go in there when your back is turned and just go in there with the spoon or with the cup or anything. The whole big barrel of sugar. So it\u2019s a rule we have made. Mother was here, and she con\u2014 (Jones talks over her)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Can we not lock this? Can we not fix up something, Doc [Donald] Fitch or someone, Bruce, can we not fix up, some of you people with mechanical skills, some way that we can lock this shit? (Struggles for words) We are not going to allow\u2014 We can\u2019t let people\u2014 They\u2019ll be unsanitary, they\u2019ll pass us on\u2014 their worm\u2014 they\u2019ll wipe their ass and not wash and dig down in the sugar. I mean, the base\u2014 there\u2019s some people that have no<\/i> consideration for human beings. It\u2019s all\u2014 only for their selfish self. (Pause) Can this be put on the agenda, uh, Doc, and get some\u2014\u00a0Can you look at this thing?<\/p>\n

Reply from audience unintelligible<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You will? That\u2019s\u2014 Thank\u2014 Thank you, Doc.<\/p>\n

Mike:<\/b> On the\u2014 On the spraying, um, I had\u2014 I had done it, and then I\u2014 I traded places with Tarik so he could spray<\/i> and I could dig the, the manure, because I\u2014 I\u2019ve\u2014 (unintelligible) so I\u2014<\/p>\n

Unidentified voice: <\/b>That was a no-no. Tarik is not here to spray\u2014<\/p>\n

Unintelligible voices<\/p>\n

New voice:<\/b> Tarik knows he\u2019s not supposed to spray\u2014<\/p>\n

Tarik<\/strong>: I know I\u2019m not supposed to spray.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (whispers) Jesus. (Pause) (Jim and unidentified male talk over each other, both unintelligible). (Voice is tired) I get you a bunch of movies that I can\u2019t afford, I got four good\u2014\u00a0four, some of them are decent movies, it looks like\u2014 you coulda had a movie, uh, did the best I could, because don\u2019t have the new outline, um\u2014\u00a0You can\u2019t afford movies (Pause) and, and I\u2019ll swear, folk, if you get in an accident, and you happen to be one of those uh, um, if you happen to be, uh, a child like the Edwards boy, Isaac Edwards, someone\u2019s not going to be able to afford this kind of care\u2014 one day, when the\u2014 I have to pay for a plane to come in here (Pause) one day<\/i>, I\u2019m not going to be able to do it (Pause) with what you\u2019re doing. (Pause) All you who steal through this organization, not just this situation, but I mean all<\/i> this shit that you do, all the waste you do, all the times I come in that\u2014 I come in that bathroom, it don\u2019t make any difference, I walk in there at night, day, midday, I can scream in there, don\u2019t\u2014 if you look at me, I have to walk in, in and look at you naked, and you\u2019ll have that water just running off. That water don\u2019t get there without power. Takes electricity, takes gas, takes a fuel oil to put that water up there, and every goddamn time, and you\u2014 and you people stand right around and let somebody just let the water pour, like a torrent falls. (Pause) If you think I like taking a walk, (unintelligible word) seeing any naked bodies, you got one goddamn wrong mistake. And anybody watches<\/i> me, I look right smack ass in the eyeball. Many of you see me in there, but you\u2019ve never see me drop my eyes, eyeball. (Pause) Only reason I walk in there is because (Pause) this is only way you can get to some people, humiliate them. (Pause) But it humiliates me, too, \u2018cause I come from an old school that does not like to walk in on people naked. I don\u2019t like to be seen<\/i> naked, and I don\u2019t like to be watching people naked. But anybody\u2019s there\u2014\u00a0and how many see me walk in and see me, I look eyeball. I don\u2019t look down. I\u2019ll swear on the life of children that nobody can say otherwise. I look eyeball. I never drop down. But that\u2019s most<\/i> uncomfortable for me. One sister said \u2014 I don\u2019t know what, which sister it was\u2014 said poor father, he has to\u2014 he has to inspect everything we do. I thought, that was a discerning sister. (Pause) Yes, dear. (Pause) All right, all right, what is the disposition? I\u2019m in no mood to crack on my children.<\/p>\n

Jimmy:<\/b> Um\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I was disgusted with the melee last time, I was disgusted with you that brought the melee about, too. (Pause) (Unintelligible word) I was disgusted with it.<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd:<\/b> I haven\u2019t heard any of these young people volunteer to go on a two-day fast theirselves.<\/p>\n

One voice:<\/b> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

General conversation.<\/p>\n

Jimmy:<\/b> Um, Tarik went to\u2014<\/p>\n

Stephan<\/strong>: (fades in) You ain\u2019t listening.<\/p>\n

Jimmy:<\/b> (stutters) \u2014repeat I said before, there\u2019s no\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> He can\u2019t afford to go on a two day fast, frankly. It\u2019s not because he\u2019s my son. He can\u2019t afford it. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Stephan<\/strong>:<\/b> Some of these people, the young, they should<\/i>, sure could afford it.<\/p>\n

Jimmy:<\/b> (stutters) What I would like to say is that\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Careful, Stephan [Jones], careful, Stephan, don\u2019t show undue defensiveness for your peer group. (Pause) We represent all the people.<\/p>\n

Jimmy:<\/b> (stutters throughout Jones talk) There\u2019s no word that can\u2014 I can say, you know, that, you know, because of my size, you know, \u2018cause (stutters) I, I don\u2019t want my dad to go on them, or, or Dad to go on a two-day fast. I know it, detrimental to his health, and, you know, I\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I would not risk my health, I think it will just cause me aggravation and irritation. That\u2019s what it\u2019ll do, I\u2019ll tell you no more that. I\u2019m overweight, but I don\u2019t think it\u2019s the best thing for me to do<\/i>, energy level, to keep my energy level as I ought to.<\/p>\n

Jimmy:<\/b> (stutters) Even then, Dad, I know that if I wouldn\u2019t have been so greedy of having my patterns of elitism, if (stutters) I wouldn\u2019t have done it or I wouldn\u2019t have been the first one to do it, to show the pattern of other people doing it. This wouldn\u2019t have been brought about.<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd:<\/b> (fades in) \u2014started anyway, Jimmy. (unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> No, now, don\u2019t don\u2019t\u2014 that\u2019s sweet of you, Geri [Geraldine Bailey], but that\u2019s not true. When leaders take advantage, people use it. No, he wouldn\u2019t have. Greg Watkins wouldn\u2019t have dared do it, but he thought he had to cover, because somebody in my family, immediate family, was doing it. (Pause) He was bolder with it, at least. You may be right, Gerry, that they\u2019ll do it sneaking, but they won\u2019t do it openly<\/i>.<\/p>\n

Strong woman voice:<\/b> If they had good sense, Dad, they\u2019d realize that you didn\u2019t have to bring your children in to this<\/i> damn family, and they can\u2019t get what they want. This guy. They could have had oranges<\/i> when they got ready, they could had ev\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s sweet. I appreciate your empathy. I appreciate your empathy for my children, (voice hardens as woman tries to talk over him) but you are not speaking in a socialistic fashion. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> This is true<\/i>, Dad.<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> Shh!<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Sister! I said I appreciate your empathy for my children, but you are not following the trend of the conversation.<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> I\u2019m sorry, Dad, I\u2019m sorry. (voice fades)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s true<\/i>, they coulda had everything, but that doesn\u2019t give them any right\u2014\u00a0they also\u2014 if I hadn\u2019t taken them in, I had made certain turns of conscious, they could have\u2014 and certain breaks that came, they\u2019da starved<\/i>, just like a lot of other children are starving in the world. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> The fact is, I didn\u2019t want it, and I never did, and I don\u2019t think any of\u2014 I know<\/i> none of us did, so that\u2019s, that\u2019s not even a point.<\/p>\n

Greg Watkins:<\/b> Uh, Dad, I\u2019ll go on a two-day fast, and I apologize to you and Mother and the family\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I\u2019d rather see what you ch\u2014 you, you do with guilt. I\u2019d rather see\u2014 I\u2019d rather not have you join me in the two-day fast. I\u2019d rather do it alone. I don\u2019t want\u2014 I don\u2019t want anybody to join me in it.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> I think that if you\u2019re going to insist on doing it, I think that\u2019s the only way to\u2014 for these people to really feel the d\u2014 the discipline, because\u2014<\/p>\n

Voice behind him: <\/b>That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> I know\u2014 the\u2014 if they\u2019re going on a two-day fast, they\u2019d be thinking\u2014 (Jones talking over him)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Unintelligible) If I don\u2019t appeal someplace to your highest\u2014 (Pause) If I don\u2019t really appeal to being good, like I am\u2014 I\u2019ve got that, I\u2019ve got a\u2014 I\u2019ve got a real uh, character of goodness, and if I\u2014 if you go without food, then you won\u2019t feel\u2014 you\u2019ll not<\/i> develop guilt that is so essential. What you jumping around about those bugs for? It just disturbs the hell out me when you\u2014 in the middle of the session when I\u2019m trying to teach, go crazy \u2018cause of bugs around you. (Pause) You want to die? What are you doing, sister? (Pause) Well, yes, I saw one went back through here. (Pause) Uh, she\u2019s so often on the floor, we have a tendency here to let sex and age and\u2014\u00a0You know who you were, back there, stompin\u2019 around. You! What?<\/p>\n

Answer away from mike.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Angry) That bug was (unintelligible word; hard?) on you and you were acting like you were a lunatic, and I\u2014 sitting here worried, were you having a stroke or a heart attack?<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> Sister, stand up.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And you\u2019re always<\/i> so self-centered. You are one self-centered woman. (Pause) That poor little bug that you had to stomp out. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Marceline jones: <\/b>Did she kill the bug?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, I, uh\u2014 she musta been doing some<\/i>thing, she looked like she was doing a war<\/i> dance, and for a moment, my love and compassion, I wondered is my sister having some medical problem, till I figured that (struggles for words) discerned and\u2014 who it was, then I knew, I could expect that from you. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Marceline: <\/b>(Voice fades in) \u2014 ask to kill the bug. They won\u2019t hurt anybody.<\/p>\n

Pearl Land:<\/b> I didn\u2019t kill him, I just pushed him out of my way.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, you sure were trying. (Pause) All this shit, you ready to die? And you people get all upset with a bug. I watch you. These beautiful bugs come out, and none of them bite. And you go all<\/i> apeshit, go ape<\/i>shit, some of you. Don\u2019t talk to me about it. I\u2019m not gonna\u2014 I\u2019m not going to count on you defending our children with the front line, when you go apeshit over a bug. No way. (Pause) One thing talk about dying, and it\u2019s another thing to believe in it, and living it.<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Single voice too far from mike.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I didn\u2019t catch it what you said, (unintelligible name \u2014 sounds like “Sera\/Sara”).<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> Said, just a lot of these sin\u2014 seniors are like that. They\u2019re just afraid of their shadow.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Thank you. Because there been enough said about youth<\/i> here. And that\u2019s what gets youth dander up. Seniors go down on youth. Well, I could tell you, there\u2019s a lot of thing to be said about some self-centered, goddamn seniors that live 70 years and haven\u2019t learned jack<\/i>shit.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Applause.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> In fact, if I had been \u2014 and I\u2019m not violent, and I\u2019m not hostile, because this is the real me, I\u2019m a gentle person\u2014 if I had been<\/i> like some of you people, live 70 years, I\u2019da turned myself in for dog food.<\/p>\n

Scattered:<\/b> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Goddamn, woulda done it. And I think Reb understands what I\u2019m saying. I\u2019da c\u2014 I\u2019da c\u2014 I\u2019da contributed myself for dog food, \u2018cause dogs are loyal.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> Uh, and let\u2019s not everybody shift it to the seniors now, and take it off youth and shift to seniors, cause we all\u2014 (Jones talks over him)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s good. That\u2019s (Unintelligible) That\u2019s proper, son.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> I know before I<\/i> came down here, you know the way I was, I shoulda, you know, (laughs) done the same thing, done something productive, \u2018cause I wasn\u2019t doing shit for anybody but myself, and uh\u2014\u00a0so don\u2019t just shift it on the seniors. There\u2019s a few people need to look at themselves\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> It\u2019s a people problem, that\u2019s very, very important that we don\u2019t get uh, divisions of sex and age and race. We one<\/i> people. (Pause) We correct our faults<\/i>, for Christ\u2019s sakes. (Pause) Now there\u2019ll be a great deal of excitement in the house s\u2014 if we could have a fight<\/i> now. Someone could run up and knock the hell out of somebody. Everybody, wake up. I\u2019m sure the house would go immediately<\/i> alive, it would ignite like Christmas trees.<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, I\u2019m sorry to disappoint you sadists, there will be no fight tonight.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Applause.<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> And\u2014\u00a0and for those that are remaining on the floor, if you could just have some disposition or (unintelligible \u2014 sounds like “just”) situation, and, you know, instead of just dragging this out, I mean, there are a lot of other things\u2014 you know, this\u2014 this is part and parcel of what drags on and causes undue pain to our leader, to have it go on and on and on.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Unintelligible word) it\u2019s true, it\u2019s true.<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> So if you would just\u2014 those of you that are part in this, state your disposition and those that are not, you know, I\u2019d s\u2014 ask just to clear the floor right now. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> There\u2019s people that are guilty<\/i> saying, stay up there\u2014<\/p>\n

Another<\/b> Male:<\/b> If you want companions and relatives\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I don\u2019t want (struggles for words)\u2014 The Secretary Vernetta Christian has to (unintelligible word) all this, and take all notes, uh\u2014 leave it to your conscience, see what you do one time. Leave it to your conscience, if you don\u2019t do anything about it. We will watch. We will watch.<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> (away from mike): \u2014dictate. Sit down.<\/p>\n

Jimmy:<\/b> Thank you, Dad, I\u2019m sorry.<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> (Sharply) Sit down, all of you.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> We\u2019ll see what you come up and\u2014 if you make some contribution, it\u2019ll be very rewarding to us, that reason has prevailed. (Pause) Told we don\u2019t like the kind of incidents we saw. But now that isn\u2019t to speak against those that raised their hands, because some of them do<\/i> so because they were instructed<\/i>, as you know, to do so. we made the assignments. But some of you really go to it back there, you just r\u2014 jump up and down when there\u2019s a bit of violence. When reason<\/i> comes, when Father pours his heart from the depths of his true inner being, you sleep. You\u2019re slug\u2014 you\u2019re sluggish, you<\/i> don\u2019t like it, it isn\u2019t fun enough for you. (Pause) I want to tell you just how I felt about that meeting. It humiliates me. I didn\u2019t like what Martha did, but it humiliated me to see her teeth broken, laying there with her mouth\u2014 and I know how women feel about that. It humiliated me to see all the people on the mattress that night. It humiliated me. I\u2019m trying to find a way to teach us to grow up. And by God, one method won\u2019t work. You have to try 40 different methods. Different people react to different things. But you that do react out of fear and violence, you should work on it, because that\u2019s not what I came to do. That was a hell of a night to me. If I didn\u2019t love you so much, I could just go home and l\u2014 sit down and die. I despise meetings like that.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> Um, the thing is, it always gets me and I\u2014 I feel\u2014 I\u2019d like\u2014 I\u2019ve been waiting for a chance to say it, is that, when these things happen, you know, three\u2014 you know, four of you people will dive in on somebody, and uh, the thing that gets me, we\u2019ve had times when somebody would volunteer to get up here and take a guy one on one, and you never see, you know, 90% of the people that are diving into these messes, you never see them raising their hand. Not all of them, but, but a great deal of people are going to try to get their lick, you know. And another thing that kills me, you\u2014 you\u2019re so mad at this person, so why in the hell, when somebody tries to stop you that hadn\u2019t done a damn thing, you start swinging \u2018em at\u2014 swinging at \u2018em and shit.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Right.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> I know a few of us had to go down here and bodily throw people, and\u2014 and\u2014 and grab \u2018em and strangle \u2018em, just to get them the hell off the fuckin\u2019 people. It\u2019s just a stupid mess. You don\u2019t get anything done any\u2014 ri\u2014 I think they both\u2014\u00a0I think they both could say<\/i> that they hardly\u2014 uh, Stanley\u2019s [Stanley Clayton] gotten worse from one person, haven\u2019t you. And three million diving on and fighting each other, trying to get him. And I don\u2019t think you probably got\u2014 (Jones talks over him)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> It\u2019s a miracle somebody doesn\u2019t get killed in the process. But, again, I don\u2019t know (unintelligible word)\u2014 so we\u2019ll never be predictable. If I did this kind of pattern of goodness, displayed my true<\/i> character, and did this in two weeks, you\u2019d have a revolutionary anarchy.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Counter-revolutionary anarchy, \u2018cause some<\/i> people take advantage of goodness. They don\u2019t want to face goodness. They don\u2019t want to look at goodness, \u2018cause then they gotta live goodness. (Pause) And some people will be good only when they are afraid of a bullet or a karate chop or the punch of a (Pause) brave little senior citizen. It\u2019s such a\u2014\u00a0It\u2019s a sad state of affairs. Well, I can tell, you\u2019d have me a lot longer\u2014 I would think we would not<\/i> want to war with ourselves when we have so many enemies abroad.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s what pains me, is to see us warring<\/i> amongst ourselves, when we\u2019ve got enemies plotting<\/i> how to kill babies, how to torture children, bring whole soldiers now that are mostly black and move them up to radiation test, and explode them to see what effect it has on human beings, like the news I gave you this week in USA. (Pause) Uh, how many heard what I just said? I wonder if they\u2019ve done that if it was all white soldiers. I \u2018spect they would. The ruling class would do it with most anybody. But put them right up to the radiation test, and let them\u2014 and did it all the way\u2014 they\u2019ve done it ever since the first atomic test in Nevada. Don\u2019t give a goddamn about life. We<\/i> should care, and we should concern ourselves with not wasting and violating rules and causing pain and anger\u2014 agony for each other. We should redress our grievances, and know that I\u2019m a fair<\/i> person if you\u2019ll talk reasonably and do your<\/i> just part, there\u2019s no<\/i> one you can\u2019t criticize. I love my son more than anybody\u2019s ever loved my\u2014 their son, the son that was criticized tonight [Jim Jones Jr.]. It\u2019s not easy<\/i> because I know the years of sacrifice and pain that the sister spoke about. Well, we cannot continuously stand here and say, well this leader\u2019s son, or that leader\u2019s son, or daughter has gone through such-and-such, and so whe\u2014 where in the hell\u2019s this gonna end? (Pause) Some<\/i>place we\u2019re going to have to have an equitable society. We\u2019re all going to have to tighten the belt and feel the burden, or there\u2019s gonna be resentments and hostilities through this mo\u2014 this movement.<\/p>\n

Male voice:<\/b> That\u2019s true. That\u2019s right. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well. That was about the finish of the agenda, wasn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n

Quiet voice:<\/b> Yes, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Unintelligible word; Ready?) follow-up?<\/p>\n

Lee Ingram:<\/b> (fades in) \u2014got a little off the subject. I\u2019m sorry\u2014<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> The first item is, how soon should we con\u2014 consider beginning to cut bush again? That item has been tabled for about four weeks.<\/p>\n

Ingram:<\/b> Uh, (clear throat)\u2014\u00a0this is just about Mike Lund. Since he\u2019s been off the Learning Crew, he\u2019s been washing\u2014 coming in at nights, doing the nurses\u2019 quarters, washing the nurses\u2019\u2014 nursing office floor, and ever since he\u2019s been off, he\u2019s been doing this on his own, so\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> For those of you that want to ride in on racism, that was a white<\/i> young man.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> And I\u2019m sure<\/i> somebody knew that.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Agnes [Jones] is the one that spoke about it, my daughter spoke about it. I expect some others knew about it.<\/p>\n

Two people talking inaudibly.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> But that d\u2014 still doesn\u2019t take\u2014\u00a0justify taking the liberties with the coffee. I\u2019m not trying to do that, but I\u2019m glad that you brought it up. And it\u2019s always good to channel it through immediacy, \u2018cause people say, well, I do<\/i> do that, and so that\u2019s the reason I\u2019m going to take an extra drop of co\u2014 coffee, but you can\u2019t<\/i>. Please ask me. I\u2019m willing to hear you. Then please ask me.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> That\u2019s right, and the only way you going to get somebody to (struggles for words)\u2014 I think he did the right thing, he didn\u2019t mention that once, and he just took it like, you know, and he came off looking to me<\/i> like he\u2014 he hadn\u2019t changed one goddamn bit. And I think some of the people uh, shoulda got up off their ass and said<\/i> it, \u2018cause I\u2014 I\u2014 you know, especially some of you people probably sat there and watched him do it. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Christine Lucientes:<\/b> The nurses wrote it up for a praise. The nurses (fades out)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> The nursing department did? Thank you. That\u2019s good. I haven\u2019t got to the praises. Thank you, Christine. (Pause) Um\u2014 Hmm?<\/p>\n

Low conversation.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Shift. Shift you ri\u2014\u00a0Shift yourself, please. (Pause) (Reading again) I would like to bring out some facts about Georgetown because there\u2019s opportunities to go to Georgetown to work, to make money, when times arise. (Pause) (Unintelligible name?) (Pause) There was never such things as this that needed to be passed on by the radio, that roll call is not taken and suggest it be done, especially when there\u2019s a large number of people in town. Somebody coulda been missing at that\u2014 in the morning hour, and never noticed. Bea\u2014 uh, Bea Orsot uh, Grubbs noticed that. Suggest that children be watched more carefully when out, mentions that um, Martin Amos is particularly<\/i> defiant at not wanting his hand held when out. And you\u2014 don\u2019t have to be uh, little\u2014 and I understand what you\u2014\u00a0you show your mind strength, and you can still be protected<\/i>, um, in a physical<\/i> sense when you\u2019re strong mentally<\/i> by having someone hold your hand<\/i>. (Pause) Yeah. Jocelyn Carter drove very carelessly, she cut in front of another car which missed slamming into the front of our car, thought she should be more careful, especially with Marceline in the car. Shirley Hicks did a very good job of directing the entertainment, but is much too bossy. And I\u2019m just telling you complaints, I\u2019m not going to go into no dis\u2014 you can take<\/i> it, think about it, and see if it fits you. Those two young people leave the cultural center alone on bikes the morning of the performance, Bruce Jackson and Tim Jones Night [Tim Borl Jones]\u2014 we\u2014 were away from the performance at uh, night. (Pause) It\u2019s ridiculous to keep strict controls on people in Jonestown, only to become lax in Georgetown where the biggest problem could be. (Pause) Bad, bad decision. Should never have been. Class of Guyanese children watched one of our rehearsals, as they could not make it out at the\u2014\u00a0on the night of the performance. They were perfectly<\/i> behaved all through, watching our rehearsal. Reports the situation about the man in the backyard in the middle of the night. Was Diana [Wilkinson]\u2014 or Loretta [Cordell] that woke up and saw him looking over\u2014 he was particularly interested in trying to get Bruce Oliver to (Pause) sell out. (Unintelligible word) to go back. Bruce reported him immediately. Br\u2014 Bruce Jackson [likely erroneous reference to Bruce Oliver]. Although, like a lot of people, people get so concerned about their selves<\/i>, uh, Bruce<\/i> didn\u2019t want to s\u2014 didn\u2019t want to stay in town, lot of you didn\u2019t want to stay in town, you we\u2014 you want to decide, now how in the hell some people six or eight weeks been in town\u2014 I remember stay\u2014\u00a0standing in the presence of this movement and risking my life for Bruce and Billy [Oliver], said you can\u2019t have them. (Struggles for words) We ought not to complain, and all because we have our own insecurities or wish to uh, dominate some other human being that we uh\u2014 or mirror<\/i> ourself on some human being that we uh, have this attitude. And he wasn\u2019t alone in that, but he\u2019s the most recent one I remember. I think it\u2019s rea\u2014 really nervy of anybody to say, I don\u2019t want to. Now he did, and he\u2014 I\u2014 I haven\u2019t heard nothing that he isn\u2019t working out, but uh, he did stay, but uh, all<\/i> of you, when I heard that attitudes developed, heard attitudes developed while you were in<\/i> Georgetown, heard Jocelyn, you lost some of the feeling of um\u2014 and I want\u2014 I\u2019d like to read something from (Pause) that you lost<\/i> that initiative of asserting leadership. And my daughter Sandy [Sandra Yvette Cobb, aka Sandy Jones} um, had gave me a letter. (Pause) It was a very good letter. I\u2019m\u2014 The essence<\/i> of it was, she said, you know, Dad, some of us who are black take\u2014 we cop out. We use our blackness to cop out, from our taking leadership, saying well, such-and-such a white person had to be helped sexually or so forth, but you know the\u2014 what\u2014 you know what is that you don\u2019t know, and she\u2014\u00a0she does, it\u2019s a very sweet letter, very touching letter, said I\u2019m gonna take my leadership role. Don\u2019t want the inconvenience of being up at night. But you see, the black people who\u2019ve had to be helped sexually are never<\/i> pointed out. (Pause) You follow what I\u2019m saying? (Pause) Let\u2019s not point it out. I never did that, even in government\u2014\u00a0(Pause)<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014who felt that they\u2019d gone through a lot, so I paid\u2014 played that down very, very small. So, okay, then what the hell. Have you\u2014 have you been helped out sexually? Wha\u2014What\u2019s that? Have you been helped out with a lot of talks? Have you been helped out with a lot of conversations? Have you been helped out of jail? You got no reason to feel your resentments. And not have everybody around me in the secretarial staff has been helped out sexually, by no means. So, don\u2019t<\/i> make these judgments. And don\u2019t\u2014 but she\u2014\u00a0she, just on her own, pointed out uh, how that uh, she was passing uh, she felt, a number of people, herself and others passing the buck, based on the fact of color, you know, white folk around and so forth. Let\u2019s not use that rationale. Let\u2019s base prin\u2014 our\u2014 our commitment on principle. It don\u2019t make any difference how many white hassles we have, how many white\u2014 black\u2014 uh, black hassles we have, we<\/i> know what\u2019s right. (Speeds up speech) I think I\u2019ve shown enough pattern of what\u2019s right, you should make the judgment on that, and not go on to a\u2014 go on to any trip on any<\/i> other thing. Or some personality. May not have nothing to do with color. You don\u2019t like some personality. The hell with you. How do you know I<\/i> like all the personalities I\u2019m\u2014 I\u2019m tied up with in the radio room? Do you know<\/i> that? (Pause) I don\u2019t even take the liberty to think<\/i> whether I like them or not, in a personal sense. I love<\/i> everybody enough to die for you, or be tortured for you, but uh, it\u2019s\u2014 it\u2019s wrong, to take the prerogative, I\u2019m not going to do something because I don\u2019t like somebodies in that department. You follow what I\u2019m saying?<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Right.<\/p>\n

Jones: <\/b>Now that doesn\u2019t give the people in the department the right to be arrogant either. Bossy or difficult. And you can nail any<\/i>body here. And we could do it in a more gentle fashion, we might uh, make some changes<\/i>, long range changes, I think. What you do when you come with the force of violence and threats of violence, it controls, and we have to have it. It has to be understood, if you do certain things, that the force of this entire security will come down on you. If you try to leave<\/i> and cause difficulty for us, until our people are free, the force of the entire people will be on your back. But, why is it that you don\u2019t just want to respond<\/i> out of such<\/i> great love, such great love that gives so much for you? Should you put a blackboard up with the kind of love that\u2019s demonstrated every week, \u2018cause I won\u2019t remember it very much longer. I remember Isaac Edwards because he\u2019s just (Pause) the last one, five years young. Could have been you<\/i>. Could have been your<\/i> baby, your<\/i> granddaughter, your s\u2014 your daughter, your son. You think of what I put out to see that that child got the best, and fought<\/i> to the point of a White Night, when I found that they would not be allowed in the hospital, I said, oh yes she will. You stay<\/i> in the hospital with him. I am not<\/i> trusting any of my people to that Georgetown hospital. Even though it\u2019s a socialist country, it\u2019s still not that far removed from capitalism. And I didn\u2019t do it in the States, I\u2019m not doing it here. I said, I\u2019m not trusting. You\u2019re staying with that child around the clock. And the next day, to call and find the nurses were abdicating to some supervisor, the child don\u2019t want to drink water, you can\u2019t let a child decide what\u2019s good for them\u2014 that\u2019s what a lot of you, you want to be liked by people, you don\u2019t want to do what\u2019s best<\/i> for them, you don\u2019t want any inconvenience, you don\u2019t want to hear the child cry<\/i>, you don\u2019t want to cause a\u2014 him to uh, raise any ruckus<\/i> with you. And people won\u2019t like<\/i> you necessarily for a while, while you\u2019re trying to make them a better person, and help them be<\/i> a better person, make themselves<\/i> a better person, but in the long<\/i> run, they\u2019ll\u2014 they\u2019ll admire you a hell<\/i> of a lot more than you going along with all their shit.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And if they didn\u2019t\u2014 I only said that to appeal to some of you that have to be liked. And if they didn\u2019t, what is communism, but a right idea? (Pause) Whether anybody likes us or don\u2019t like us, it\u2019s a right idea. Whether anybody understands it or don\u2019t understand it. (Pause) If anybody uses anything tonight, you\u2019re slapping me in the face, because I prove my justice.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> All right, I\u2019ll continue with this and (Pause) then of course most of you will not be interested in the movie tonight, but after socialist classes, you can have one or the other of them. There\u2019s uh, Blindfold<\/i> with Rock Hudson, Claudia Cardinale, and Jack Warden. A New York City psychiatrist is called upon to treat a disturbed scientist, and he becomes involved in this spine-tiggling\u2014 tingling kidnapping plot that stretches from the concrete jungles of Manhattan to the swamplands of, of uh, the jungle. Anyway, then there\u2019s Bush Baby<\/i>, and I don\u2019t know what that\u2019s about. Children of the Damned<\/i>? Science fiction, a couple of children that are possessed, so-called, with psychic powers and able to cause people to destroy themselves. That\u2019s nice, hope we can cultivate that. (Pause) It\u2019s interesting, and I<\/i> certainly have a little bit of that power. So maybe one day we\u2019ll have a nation or generation of people who\u2019ll have some intuitiveness, but right now, we better try to change the world through character.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> But it\u2019s scary stuff and unreal, and I\u2019m not very happy with the kind of movie, but we didn\u2019t\u2014\u00a0couldn\u2019t get what I ordered<\/i>. And the other one is ah, Bourcelina<\/i>, I think it\u2019s a French gangster-type movie, that is very\u2014 what? Obscure, as all French movies are. (Pause) Obscure, as all French movies are.<\/p>\n

Response from man in crowd inaudible.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I\u2014 I\u2014 I don\u2019t know anything about it either.<\/p>\n

Woman in crowd:<\/b> Obscene?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Obscene? No (struggles for words)\u2014<\/p>\n

Response from man in crowd inaudible, asks for definite of obscure.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Oh, the plot\u2019s a little difficult to follow. Well? That way it\u2019ll teach your brain to think, huh? (Pause) Well, tonight they\u2019ll have a Blindfold<\/i> at a late show for those that on the uh\u2014 on that shift. Now\u2014\u00a0Shift again, as I give you uh\u2014\u00a0(Pause) There was a boat that followed our boat and took pictures. All of you should be alert to those kind of things. (Pause) Notice a car with two men looking at our equipment being loaded. Took license number. No\u2014\u00a0Noticed young men sitting between Lew [Jones] and Jerry Rhea during band practice, had an American passport in his lap. Everyone was told by Bea not to go to the restroom alone at the Cultural Center. Everyone agreed except my son Lew. (Pause) Hmm? Lew, you ought to remember, they tried to set you up and<\/i> me.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> In a fucking bathroom.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> In a bathroom<\/i>. It was in a bathroom. You remember? Remember what the Los Angeles police tried to do? (Pause) You should\u2014 you shouldna\u2014 you shouldna done that, Lew. Think it\u2019s dangerous because a person could be easily set up, you sure could. (Pause) He\u2014 He ignored her and talked down to her. This was not her<\/i> statement, this statement of somebody else. The band let outsiders in while they practice. One was playing the guitar during break. (Pause) At the Cultural Center, about seven young Guyanese people approached and asked if uh, different ones if they were American. They asked why we\u2019re here. They said we look like CI agents. (Pause) Well, there\u2019s always those kind. Hmm?<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> They just do that, they messing<\/i> with you\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Yeah\u2014<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> \u2014 the next minute, they\u2019ll be talking nice to you.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> They left friendly. (Stumbles on words). A young man named um, William Bentley talked to Shirley Hicks quite a while. Another young man asked us, if we wanted to buy some dope. That could have been very easily a CIA set-up. Reports that Jack Beam did not go to the Chinese Dragon, was laying down at home when she returned. He worked the next day, though. What was he supposed to be\u2014<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Jack Beam\u2014<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> \u2014 sat right next to me at the (Jones talks over her)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I\u2019m just reading this shit, so that there\u2019s no fear in our favor. I was reading. I didn\u2019t say all this was law and gospel. You can\u2014 you can react to all of it now, one by one, but uh\u2014\u00a0(Pause) Well, I hope we don\u2019t take all night doing it. (Unintelligible word). The band ju\u2014 generally demonstrated a very good attitude, Kenny [Kennard] Wilhite, Jerry Rhea, Lew Jones worked very hard, leading the boat without being\u2014\u00a0loading the boat without being asked. That\u2019s the kind of thing I like. The same person that made the criticism of\u2014 of him, also praised um, Lew, for instance. Thinks that Dee Dee Macon and Anita Kelley did an excellent job taking care of medical needs, and that Anita is especially sensitive and warm to people. (Pause) Anita Darrell, Anita uh, Devers [Acquinetta Devers] now, isn\u2019t it? Thinks the organization in Georgetown is somewhat chaotic, and that some trusted people should be sent in to help, \u2018cause of disorganization, not that they\u2019re not trustworthy. Well, if there\u2019re many people feel that, please let me know. Davis Soloman appeared to be trying to get sexually close to Linda Mitchell under a blanket. (Pause) False? Jack pulled it off, and he acted innocent. Marthea Hicks stole someone\u2019s shoes in town (laughs) and was counseled for it, told Bay\u2014 Bea she did not like the way it was handled. She worked very hard in the kitchen on the boat all the way back. (Pause) (unintelligible first name \u2014 sounds like “Tina” or “Kim”) Barnett had an uncooperative, bad attitude on the boat when Bea asked her not to sit on the water cooler and refused\u2014\u00a0fused to move. She moved when Bea went to Tim Swinney about it. Nancy Sines got a lot of valuable information from the uh\u2014 too about our animals including how to catch the panther. Jimmy Jones always portrays a good attitude, and never acts like he\u2019s above or better than others. Doesn\u2019t talk down to people, and makes them feel equal. (Pause) Said Bes\u2014\u00a0Bea Orsot. Others of you ought to do that, that\u2019s what we ought to constantly do to improve, so I say Jimmy, uh, on balance<\/i>, I\u2019m proud to hear that, that makes me feel better, \u2018cause I need a lift of my spirit. I\u2019d also like to know what caused all the shitstir, um, uh, the\u2014\u00a0Kim Yoon Ai, I would like to ask you a question, that\u2019ll cause a great deal of, of pressure on the young woman, got her very depressed, and low psychological frame, one of our best people\u2014 (Pause) um, considerable counseling from me, why did you tell um, or at least Bruce Oliver says\u2014 Jackson\u2014 that you said that uh, that Shanda [Oliver] and my son Tim Jones [Tim Tupper “Day” Jones] were having sexual, they were, were seeing each other, and that\u2019s a lie. (Pause) Well, he said it. (Pause) It\u2019s in the letter.<\/p>\n

Ai:<\/b> (First words overrun by Jones) I didn\u2019t\u2014 I didn\u2019t even say nothing to Bruce, \u2018cause he was talking\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Was that the\u2014 is that not the letter?<\/p>\n

Ai:<\/b> I know he, he sent me letters and told me to tell Shanda that, \u2018cause he heard that uh, uh, he\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, he\u2019s playing games then.<\/p>\n

Ai:<\/b> He, he told me that Tinky [Verna Lisa Johnson, aka Shawntiki Johnson] \u00a0was talking to him about\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Shawntiki\u2019s also is involved this\u2014<\/p>\n

Ai:<\/b> So I mean that it\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014trying to get Tim in trouble because you didn\u2019t uh, evidently you didn\u2019t like it because Tim\u2019s not responding to you. What the hell\u2019s going on? I don\u2019t know. (Pause) What it\u2019s um\u2014\u00a0what you\u2019re doing, what\u2014 he, you or he or whatever, it\u2019s cu\u2014 (Pause) Now that\u2019s not the way you build love, you people. You don\u2019t build romance, you lose<\/i> it that way. (Pause) This kind of silly-ass stuff.<\/p>\n

Ai:<\/b> \u2018Cause Bruce is really concerned about Shanda, um, um, breaking up with him, and I, I said that it was nothing, I said um, Shanda\u2019s not messing around with nobody and I\u2014 and so he\u2014 he\u2014\u00a0he told me make sure\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Honey, these letters filled with lies.<\/p>\n

Ai:<\/b> \u2014to comfort Shanda and tell her that, you know, that he\u2019s still, you know, with her and stuff and I said well, I\u2014 I\u2019d sure\u2014 I\u2019d tell him\u2014\u00a0I\u2019d tell him that, and that I\u2014 he told Shanda\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Usually\u2014 you usually project in others what\u2019s in himself, in uh, in yourself.<\/p>\n

Ai:<\/b> There\u2019s a whole talk about um, he thought that Shanda was breaking off with him, and I told him it wasn\u2019t, and\u2014<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Who\u2019s<\/i> talking about it?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, if I say usually, see, what\u2019s (name unintelligible) telling me, that uh, that uh, um, that he do\u2014\u00a0he\u2014 he\u2019s not often, uh, not uh, surprising to find him with young women here and there. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Well, what were you shaking your head about?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And others have told me this. So I want to find out who\u2019s lying and who isn\u2019t. Yes, Lew, what is it?<\/p>\n

Lew:<\/b> Bruce, uh, Bruce came up to me right before we left and told me that a lot of rumors going around here, ran it down, what the rumors were and he said that Kim Yoon Ai told ’em all these rumors and one of the rumors\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Kim Yoon Ai told who?<\/p>\n

Lew:<\/b> Yeah. He said that Kim Yoon Ai told him these rumors<\/i>, and I\u2014 and he said one of the rumors were that Tim was uh, going to go with uh, Shanda and then Dre [Andrea Yvette Walker]\u00a0wanted to go back with uh, Tim and break up with Tony [Walker] and uh\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> What\u2019s this?<\/p>\n

Lew:<\/b> This\u2014\u00a0this is all what Bruce told me, and I don\u2019t\u2014 I don\u2019t know what it was, and\u2014 and then\u2014\u00a0and then he said\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> But Tim hasn\u2019t done it, but this is (struggles for words)\u2014 this is beat that\u2014 according to her<\/i> testimony, has beat her down so much that she wa\u2014\u00a0she wants out of life and everybody\u2014<\/p>\n

End of side one.<\/strong><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

Side 2<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014cynical eye. I always have one, and it may, one time\u2014 nobody can say they didn\u2019t see each other than to s\u2014 talk about a tooth problem. (Pause) It was out in the public.<\/p>\n

Stephan Jones:<\/b> (Voice cuts in from off mike) \u2014and he\u2014 I know he was genuinely so\u2014 \u2018cause I been hearing the rumors, you know, and I got ti\u2014 I told people to shut<\/i> up, \u2018cause I got tired of people passing these stupid rumors around when they really<\/i> had no basis, but I\u2014 and I asked him<\/i> and he gen\u2014 he was genuinely surprised, I think.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Were you on this, Shawntiki? (Pause) He claims you are.<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> Dad, Tim and I was<\/i> talking, but it was no\u2014 it was nothing<\/i> there really, and um, we\u2014 I ex\u2014 you know, he said, well you know who\u2019s talking, he said well, don\u2019t get your hopes up too high, so I said, I realize that, you know, \u2018cause I didn’t expect that, you know, him saying really (Pause) you know, that they had really broke up. And so then the last of that that\u2014 that was the last of it.<\/p>\n

Woman in crowd:<\/b> Did you say anything\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> She didn\u2019t volunteer this letter. She was bringing it to talk with someone else and I\u2014 I wanted to get parts of it, and I\u2019m not going to go<\/i> into this whole letter, but this in\u2014 this is a hell of a way\u2014 you don\u2019t keep\u2014 you don\u2019t keep um, um\u2014 (Pause) whatever you want\u2014 relationship with this kind of\u2014 this kind of bullshit. And what do you doing\u2014 what were you doing, what\u2014 now what\u2019d you said again, what did you say you said?<\/p>\n

Two voices in crowd ask question, unintelligible.<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> No, I didn\u2019t say anything to Bruce.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> What\u2019s going on? Are you trying to hide this kind of bullshit? I thought my men had grown up for this crap. Now I wonder if Tiki did have a reason for saying that you\u2014 well, okay\u2014 (name unintelligible) you, you said something about breaking up, did you tell them that uh, that, that they were breaking up?<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> No, Dad, I didn\u2019t.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Did you tell me anything about hi\u2014 about Tim?<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> No\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Did you have any interest in Tim?<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> Yes, I did, but I didn\u2019t tell\u2014 I didn\u2019t tell Bruce nothing.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, you people, when you start this shit, when you got romance going\u2014 you didn\u2019t\u2014 you didn\u2019t tell\u2014 you didn\u2019t tell him anything. Well, then you\u2019re going to f\u2014 we\u2019re going to all face this letter, \u2018cause it\u2019s a nasty ass letter, and he wants her to get on the radio and talk about this, and I\u2014 I\u2014 uh, this is outrageous, I wouldn\u2019t dare<\/i> put this shit over the radio. (Pause, reads the letter) Pissed off. How come you didn\u2019t tell me? (Pause) Francine [Mason] told her\u2014 now what\u2019s this? Kim Yoon Ai said you didn\u2019t tell me\u2014 uh, Francine told her that she saw you and Tim talk\u2014 (unintelligible word) for Christ\u2019s sake\u2014 and other people been seeing you<\/i> and Tim talking, that fuck-up that should tell me while I\u2019m here. (Pause) I really appreciate this attitude out of somebody I\u2019ve s\u2014 I\u2019ve saved their life at my own expense. Well, I want to find out how many of you are involved in this. Doesn\u2019t justify his attitude. I can\u2019t under\u2014 I can\u2019t read this shit\u2014 (Stumbles for words, reads again) How come you never tell me about this? I called\u2014 I\u2019m\u2014 I\u2019m pissed<\/i> off royal now, and we\u2014 we should have told me yourself. What\u2019s going on? Are you trying to hide? (No longer reading) I would\u2014 I wouldn\u2019t take this shit. I wouldn\u2019t take this shit. If you women take this shit, you\u2019re crazy, and you men too. It\u2019s crazy shit. I think jealousy\u2019s not<\/i> love. \u2018S contrary to it. (Pause) Absolutely bullshit.<\/p>\n

Kim Yoon Ai:<\/b> Dad, what started it off, he came and talked to me about, he didn\u2019t want to stay and he was really pissed off and he talked\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I know he pissed off.<\/p>\n

Kim Yoon Ai:<\/b> Tiki\u2014 That was Tiki said, well, Shanda and Bruce is next to break up, and so he say, I want you to make sure<\/i> that Shanda<\/i>\u2014 tell her that I\u2019m still<\/i> with her, and then he said well don\u2019t\u2014 he said I heard about the rumors and stuff, but that we were supposed to break up and I was supposed to go with somebody else, and Shanda was supposed to go with Tim. I told him, I said that Shanda was not interested in anybody else, I said, they may have talked, but I said I don\u2019t think there\u2019s nothing else to it\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> They don\u2019t<\/i> talk. They haven’t been talking<\/i>. Where they been talking?<\/p>\n

Kim Yoon Ai:<\/b> I just said\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You started this shit. Now where they been talking?<\/p>\n

Kim Yoon Ai:<\/b> I\u2014 I ain\u2019t\u2014 I ain\u2019t saying nothing about them talking, I just said that, that\u2014<\/p>\n

People in audience call questions about rumors of breaking up.<\/p>\n

Kim Yoon Ai:<\/b> Oh, I said\u2014 I said, what if they\u2014 you know, I didn\u2019t know anything about the talking, he was so worried about her going uh, while he was in George\u2014 Georgetown, that he\u2014 she was going to break off with him and go with Tim. I said that, you know, if they did ever<\/i> talk, I said, it would be just to talk<\/i> \u2018cause I\u2019m sure, I said, I know<\/i> Shanda. (Unintelligible phrase) I told her that she would never do that.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Sighs)<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> And I feel that, I\u2014 I didn\u2019t say anything to \u2018em to ma\u2014 make \u2018em feel that he was\u2014 you know, Shanda was going to break up with him.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Getting ready to fight a revolution, and this<\/i> kind of bullshit going on.<\/p>\n

Billy Oliver:\u00a0<\/b>Unintelligible.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, I appreciate Billy, and that\u2019s what I said about you, you\u2014\u00a0I said to you last night, I\u2019m admire you, I admire you, that you uh, chose to date a lone, openly proudly past-practicing, or presently-practicing, I don\u2019t care, lesbian. And you didn\u2019t let nobody<\/i> bother you about that\u2014<\/p>\n

Unintelligible voice in crowd.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014 and to me, that\u2019s ad\u2014 admirable. Most men wouldn\u2019t do that.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> They wouldn\u2019t do that. They are so<\/i> intimidated, they can\u2019t even stand the thought like your brother [Bruce], the silly-ass, can\u2019t even stand because the thought of a man once being her boyfriend<\/i> \u2014 and she\u2019s had all of two<\/i>, from what I can gather \u2014 and you, you don\u2019t, you don\u2019t, you don\u2019t give a goddamn. You don\u2019t give a goddamn. You, you pick who you want, and I\u2014\u00a0I like a lot of characteristics I see in you.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> I agree, and I think it\u2019s too bad that some of\u2014 and people that are supposedly his friends<\/i>, you know, I\u2014 I\u2019ve just heard a lot of stupid ass little remarks, you know\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> About him<\/i>? Oh, they better not\u2014<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> About, about the relationship, you know, I\u2014 I\u2014 if you want me to say\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> They have? Yeah, tell me, tell me who. Just tell me<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> I honestly can\u2019t remember who said, I swear, I would say, but I\u2019ve heard stuff like uh\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones and Stephan talk over each other.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> They don\u2019t make any difference to you, and that\u2019s why I\u2014\u00a0(unintelligible) \u2018Course you<\/i> were the break. You\u2014\u00a0you\u2014 you\u2014\u00a0your parents didn\u2019t baby you, and they babied your brother [Bruce Oliver]. And that\u2019s the product of it. That\u2019s the product of being babied. All you been spoiled, boy, you are crippled. (Pause) You are better off by being the one that wasn\u2019t preferred.<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/b> I think he\u2014 now he\u2019s done something that\u2019s pretty rare. He\u2019s seen\u2014 he had<\/i> a brother before, and instead of emulating it, he went the other way. I mean, you know, he\u2019s had his problems, but I notice he\u2019s a far cry from what Bruce is. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Pause) \u2018Cause the shit\u2019s\u2014\u00a0a lot\u2014 lot\u2014 lot more shit, but I won\u2019t bring it all out till he\u2019s<\/i> here. Lot more shit. The shit\u2019s of hi\u2014 his\u2014 his overtures, there\u2019s shit of being hounded day after day after day. Now she\u2019s<\/i>\u00a0[Shanda] a schoolteacher, she\u2019s a dental technician, she got a whole hou\u2014 houseful of children, and you come home, and you want love to last, man\u2014 men, don\u2019t start that shit who fucked you and how something three years ago, what happened with you and somebody three years ago and how long did it last, and how big was it and all that crap. If you<\/i> want to keep love alive, you are killing it that way.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I can just tell you, that is a nice way to put an end to the thing called whatever you call it. It isn\u2019t love<\/i> yet. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Shawntiki: <\/b>Dad\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones: <\/b>I don\u2019t appreciate it when it gets on my goddamn radio, and I don\u2019t appreciate it when it\u2019s co\u2014 st\u2014 staggering my organization, (Pause) which is you<\/i>, my people. (Unintelligible) not gonna come home, wa\u2014 I want to come to Jonestown. Yeah, yeah, I bet. So he can watch who\u2019s talking to their wife. Well, it\u2019s me<\/i> talking to their wife. Let him talk to me.<\/p>\n

Shawntiki: <\/b>Dad, when we was in Georgetown, um, Bruce was talking\u2014 and so he was talking about um, couples that broke up, and so he made a crack about, you know, I had, my relationship with (unintelligible name) I said, so then, and the very end, I said, well, I guess you next, huh? And I\u2014 I think that\u2019s maybe what he took\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> He said what now?<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> I guess you\u2019re next.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Who? You\u2019re next?<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> No.<\/p>\n

Unintelligible voice.<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> This is what I was saying to him.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> He\u2019s (unintelligible) to you?<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/strong> About her relationship.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, I see.<\/p>\n

Shawntiki:<\/b> Uh-huh, and then at the very end, I said, I guess she next, huh. And we both started laughing about it. And then\u2014 (Pause) You know, may\u2014 that\u2014 maybe that\u2019s where he\u2014 where he took it.<\/p>\n

Kim Yoon Ai:<\/b> One thing he told me\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I\u2019ve never seen Shanda in that\u2014 that state. I\u2019ve never seen her that depressed, I\u2019ve never seen her that low and down, and it\u2019s affected her health. It\u2019s affected her whole balance<\/i>. And whoever in the hell fucking over this kid about his relationship better just cool it. \u2018Cause I admire you. I admire you, and I\u2019d admire any fellow <\/i>that will reach up and f\u2014 and I understand the subtle remarks made about Patricia and Donnie. To me\u2014 to me, they make an ideal couple. Ah, that\u2019s stupid shit. Who in the hell\u2014 the woman is sexually more mature than the man, who matures later, so what the hell\u2019s the difference, if somebody\u2019s older or younger, and to me, it shows a secure<\/i> male that can take with it\u2014 go\u2014 and go with a lesbian woman. That\u2019s a secure male, son. (Pause) They\u2019re<\/i> the fuck-ups. They\u2019re<\/i> the fuck-ups.<\/p>\n

Billy Oliver:\u00a0<\/b>Unintelligible.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Yeah, well, that\u2019s sweet of you, son. (Pause) The only reason they\u2019re saying I<\/i> couldn\u2019t handle it, \u2018cause if a woman\u2019s been with a woman, I couldn\u2019t handle\u2014 I\u2019d be afraid to get into bed because my dick wouldn\u2019t go up. That\u2019s what they\u2019re saying. They\u2019re really complimenting you.<\/p>\n

Scattered voices in crowd: <\/b>That\u2019s right. That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (louder) Yeah, you know it\u2019s right. You don\u2019t want to say amen, but it\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Applause<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> It\u2019s an ol\u2014 it\u2019s\u2014 it\u2019s one of the most cultural, one of the most terribly sick things I\u2019ve seen in the culture. You can\u2019t do nothing with the women\u2014 with the woman once she\u2019s been with another woman. They\u2014 That\u2019s\u2014 Really they\u2019re afraid for a woman to get with another woman because they realize what a loss<\/i> it\u2019s been with men. (Pause) Oh, yeah.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Laughter and applause<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Is\u2014 is it okay, um\u2014 someone messed up and I couldn\u2019t get the front gate security out, so can I\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Unintelligible word \u2014\u00a0sounds like “Maybe”)<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Thank you, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Thank you, son, but I can testify, \u2018cause I didn\u2019t\u2014\u00a0I looked at everything, I\u2019m sick and tired of hearing this<\/i> shit. And I looked at\u2014 I\u2019ve counseled him, I\u2019ve counseled Shanda, over and over about this matter. There\u2019s nothing to it, and I\u2019m sick of these goddamn rumors. And I\u2019m sick of jealousy.<\/p>\n

Murmurs in crowd.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/strong> (Whispers) Cynthia\u2019s not an inferior person.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, Cynthia, I (struggles for words) I think, uh, (struggles for words) no one needs to defend Cynthia. You could do\u2014 You do that. No one needs to defend her. She\u2019s shown her strength here.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> I just wanted to say, just because\u2014 I wanted to make it clear that Cynthia\u2019s a very beautiful person, too, you know we\u2019re talking about\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I think it\u2019s elementary. I don\u2019t think you have to discuss that kind of shit, and even bringing attention to it shows ah, (struggles for words) to me, some of the most beautiful women in the world are lesbian.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>That\u2019s right. (Applause after a few seconds)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> If you don\u2019t believe it\u2014 if you don\u2019t believe it, look at the best prostitutes in the United States. They\u2019re all<\/i> practicing lesbians. Those gals that get a hundred dollars for fifteen minutes, and $500 for (struggles for words) for the hour, huh, you find out, they\u2019re all lesbians.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> I\u2019d like to say, too, that there are\u2014 probably most of us in this room have a little lesbian in us, so let\u2019s\u2014 whether you want to face it or not\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Little? Little? Little?<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> A little or a lot, right.<\/p>\n

Male voice in crowd: <\/b>Whole bunch, Mom.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> (louder) Whole bunch.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Right. (Applause)<\/p>\n

Unintelligible voices.<\/p>\n

Penny Kerns:<\/b> I wanted to say that not only does Cynthia work in the machine shop, but she also made Michaeleen [Brady] some very (unintelligible word) jewelry.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Talking over woman) We do not have to defend Cynthia. (struggles for words) That\u2019s fine, but we\u2019re not going to have to stand here and defend Cynthia and his relationship, \u2018cause I\u2019ll\u2014 I will personally get rough on anybody that bothers them.<\/p>\n

Man:<\/b> I am uh, kinda concerned uh\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Let\u2019s don\u2019t get off on a diver\u2014\u00a0divergence right now.<\/p>\n

Man:<\/b> All right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Thank you. I\u2014 I\u2014 I didn\u2019t make myself clear. (Pause) Yeah.<\/p>\n

Young<\/b> Woman:<\/b> I want to say one other thing I did that really probably upset you\u2014 it upset me when he said it, he said, you know, here are the rumors, that\u2019s the way rumors work, and I said, those are old<\/i> rumors, I said, you shouldn\u2019t even listen to them, and he said, well, I want make\u2014 want you to tell Shanda to make sure I\u2019m still wearing her\u2014 the wedding band, something like that, and uh, if she\u2019s\u2014\u00a0if it\u2019s going to be broke up, she\u2019s<\/i> going to have to do it, because I<\/i> am not the kind of person who breaks off. I mean, you know\u2014<\/p>\n

Stephan:<\/strong> Unintelligible.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Go ahead. Go ahead. Say what you want to say. Say it.<\/p>\n

Kim Yoon Ai:<\/b> I\u2019ve known Bruce to be very flirtatious. I mean\u2014<\/p>\n

Stephan<\/strong>: <\/b>He doesn\u2019t have the goddamn (unintelligible word). If he doesn\u2019t care enough about the person to break it off with them, he\u2019ll just mess around, because, you know, he knows he can get away with it.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And he tells her that she thinks she\u2019s superior to him, and when he tells her, I\u2019m pissed off, get on the goddamn\u2014 (laughs).<\/p>\n

Stephan<\/strong>:<\/b> If you want to get down to it\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Stephan, Stephan. Shame. Um, uh, you\u2014 you\u2014 when you act\u2014 your superiority and inferiority has to do with your behavior<\/i>. Um, wha\u2014 when you tell somebody I\u2019m pissed off, you get on the radio and give me an answer, he\u2019s<\/i> the one, I want\u2014\u00a0I want to put this down, \u2018cause I want to deal with it. He\u2019s<\/i> the one thinks he\u2019s superior. Don\u2019t anybody<\/i> go once somebody says, (mimics older voice) you\u2019re gonna talk to me, goddammit, who you talking to, tell \u2018em, fuck yourself.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Fuck yourself.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Applause.<\/p>\n

(Tape static for 15 seconds)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014 no shit like that. I don\u2019t know nothing<\/i> about what him and Karen was doing.<\/p>\n

Unidentified<\/b> Male [could be Jim Jr.]:<\/b> I say, that\u2019s what he told, um\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Okay, I (stumbles over words) I didn\u2019t say nothing about it. I haven\u2019t talked to Karen, I haven\u2019t talked to him, that\u2019s bullshit. I\u2014 I\u2014\u00a0I don\u2019t know all about his\u2014 we\u2019ll talk to him about what he\u2019s<\/i> been doing when he gets here\u2014 but I\u2019m telling all<\/i> you people are sick, silly, to\u2014 to live<\/i> with that kind of hell, I would never let nobody discuss with me who I had been to bed with. If they had any love and confidence, they would\u2014 and they\u2014 there\u2019d be some trust<\/i>. When people do all this shit, they don\u2019t know anything about love. Just tell \u2018em to get lost. Don\u2019t let them even get under your skin. It\u2019s not worth the trip. (Pause) I don\u2019t believe there\u2019s any<\/i> place for jealousy in love. (Deliberate) That\u2019s my firm belief on that matter. It may take a while to get there, but I don\u2019t believe there\u2019s any<\/i> place for it. If you love somebody \u2014 and I love everybody, and not just everybody here \u2014 I want anybody be happy. If Mother tonight could find happiness\u2014\u00a0but when you get intelligence, you don\u2019t find happiness in sex, it takes something more than that. But I\u2014\u00a0that\u2019s my opinion. That\u2019s my own subjective opinion. But if she\u2014 if anybody here tonight\u2014 though she (stumbles over words) there had been no other man in her life except me, I would be\u2014 be so<\/i> happy for her, if she gets some happiness. And that\u2019s<\/i> love. And you<\/i> people, going around possessing each other\u2014 you just don\u2019t know what love is. Quit talking about it. Don\u2019t use the word. You dirty it.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Delayed applause.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> And I\u2014 What I\u2019m afraid<\/i> about, I wouldn\u2019t even discuss it, but it\u2019s gonna ki\u2014 it\u2019s gonna stop our revolution. It\u2019s gonna stop us from being able to function. Goddamn, I just uh, I just\u2014 I can\u2019t see this. Everybody loses their strength<\/i>, they lose their courage, they lose their ability to use their brain, and they drain everybody else<\/i>, like him bouncing on her all night, about what in the hell, who in the hell\u2014 Who in the hell? One person, two years, three years back. That\u2019s stupid. \u2018S goddamn stupid, it\u2019s sickening. And then there\u2019s a lot of others of you doing this shit. (Pause) And I say, cool it. If you\u2014 if you\u2019re a socialist, you won\u2019t be preoccupied who\u2014 who screwed your companion or who may have dated<\/i> your companion before you knew them. It\u2019s an admission of your own impotency, and your own homosexuality\u2019s glaringly in your face, and you can\u2019t stand it, so face what it is. Plus, it\u2019s usually a guilty conscience. Every time I hear this shit, you can better<\/i> believe that somebody\u2019s doing ten<\/i> times more than they think their partner\u2019s<\/i> doing.<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (low voice) Well, I haven\u2019t uh, any more to say on the subject. I\u2019ve already found out (pause) enough uh\u2014 I\u2019ve already found out enough. Be prepared to face this letter and deny it then, huh? (Pause) That\u2019s good. (Pause) I have to decide whether to bring him<\/i> [Bruce Oliver] back before the time of duty. How long Mike Cartm\u2014 Carter in there, how long were you in there without your wife? (Pause) And his child, you know his baby here, how long were you there?<\/p>\n

Carter: <\/b>(in audience) Three months.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Three months. How long you stay in the United States without your child? And your wife?<\/p>\n

Carter:<\/b> Uh\u2014 four.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Four months. I hope all of you hearing this out here, when you\u2019re asked to do something. I can\u2019t shift<\/i> people. I can\u2019t even shift people, because I<\/i> not going do it. I don\u2019t want to do it.<\/p>\n

Jack Beam:<\/b> Hmm.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, that\u2019s the\u2014 that\u2019s certainly a very poor socialistic attitude.<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd:<\/b> Right.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I don\u2019t like this meeting<\/i>. But I do<\/i> it, because it\u2019s essential<\/i>. Even though it\u2019s probably a waste in a lot of people\u2019s minds, it doesn\u2019t achieve much. Shift, please.<\/p>\n

Inaudible voice in crowd.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> What\u2019d you say?<\/p>\n

Stephan<\/strong>:<\/b> I say, I wouldn\u2019t trust his ass\u2014 (voice fades under Jones\u2019 sigh)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You have a point. (Long pause) Well, I\u2019m glad to hear that it\u2019s not rumor-mongering all over the goddamn place, it\u2019s just what\u2019s in his own insecure mind. Now, did we finish all the follow-up on this um, livestock\u2014 agricultural livestock commission and so forth?<\/p>\n

New voice:<\/b> The topic that we\u2014 that just came up was whether or not we should start cutting the bush again, where or when we should start cutting it.<\/p>\n

Stephan<\/strong>:<\/b> Right. (Pause) (struggles for words) Why\u2014 I don\u2019t\u2014 I don\u2019t understand why we need to cut the bush. I\u2014 I\u2014 That\u2019s my main question\u2014<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> Uh\u2014 It was\u2014 It\u2019s, uh, one that I had tabled and Dad said to bring it up every twice in a while and see how much longer we wanted to wait, so I was just seeing how much longer\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I guess we continue to post\u2014 and then do it, and that\u2019s what\u2014<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> About another month\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s right, you were so instructed, you were so instructed. (Pause) Did All the King’s Men<\/em> get ordered. Dr. [Richard] Tropp said, I don\u2019t know, Dr. Tropp, will you find out? It sure didn\u2019t get here tonight on the\u2014<\/p>\n

Tropp:<\/b> It was ordered.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (soft laugh) It was ordered, yeah. We need clarification what crews should be doing in heavy rain. Work. (Laughs)<\/p>\n

Scattered laughter in crowd.<\/p>\n

Another<\/b> Woman:<\/b> I had someone come in and ask me tonight.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You\u2014 you\u2014\u00a0you think it\u2019s been heavy rain, huh?<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> When it blows in your ears before it hits the ground, then\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Laughs) Ahhh. Well, what do<\/i> we do? What do we do? Is it a problem? (Pause) We\u2019re gonna melt<\/i>?<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> I think some of the\u2014 some of the crews came in, and I had one person come into the office and ask where they went when they came in, and I didn\u2019t know they were coming in, so I thought I better find out.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Incredulous) Do you honestly mean that people qu\u2014 uh, quit because of rain?<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> I think so.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Young, middle-age people, even the seniors\u2014 you don\u2019t see the seniors out there in their gardens, that goddamn rain can come down, you can\u2019t see through the\u2014 through the mist and they\u2019ll be out there (struggles for words) their hat isn\u2019t even moving. (Pause) Hoeing away. (Pause) They\u2019re doing something. (Pause) What have you got\u2014 You got an answer for this, folks? What do we do? We gonna call it quits when it rains? (Pause)<\/p>\n

Another male voice [could be Jeff Carey]:<\/b> I say when the rai\u2014 when the\u2014 \u2018cause this is the\u2014 this is the time now when the\u2014 some of the heavy winds start to come, so I\u2019d say, get completely away from the trees, couple hundred feet away from the trees, and continue working. That\u2019s what we did down here for four years.<\/p>\n

Deeper male voice:<\/b> Right. (Pause) A lot of times, it\u2014 ah, in the past we\u2019ve arranged work that could be done in some of the shelters so that, instead of doing that work in the sunshine that could be done in the shelters\u2014 and go from the rain into the shelters and continue right on working.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, that\u2019s right, you know, if you got a crew design, I think that farm analyst ought to come up with that. But I do<\/i> think we ought not to take it upon ourselves when the rain<\/i> comes just to go on home and uh, take a nap. That uh, uh, we won\u2019t build an organization doing that<\/i>. Do you think?<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> No.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> How many agree with that? (Pause) What?<\/p>\n

Inaudible voices in audience.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I didn\u2019t hear you.<\/p>\n

Inaudible voices in audience.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> How many think we ought to continue to work<\/i> while\u2014 wh\u2014 when the rains come? (Pause) How many feel we shouldn\u2019t? And I\u2014 also, how many feel that we should plan\u2014 each crew should plan things for<\/i> rain, pl\u2014 plan the kind of work that\u2019s profitable? (Pause) No one should leave without approval. Hmm? Who said what?<\/p>\n

Male voice [Carey?]:<\/b> I said, I think that should be clarified, because like if you\u2019re out in the fields, and you\u2019re\u2014 you\u2019re weeding or something, and it starts to rain, I don\u2019t think\u2014 you know like if you\u2019re somewhere and then you\u2019ve gotta walk thirty or twenty minutes to go somewhere else and start work, I think that\u2019s crap, you should stay in that spot and I think your work should be planned out, so like now if tomorrow, it starts to rain before, you know, before you really start into your work, then<\/i>, you know, you could go somewhere else under shelter, and work before, you know, rain happens on you.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> One thing\u2014 and that\u2019s another thing he did<\/i> say that\u2019s important, stay 200 feet away from the trees. (Pause) The electricity struck here one time, and it was a miracle. Okay, we need clarification (struggles for words) come in\u2014 Is the drainage problem near East House well-solved? Did our stretchers get returned from Georgetown boat crew?<\/p>\n

Male in crowd [Mike Carter?]:<\/b> One of them came back just fine\u2014<\/p>\n

Several voices talk low.<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> Barbara has made four stretchers. Barbara has made four stretchers, and all he has to do is\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (talking over woman): That was all (unintelligible) so they got lost, huh? Let\u2019s don\u2019t let them go, because they certainly\u2014 we\u2019re going to have to tell Georgetown, they\u2014 they\u2019ve lost<\/i> them, probably taken them on to the ha\u2014 the hospital, wherever the hell they were going. (Pause) (Reading from list) Is the drainage problem near\u2014 Oh, I don\u2019t know where I\u2019m at. (Reading from list) Is the sign at the front gate completed? It was. Somebody was bragging about it. Did we take the\u2014 the stop out and put down a (Pause) Now, I said to Patty [Cartmell], that a\u2014<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd too soft.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> He said you told her to going out to\u2014 when you\u2019re going out to\u2014 (Pause) He just got back. (Pause) Well, how can he do anything to me, then?<\/p>\n

Patty Cartmell:<\/b> I just told him tonight\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s what I\u2019m say\u2014 Okay, but say<\/i> that, Patty. You didn\u2019t say that. (Pause) Oh, I wanted it down this morning<\/i>. I wanted somebody told about this morning, because some\u2014 one of the fart faces, the CIA probably, um, one of the lackeys of Yankee imperialism\u2014 said, it\u2019s a lovely sign but you got “Stop” in it. Well I think, we\u2014 can\u2019t we have a post<\/i>, a pole that goes over there and then\u2014 then some way doesn\u2019t look like a barb wire thing, so we don\u2019t have to have “Stop” and then they\u2019ll automatically be made to stop. Is there something we can think up creatively?<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd too soft.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Let them run into the cable<\/i>. That\u2019s right. (Pause) Got the cable, let\u2019s put the cable across the road.<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> The cable is up, Dad, the cable (radio interference for five seconds). The sign was only made to prevent any accidents from happening, because it\u2019s so close to the turn.<\/p>\n

Another voice: <\/b>You have to put some luminance on it, so you can see at nighttime.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Okay, okay, now what can we do? Can we put a different sign\u2014<\/p>\n

Voice:<\/b> We can put “Caution”\u2014<\/p>\n

Voice:<\/b> We can remove the “Stop” and just have (radio interference for five seconds).<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> What about “Caution”? What about “Caution”? (Pause) “Caution.”<\/p>\n

Harriet Tropp:<\/b> Drive with care? Drive with caution?<\/p>\n

Several voices.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> If it\u2019s on the chain, if it\u2019s on the\u2014 yeah, “Drive with caution,” I think that might be better. Sarah [Harriet Sarah Tropp]. Drive with caution. Then they\u2019ll know<\/i> it\u2019s a damn thing hanging there, they can\u2019t go through<\/i> it. And it covers a\u2014\u00a0(Pause) Okay. (Pause) Warnings (stumbles over words on list) Did I finish all of the follow-up (stumbles over words on list). What time is the trailer to be leaving for the piggery in the morning with the crews? They seem to be leaving very late. What time is it supposed to be leaving?<\/p>\n

Murmurs.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Seven o\u2019clock. Let\u2019s see that it does<\/i>, then, huh?<\/p>\n

Tish:<\/b> They haven\u2019t been even lining up at that time. (Pause) It\u2019s been as late as 7:20 and 7:30.<\/p>\n

Murmurs.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Okay, a warning, and next time, we\u2019ll deal with that more severely. (Reads) Can we have clarification of policy on persons researching in the agricultural office doing evaluations in there during crew time? How much can be done on work time, and how much must be done on personnel time? Specific policies need to be set, please. Teacher preparation time also for the analysts who are now teaching school as well and have cor\u2014 curricu\u2014 curriculums to appear\u2014 to prepare. (Pause) Well, what about it?<\/p>\n

Tish:<\/b> Christine, uh, Talley used the, uh, reason that the analysts were sitting there a particular day she came in. Some were doing evaluations that day, and some were doing research for their school classes as a reason why she should be able to come in through the day and do her study. She has not been in at night at all on this\u2014 uh, her own time. The analysts do<\/i> pretty much come in at night for most of their research, but I felt that since somebody was taking exception to what they were doing, we should set some policy on how much time people would be allowed, ah, during work hours to uh, study, and nobody can claim exception.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, can\u2019t you analysts and she included get together and decide this? (Pause) Will all you analysts speak up? (Pause) Tish<\/i> is outspoken, but some of you are too passive. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> We can bring it up Sunday night and set a time limit what we feel we need.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Thank you. That\u2019s the, uh, end of that<\/i>, isn\u2019t it? (Pause) Okay. Warnings. Dawn Gardfrey and Dee Dee Lawrence [aka Jeanette Blugina Duckett] are amongst students who just got back from Georgetown. They were disruptive in class today. (Pause) Marcus Anderson called his teacher. He was praised on his job, yes\u2014 but he called her a string of names yesterday, and acted generally outrageous. He disrupted an entire<\/i> class. Teacher was Mike Lund. He was called in a teacher\u2019s meeting, discussed this on Wednesday. He\u2019d first seemed to be apologetic, but then got a nasty attitude and defended himself, and argued with the teachers. He was not willing to face what he did wrong. He was told he\u2014 we would have to discuss this in public. He also gave math teacher James Turner dirty looks\u2014 James Turner dirty looks and made remarks under the\u2014 his breath after the teacher\u2019s meeting. (Pause) Problem. Several students on all night security claim they cannot go to high school because of their schedules. Right now they are going to socialism class. They\u2019re not taking math and language classes. Should they get security shifts reduced to go to school (Pause) anyway, or would we keep things the same way? This involves four of our five\u2014 four or five students. Who are they?<\/p>\n

Voices too low.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Which boy? (Pause) Marcus Anderson kept referring to the gi\u2014 women as pussy on the bi\u2014 boat?<\/p>\n

Male voice:<\/b> Called her pussy\u2014 (Other voices overwhelm)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Who is it? Who is it? Quickly, let\u2019s get it over with here. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Jim Jr.:\u00a0<\/b>(fades in) \u2014about security clearance. Um, Dick, Dick (unintelligible), myself, Johnny or Tim onto these matters and then\u2014 and then we can work them out, because I\u2014 I\u2014 I\u2014 I don\u2019t know nothing about it, about the people working for me. (Unintelligible)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Who was he calling pussy, son? Who were you doing this for?<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> He was doing that in there, and Johnny called you down. Johnny Cobb. He finally stopped you from your (radio breakup for one word), but you was making nasty<\/i> remarks to sisters\u2014\u00a0What was that you called them, pussies\u2014<\/p>\n

John Cobb:<\/b> I don\u2019t know, he was calling\u2014 he was calling somebody pussy, finally turned around and called little Lisa Williams a pussy, and that\u2019s when I told him to shut up.<\/p>\n

Pause, background noises.<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> He\u2019s in my socialism class, and his knowledge is very poor. He doesn\u2019t know the definition of socialism, he had no news, none whatsoever, and I covered a whole bunch of news before I got to him. He\u2014 He\u2019s\u2014\u00a0He\u2019s piss poor<\/i> in everything I\u2019ve asked him. I asked him what was capitalism<\/i>, I asked him what was imperialism<\/i>, he doesn\u2019t know anything, and he\u2019s been here for a while, I believe.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well. (Pause) I know you had a he\u2014 a hectic situation, son, but do you realize the wrongness of calling anybody a\u2014\u00a0a pussy? That\u2014 That\u2019s like calling somebody a nigger, that\u2019s a degrading word. How\u2019d you like if someone called you di\u2014 a\u2014 a dickie?<\/p>\n

Marcus Anderson:<\/b> I wouldn\u2019t like it.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> It\u2019s\u2014 it\u2019s derogatory, I mean, it\u2019s cut<\/i> down, it\u2019s a put<\/i> down, son. (Pause) This is his\u2014 He\u2019s not had a\u2014 the one\u2014 This is his first warning since Learning? Now son will you, uh, straighten yourself up? You<\/i> don\u2019t want to go back to Learning. (Pause) You\u2019re all a bright bunch of kids in that family. (Pause) Okay.<\/p>\n

Marcus: <\/b>Thank you, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Don Gardfrey and Dee Dee Lawrence, (unintelligible). (Pause) Now who were the four or five students you were talking about? (Reads.) Students are working on apprenticeship and vocational training in fifteen areas around the community. The program is going generally well, according to reports. Regular classes in the afternoon also generally going well, though we had a problem with students arriving late to classes. And this better stop, because they\u2019ll get warnings, and that\u2019ll\u2014\u00a0two warnings leads to Learning. We have been stressing knowledge of basic geography in our classes. Stressing<\/i> a knowledge of basic geography. We sure do need it. As I said, I appreciate Comrade [Robert Louis] Christian\u2019s maps so<\/i> much. Let\u2019s have them everywhere. How many have studied the map? We don\u2019t know\u2014 we don\u2019t know<\/i> our country. We don\u2019t know our continent. And that\u2019s the\u2014 where\u2014 how many know where the Horn of Africa is? How many know where it\u2019s at now?<\/p>\n

Murmurs.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> The Horn of Africa. (Pause) The map should be so it could be taken down sometime, it\u2019s too late tonight, but it\u2019s shown\u2014\u00a0The Horn of Africa? Point up there where it\u2019s at. Somebody got a stick?<\/p>\n

Low voices.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Higher, isn\u2019t it? (Pause) It\u2019s where\u2014 it\u2019s where the Red Sea empties down, the Suez Canal, you\u2019ll see the body of water emptying down, it\u2019s on up there. Somalia and Ethiopia. How many understand Ethiopia and Somalia now? You\u2019ve heard enough about it. Who\u2019s backing Ethiopia?<\/p>\n

Voices reply discordantly.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Soviet Union. What is\u2014 is\u2014\u00a0what\u2014 which nation\u2019s black?<\/p>\n

Members of crowd: <\/b>Ethiopia.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Ethiopia. That\u2019s right. (Pause) Somalians have got black background, but they\u2019re mostly Arabs. Whole lot of folk think they\u2019re not black unless they\u2019re (Pause) you know\u2014 I don\u2019t know. (Pause) (Reads) Dad, it would be good if you could stress the students the importance of getting the foundation forma\u2014 information, and I will<\/i> stress it now<\/i>. We\u2019re testing all students in every area\u2014 every area every week, and we will expect that the students will get good grades and make an effort to learn. The library is not used enough at night, and should<\/i> be, since very little homework is given. (Pause) I still didn\u2019t hear the four or five students, so I\u2019m\u2014\u00a0I can\u2019t answer something I don\u2019t know.<\/p>\n

Jim Jr.:<\/strong>\u00a0unintelligible.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Praises are Marice Anderson, work has picked up since confronted and he has shown a better attitude. Extra food, what is going to be this week? Candy?<\/p>\n

Several voices: <\/b>Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s right. It\u2019s going to be candy, isn\u2019t it. (Pause) (Calls out) Fudge.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Applause.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Dov Lundquist (Pause) has spent many hours working hard on the garden around the cottage that Kay Nelson and Clara Johnson live in. That\u2019s sweet. (Pause) Mary Wotherspoon and Vicky Moore\u2014 Morton helped clean the area where the banana suckers were cleaned. By the way, how was Joyce behaving uh, uh, I mean taking the pressure of uh, how is Joyce taking the pressure, Joyce Johnson, of this mess that happened last week?<\/p>\n

Voices.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Janice, huh? Well, I\u2014 you can\u2019t ah\u2014<\/p>\n

Voices.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Oh. (Pause) Well, you can\u2019t keep\u2014 you can\u2019t uh\u2014<\/p>\n

Voices.<\/p>\n

Janice Johnson:<\/b> Well, um\u2014 I mean, personally, I\u2019m not hurt about uh, Stanley fucking around with another person \u2018cause it\u2019s nothing to be jealous about, you know. I mean, I ain\u2019t going to cry over a dick or nothing like that. It just pissed me off that\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You\u2019re sweet. I like that\u2014<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> \u2014he, you know, he\u2019s always having to fuck up and\u2014 I mean, I know it causes you pain because he\u2014 he must\u2014 um, jeopardize this cause a lot of times, and that\u2019s what bothering me<\/i> right now, you know, but personally, you know, it don\u2019t make no difference\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You\u2019re an emancipated woman, and I salute you.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Applause.<\/p>\n

Clara LaNue Johnson:<\/b> Dad, I would like to say that I certainly appreciate, um\u2014\u00a0I don\u2019t know, maybe it was just the timing, but um, I really appreciate your concern for Janice, because, I don\u2019t know if\u2014 I saw a little<\/i> bit of the deep hurt I\u2019m sure you must have felt in protecting her\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Terribly (unintelligible word)<\/p>\n

Clara:<\/b> I\u2014 I\u2014 I could see it, I\u2014\u00a0I don\u2019t know. It was something that touched me very very deeply, and also\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Thank you.<\/p>\n

Clara:<\/b> \u2014I wanted to thank you for healing<\/i> her, saving her eye last week. She could have lost it. When Janice came to me, um, I think she had been looking for me earlier, but by the time she got to me, uh, she had gone to Joyce and uh, she came to me, she said, I\u2019m all right. And I said I was concerned about that, Janice, but I know that Dad has always\u2014 and he is<\/i> in control, and whatever happens, you know, that he (Pause) would have the right person to talk to her. And uh, later she discussed it with me and I told her that, um, I guess that was the first time I really<\/i> could understand the guilt of having a child and bringing<\/i> a child into this world, but um, the only<\/i> thing good that I could see in having them was that I had brought four socialists into the world, and that I<\/i>\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, that\u2019s uh, that\u2019s one thing we guess we can compensate for our guilt, because we need fighters. I uh, cut it short because I\u2014 I\u2019m under a great urge to pee, and I don\u2019t want to\u2014 I want to get\u2014 get through so that I won\u2019t have to uh, take a stop to pee. Thank you, thank you very much. (Laughs.)<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Laughter.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Chuckie Henderson. (Pause) Chuckie Henderson, Bonnie Simon, Doug Sanders, Shirley Hed\u2014\u00a0Edwards, Denise Hunter report that they disagree with Tinetra Johnson\u2019s report that got Chuckie on the Learning Crew. They say he is a good worker with a good attitude. (Pause) I\u2014 But I wonder where you people were the other night.<\/p>\n

Several voices: <\/b>That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> Chuckie was on the board\u2014<\/p>\n

Several voices.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I think it\u2019s a slight late, don\u2019t you, this is a slight late report? (Laughs) Where is Ch\u2014 Where is uh, (Pause) Chuckie Henderson? (Pause)<\/p>\n

Couple of voices in general murmur:<\/b> Right there. Right here.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I\u2014 I\u2014 I\u2014 I can\u2019t understand this. (Pause) Well, what ah\u2014\u00a0what ah\u2014 he\u2019s been on there for two days<\/i>, he\u2019s been on there for two days, and you people have all been silent?<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> What if he\u2019d been executed or something? Been a little late, wouldn\u2019t it, to speak up?<\/p>\n

Male [could be Doug Sanders]:<\/b> The night that\u2014\u00a0the night that Chuckie Henderson ah\u2014 that all of this happened, I was on security\u2014 (unintelligible with Jones talking over) at the front gate and I didn\u2019t\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (talks over security) Well, she\u2019s making a number of things, charged with the, the lad, but I don\u2019t remember what it was, because I don\u2019t hold things against people.<\/p>\n

Shirley Edwards:<\/b> Dad, the night, uh, Tinetra made the report, uh, like uh, I didn\u2019t know nothing about she was going to write him up for, on uh, Learning Crew or nothing, so when she\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Shh!<\/p>\n

Shirley:<\/b> \u2014 uh, like uh, who made the evaluation on Monday morning, and then uh, Bonnie, Doug and I talked about it, you know. I was supposed to turn Netra in, and so\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, where were you on the floor?<\/p>\n

Shirley:<\/b> I mean, uh, the reason I didn\u2019t get up there and say anything about it at the time, you know, I didn\u2019t want to put down the supervisor, you know, since (unintelligible word) had made the recommenda\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You\u2019re putting down the supervisor now<\/i>?<\/p>\n

Shirley:<\/b> I\u2014<\/p>\n

Voices call out questions.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> Yeah, what\u2014 what if\u2014 I mean, you know, what if this had been in a different setting and it had been a court of law and they\u2019d gone out and hung him. Been a little late, wouldn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> We don\u2019t believe in capital punishment\u2014<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> No, we don\u2019t believe\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014but what if it\u2019d been six months in prison?<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> I mean\u2014 but I\u2019m talking about more in this setting, not here.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Or a year, or two years.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> I want to\u2014 Could I make a suggestion? In the medical department, when we<\/i> write someone up, when the supervisor writes someone up for Learning Crew, that<\/i> person is called in with me, Ava Jones and someone to take notes of the meeting, and that<\/i> person knows<\/i> they\u2019re going to be written up, and have a right<\/i> to answer to their charges then<\/i>. Is it possible to make that kind of a procedure for every crew<\/i>? (Pause) Is it possible that we could do it before<\/i> the fact instead of after the fact, after someone has spent two days on Learning Crew? Could every crew do it that way? (Pause) Would that meet with your\u2014 with your approval, Dad?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Yes, I\u2014 as long as it doesn\u2019t take enormous time out of production, which we\u2019re already having difficulties with.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> Okay. But if they do it after<\/i> the fact anyway<\/i>, why not before<\/i> the fact?<\/p>\n

Female voice: <\/b>(fades in) \u2014 would they do uh, crew analysis, you know what I\u2019m saying, at the end of the day?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Crew analysis at the end of the day? Yes. (Pause) Sure would be better than this<\/i>.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> But Tinetra, she, uh, didn\u2019t make the evaluation, she made it right there on the floor that night. (Pause) She\u2014\u00a0she said she was going to write it up the next day.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, her co\u2014\u00a0companion\u2014\u00a0his companion spoke up about something too, I don\u2019t know whose it was. (Pause) What?<\/p>\n

Female [likely Patricia Henderson]:<\/b> (voice cuts in) \u2014 He don’t do nothing with me. When I\u2019m\u2014 ask him to do something, take him five or six hours before he do it.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> So he didn\u2019t\u2014 he did learn something about work structure, but we will, uh\u2014 yes, uh, Reb.<\/p>\n

James “Reb” Edwards:<\/b> Uh, I\u2014\u00a0I\u2014 I work with him\u2014 with him in this windrow down here, and he had\u2014 he had a bad attitude, and he would go off to the\u2014\u00a0and he would go off to the bathroom and he\u2019d stay there half an hour, and she kept warning him and telling him that he was a\u2014\u00a0and I told<\/i> him too, I said, you\u2019re a prime candidate for\u2014\u00a0for the Learning Crew. And I kept telling him. And she<\/i> told him too, she says, I keep warning you, Chuck, so, if\u2014 if she didn\u2019t do it right, he was a candidate to it anyway, in my book.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> Well, I don\u2019t\u2014 I don\u2019t think the issue\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Sounds to me like\u2014\u00a0sounds to me like the case has already been settled, if he<\/i> did that to you.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> I don\u2019t think the issue is with Tinetra [Fain] so much as that you people that waited till after the fact\u2014 now he, if he was gone, he couldn\u2019t help<\/i> it. But you could, to bring your point up. That\u2019s all I\u2019m saying.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well, we shall see his attitude change, change, I don\u2019t like to take up your time, you don\u2019t need to defend your analysis, if he did that one time, you got a ground to throw him on, throw him off. But you need to get yourself uh, he had the\u2014 he had all the grounds to be put in the uh, the uh, the Learning. (Pause) If what Reb tells me \u2014 and I believe in Reb, I\u2019ve seen him back it up with his dollars and his sacrifice. (Pause) So I\u2014 I believe in that, and that, that\u2019s settled<\/i>. He\u2014\u00a0He\u2014 He certainly needed to learn something about structure, his companion brought out enough that uh, warranted him being on Learning. Now I think a lot of time you people may have battled amongst yourselves, so you get your crew analysis together, beforehand. (Pause) As she said, after<\/i> work, you do the crew analysis as to whose work is not up to par, who deserves praise, okay? (Pause) You\u2019re off. (Pause) Now take advantage of it, though, because you\u2019ve been given special consideration. (Pause) Does he understand that?<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> You\u2019re off.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> So ch\u2014 change all your negative attitudes. (Pause) Praises, Marvin Janaro, conscientious worker for medical clinic, works late into the night and do a d\u2014\u00a0day job. Mike Lund [Mike Rozynko] comes in at 12 every night to the nurse\u2019s office to clean the floor. These things need to be uh, put down in careful fashion, \u2018cause I\u2019m concerned that everybody gets their credit. Don Fields ran all the way to the experimental kitchen in the rain to catch Orde Dennis to make sure she took her medication when she left without taking it in front of the dispensary. That\u2019s wonderful, Don. I appreciate that. \u2018Cause you come a long way. Pat Patterson? Very hard worker with a steady pace, always has a pleasant attitude. Willie Reed, Ophelia Rodgers, Artee Harper, Nancy Clay, Lucille Taylor, Mary Bailey, Bea Dawkins excellent, consistent night workers. Joyce Brown has picked up her pace and has worked steady with a good attitude since warning. Warnings. Janet Lenin [Janet Tupper]? Always has an excuse for the nurse. She suddenly gets sick when she finds out how hard work is going to be. She has a slow pace of work. Mellonie Kemp? Needs to pick up pace, constantly arguing with the crew members. Clarence Klingman? Works well but needs to quit being defensive when confronted. Wanders around too much. Always has an excuse for being late. Tries to get an easy job to get out of the fields\u2014\u00a0Stop me if any of these people have had two warnings. (Pause) Janet and Clarence both?<\/p>\n

Female voice away from mike:<\/b> They had\u2014 they had one warning this\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That\u2019s\u2014\u00a0it\u2019s\u2014\u00a0this is two<\/i>. Learning then. Uses working with the birds as an excuse to be late, but is observed wandering around. (Pause) You people\u2014\u00a0I don\u2019t think you love Learning that much. Why do you keep this up? (Pause) Keith Wade, works well, but needs to stop si\u2014 siding with the crew against the supervisor.<\/p>\n

Murmurs.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> The following people\u2014 he also got a praise, so that will negate it. (Pause) Get him one more, that gets one more time. The following people give trouble at the food line\u2014 but don\u2019t do this no more, don\u2019t\u2014 don\u2019t st\u2014 when you bo\u2014when you argue with supervision, you hamper the whole program. (Pause) The following people give trouble at the food line. L.V. McKinnis comes to the front of the line so he doesn\u2019t have to wait. Pearl Land, diabetic, says that Dad said she should\u2014 she could have sugar. You goddamn people (mumbles). Chlotile Butler, diabetic, tries to sneak sugar. Marion Campbell, diabetic, tries to sneak sugar. Lillian Malloy, caught trying to bring back half a plate of rice, got hostile and said go ahead and write me up. Uh-oh. That\u2019s it. Go ahead and write me up. (Screams) Go ahead and write me up. (Normal voice) That\u2019s anarchy, Lilly Malloy. Step forward, in Learning Crew. Anybody says, go ahead and write me up, is defying all the orders of the whole<\/i> movement, so get your ass in there. (Pause) (Deliberate) Where is she? (Pause) Well, get her off security. Be on the night for Learning Crew. (Screams) Don\u2019t you ever\u2014\u00a0don\u2019t you ever say, write me up. Don\u2019t you dare anybody to write you up. I don\u2019t care what you\u2019ve done, whether you\u2019re in the wrong or not, don\u2019t you dare say write me up, (voice to normal) \u2018cause we\u2019ll put you on the Learning Crew. \u2018Cause it\u2019s the most blasphemous, anarchistic statement that can be made. What?<\/p>\n

Voice in crowd: <\/b>(fades in) \u2014\u00a0write up several things he had done, said, go ahead and write me up\u2014 (Radio breakup)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Chlotile Butler says go ahead, write me up, see if I care? (Screams) Learning Crew. Young, the old, middle-aged, don\u2019t make no difference, Learning Crew. Learning Crew. Learning Crew.<\/p>\n

Beam:<\/b> Hey (Unintelligible) Anna, bring her up here. (Pause) No, l\u2014 let security do it.<\/p>\n

Voices too far from mike.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> She what?<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> (mike cuts in) \u2014clap tonight, and she said she had nothing to clap about.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Screams) Oh, you have nothing to clap about. You want to start our night [White Night] tonight. (Pause) (Low, angry voice) Goddamn, I don\u2019t why you live so long.<\/p>\n

Penny Kerns:<\/b> Joyce went and asked her to clap\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Got nothing to clap about, huh?<\/p>\n

Kerns:<\/b> \u2014 and, sh\u2014 she refused Joycie.<\/p>\n

Long pause.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Shouts) I will venture to say in the office of the metaphysician. By the next meeting, you<\/i> will have wished you clapped, tonight. Dismissed, because you\u2019re gonna get judgment.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> (voice fades into mike) \u2014she told me (unintelligible word) yesterday, say I\u2014 I\u2014 she said, asked me was I through whining (Jones talks over her)\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That means sickness, when I say that.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> \u2014and I\u2014 I told\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Or something else.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> I told her, not quite (unintelligible)\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You people don\u2019t listen to a thing you\u2019re told.<\/p>\n

General crowd noise.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Just love to keep us up at this goddamn miserable hour. (Pause) Lilly Malloy, why? Why did you say, go ahead and write me up to sister?<\/p>\n

Malloy:<\/b> (fades in) \u2014 I got so angry, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You get\u2014 you know\u2014 the only word you all better write in your brains, whether we have 70 I.Q. or 180, don\u2019t say, go ahead and write me up. You\u2019re in trouble.<\/p>\n

Malloy:<\/b> (fades in) \u2014give me rice, more rice to eat. I did eat it all. And I put the plate in the back, and I say, if this is litter, go ahead and write me up, but I eat the rice. I didn\u2019t leave anything in the plate. I put everything, the clean plate back on the si\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Said, caught trying to bring back half a plate of rice. Got hostile and said, go ahead and write me up. Be sure and write me up. (Pause) We have any other complaints about her?<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> No, Dad, not in the last month.<\/p>\n

Second<\/b> Female:<\/b> Dad, can I say something?<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Yes.<\/p>\n

Second female:<\/b> There was a little\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (talks over) Who made the charge?<\/p>\n

Long pause<\/p>\n

Another female:<\/b> I made the charge, and when I wrote it up, I said she had ate the plate, but I\u2014 I wrote up that she had said write it up, and then I told her I was writing it up, and she said, be sure you write it up. But I also wrote up that she ate the rice, too.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I have not heard any other complaints about work or performance. Is there any other complaints about this woman. I have heard other complaints about Comrade Butler. Many. (Pause) Do you realize how willful and how daring you are to my office, Mrs. Butler, by saying you\u2019ve got nothing to clap about? (Pause) Do you realize how much you\u2019re daring<\/i> to my power, and I must prove my power, no matter how much I love you, \u2018cause you say you\u2019ve got nothing to clap about tonight?<\/p>\n

Butler:<\/b> Well, what it was\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> How, if you can\u2019t get out of your bed\u2014 if you can\u2019t get out of your bed between now and next meeting, would you think you should have had something to clap about tonight?<\/p>\n

Butler:<\/b> Yes.<\/p>\n

General hubbub. Several members urge her to say, “Yes, Dad.”<\/p>\n

Butler:<\/b> Yes, Dad.<\/p>\n

Pause.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Force me to do things I don\u2019t want to do. You force<\/i> me to make examples, to prove that I can put people in bed and they can\u2019t get out of bed. (Pause) You force it. Force a loving person to do this. Yes, what do you have to say, Sister Land?<\/p>\n

Land: <\/b>I was going to say, I<\/i> didn\u2019t tell anybody here that you told me to eat\u2014\u00a0eat sugar. I said, when we\u2019s in Los Angeles, you told us we could eat brown sugar and not eat the white, and that\u2019s what I ate, in the (unintelligible word), that what I said. I haven\u2019t told nobody I\u2014 that you said I could have sugar\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Pearl, how many times have you been before this body? (Pause) And, and\u2014 just tonight, you were on a bug, carrying on a dance about a bug.<\/p>\n

Land: <\/b>Sorry about that, Dad, but I was just afraid that da\u2014 that bug \u2018cause I couldn\u2019t get him off of me. He was\u2014 (Jones talks over her)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> What would he do to you?<\/p>\n

Land: <\/b>He was cu\u2014 he was biting me, had me on my finger.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> He bit you on your finger? No, he didn\u2019t.<\/p>\n

Land: <\/b>No, he didn\u2019t bite me, he just (Pause) gripped me.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> He gripped you on your finger.<\/p>\n

Land: <\/b>And I\u2014 and I tried to get him loose, and it was like I couldn\u2019t.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Oh, that\u2019s terrible.<\/p>\n

Land: <\/b>But I didn\u2019t mean nothing.<\/p>\n

Female coming to mike:<\/b> She\u2019s real concerned about her health, Dad, because on the 17th, she\u2014 she (unintelligible word) the question, that\u2019s when the new arrivals had just come, about her, her sugar, she asked you to\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> If she\u2019da shut up, I wouldn\u2019t even had no words with her, I\u2019da just given her a warning. (Pause) But never never never her. Never never. They call you “Last Word Land” in those days. (Pause) You didn\u2019t do nothing. You haven\u2019t done anything wrong since you were born, I don\u2019t think, have you, Pearl?<\/p>\n

General hubbub.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Do you want to sit down while you\u2019re ahead, Pearl? (Pause) Thank you.<\/p>\n

Crowd: <\/b>Laughter.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (stumbles over words) \u2014there\u2019s no other complaints, I\u2019ll give you a break this chance. (Pause) How many see people get sick? I had to put down five or six in one week. How many see here here here. You see<\/i> it. (Pause) I take no delight in this. Why don\u2019t you let me be my nature tonight? Why don\u2019t you go around and tell people that\u2014 as many people as you can, till the end of this meeting, how many gratitude you have, because if you don\u2019t, you\u2019ll be very very ill, woman, and I don\u2019t want to make you ill. (Pause) Move just as rapidly as you can. (Pause) Kivin Smith [aka Freeze Dry], fairly slow worker, tries to take shortcuts when unnecessary. He slows up the process and hates to take instructions from sisters. (Pause) Lena Benton. Has a bad attitude. She brought back some pants that were in good condition, said she did not like them. Bev got another pair and she complained that they were worse than the first ones. So Bev gave her back the original pair. She then asked for a workshirt, there were none to fit her. Then she asked for a pair of socks. She was given a pair, and she asked for a softer pair, because they were too harsh on her tender feet. She was told that there were the only kind we had. She left complaining that she never gets what she comes for. (Pause) Good\u2014 good evening, Sister Benton. And I\u2019m in agony with my kidneys. What do you have to say about yourself?<\/p>\n

Benton:<\/b> On (Pause) uh, Father, yes, I\u2014\u00a0ah, that\u2019s true, I took\u2014 she gave me a pair of white\u2014<\/p>\n

Hubbub.<\/p>\n

Lee ingram:<\/b> \u2014 wait, wait, (unintelligible) long ass story\u2014<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> Just say you\u2019re self-centered.<\/p>\n

ingram:<\/b> \u2014you right or wrong what you did\u2014<\/p>\n

Benton:<\/b> I was wrong.<\/p>\n

ingram:<\/b> Then why don\u2019t you say it, goddamnit.<\/p>\n

Benton:<\/b> I was wrong, Father.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> That the only warning?<\/p>\n

Female in crowd:<\/b> \u2014Can I say something? The 21st of February in there\u2014 (another male talks over her)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Okay. (Pause) Fortunately, you haven\u2019t got a warning in the last month, so your ass isn\u2019t in Learning, so sit down while you\u2019re<\/i> ahead.<\/p>\n

ingram:<\/b> Thank you, Father.<\/p>\n

Female:<\/b> Thank you, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Thank you. Mmm-hmm. Thank you. (Pause) Walter Williams, last night, Lee came home, tried to flip on the light, and discovered that it had been unscrewed so that the switch wouldn\u2019t go on immediately. Walter and Juanita Bogue were in the dark cottage alone. (Pause) Walter, I pa\u2014 raise you from the dead, paralyze, what<\/i> the hell you do this to me for? Why in the hell? Don\u2019t you need a leader? You sure as hell do. (Pause) Why do you stand before these good people\u2014 (Pause) I\u2019m going to have to cut off production tomorrow by two<\/i> hours. I\u2019ve got to do it. Give these people a chance to rest. I don\u2019t know why you people do this. (Pause) Are you people (unintelligible word; building?) a relationship? (Pause) What are you doing in the house with the lights off?<\/p>\n

Juanita Bogue:<\/b> Um, last night when I came in to get Tommy\u2019s stuff, \u2018cause he was on Learning Crew, I flipped the light on, the light\u2014\u00a0see, I got off work late from the kitchen, so I flipped the light on, the light switch didn\u2019t work, so I went in and woke him up, and he was putting his shoes and stuff on, so he could help me carry the trunk over to Vicky\u2019s house.<\/p>\n

ingram:<\/b> Why did you wait until 11:30 at night to get a trunk\u2014<\/p>\n

Juanita:<\/b> \u2018Cause I get off work. I work in the kitchen till 10, I got off about 10:30\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Don Fields\u2019 belongings have shown up in Walter\u2019s trunk. The last time he had up here, he had the\u2014 everything across this goddamn thing he had stolen and had a\u2014 a theft ring started in the whole place. Now the pharmacist Fields\u2019 belongings have shown up in Walter\u2019s trunk. Marvin Janaro found Walter\u2019s tra\u2014 tape recorder, he had not turned in and turned it in himself.<\/p>\n

Walter Williams:<\/b> That was (unintelligible word), Dad. The one\u2014 That was Tommy\u2019s, and who\u2014 and I think she already turned it in.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Hmm? (Pause) Son, what is it? If somebody had done for me, ah, one thing I wouldn\u2019t want to go through life was unable to move my body. If somebody had done that for me, I would be nice<\/i> to them, I wouldn\u2019t put them through this every night. If nobody ever<\/i> knew they had a miracle, you sure<\/i> as hell must know you had one. (Pause) And I said<\/i> it before I went over, that it would do it. The proof of it when the doctors and Marceline was crying (struggles for words) it\u2019s hopeless, spinal fluid coming out, she says it\u2019s hopeless, she was tear\u2014 trembling and tears. (Pause) And I stood with you and carried you through the darkest<\/i> night. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> I would\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014shit about stealing.<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> (Shouts) I don\u2019t understand why you don\u2019t use your arms for good instead of stealing the arms you couldn\u2019t move, till Dad healed you. (Pause) (Unintelligible) (Shouts through gritted teeth) You keep your hand down. (Pause) You should use those hands to build a kingdom. (Pause) On this earth. To build socialism<\/i>. (Shouts) Don\u2019t you steal another thing with those hands that he healed, you couldn\u2019t move from your neck down, do you know that? (Pause)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Do you remember?<\/p>\n

Marceline:<\/b> How much do you think you\u2019d steal if he hadn\u2019t healed<\/i> you?<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> Right.<\/p>\n

Marceline and Jones speak over each other.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> \u2014upon us, the one that\u2019s being drained now. I<\/i> would\u2019ve had to take cake\u2014 taken care of you the rest of the day, I\u2019da had to seen that nurses took care of you. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Scattered voices:<\/b> Right.<\/p>\n

Ingram:<\/strong> unintelligible question.<\/p>\n

Walter: <\/b>I haven\u2019t taken nothing, Dad. They all the same from before, I haven\u2019t taken nothing since I been off.<\/p>\n

Ingram<\/strong>:<\/b> You haven\u2019t taken any socks of mine, any T-shirts of\u2014<\/p>\n

Walter: <\/b>No. All the stuff I\u2019ve got is come from the warehouse, and (unintelligible phrase).<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Okay, okay, okay. I\u2019m telling you, you\u2014 you\u2014 you\u2019re playing with fire. (Pause) You\u2019re playing with fire. (Unintelligible phrase, repeated three times), you\u2019re playing with fire. If you violate rules, to whom much is given, whatever it come from, to much is required. (Pause) Even the mere PPP quoted that the other day in terms of socialist uh, education, what people should be doing with it. So it\u2019s true, to whom much is given, much is required. You\u2019ve had a\u2014 you\u2019ve had a real proof of my love and care. (Pause) So I wouldn\u2019t be up here again. Now I ah\u2014\u00a0any further proof that the light uh, that uh, the light was off uh\u2014<\/p>\n

Ingram<\/strong>:<\/b> The starter. The starter to the uh, light, you know, was jus\u2014\u00a0was pulled out so when you hit the switch, you couldn\u2019t\u2014\u00a0it wouldn\u2019t<\/i> come on. (Stumbles for words) There\u2019s a starter on these fluorescent lights, if it\u2019s screwed out, you cannot turn it on, you know, you can\u2019t turn it on. (Pause) I don\u2019t know who did<\/i>, but I mean, the thing is, it was\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Tommy, do you know anything about it?<\/p>\n

Tommy Bogue: <\/b>I know that\u2014\u00a0I know that, um, I\u2019d asked her to get my stuff out of my\u2014 out of my cottage because Marvin ha\u2014 had already had my hat on, \u2018cause I\u2019d seen him with\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> You, you asked her to do it.<\/p>\n

Tommy: <\/b>Yes, I did, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> (Stumbles for words) I will not punish anybody. It would help two people who were standing in a\u2014 looked like they had been doing something out of the relationship rules, and anybody uh\u2014 we\u2019ll just say that they turned that switch, I\u2019ll not punish them. I\u2019d rather do that to save their image. (Pause)<\/p>\n

Male: <\/b>Dad, that happened to my switch then. When mine comes out, I open my door and cut on the light, it wouldn\u2019t come on and the starter had fellen out on the floor.<\/p>\n

Another<\/b> Male:<\/b> And cottage six was out too.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Okay, I\u2014 I think they\u2019re innocent. We\u2019ll\u2014\u00a0we\u2019ll give you the benefit anyway. Dismissed.<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Thank you, Dad.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Ben Robinson, a very<\/i> good worker, and I hate to even bring him up. Shirley Robinson complains that Ben will not leave her alone till they both have agreed to the separation. He told her that he would buy her\u2014 uh, bug her the rest of her life. When she refuses to talk to him, he acts unreasonable and threatens violence. She has no intention of going back into the relationship. (Pause) \u2014the matter, Ben, you\u2019re a good worker. Uh.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> Uh, that\u2019s true, Dad, I was gaming. (Pause) Uh, I\u2019m glad that we\u2014 I\u2019m glad that we have broke up, uh\u2014<\/p>\n

Scattered laughter.<\/p>\n

Woman:<\/b> \u2014liar\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Liar.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> And uh, uh\u2014<\/p>\n

Male:<\/b> Bet she wished you knew that\u2014<\/p>\n

General hubbub.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> And I\u2019m not gaming now, uh, truthfully<\/i> uh, I put\u2014 I put her through a lot of uh\u2014 lot of hell, Dad, and we talked about it in the States, and we agreed when we got over here, that we would separate.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Umm-hmm.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> Okay, and when we did, uh, the problem was that (Pause) I just couldn\u2019t really get over the fact that I had lost her, you know, although I had.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Shush, Shush.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> Although I had, and uh\u2014 I had to adjust to the fact that her new companion lives in my house too. Plus, we work\u2014 (Jones talks over Robinson)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Shush.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> \u2014 on the same crew. So um, I\u2019m adjusting, and uh, uh, (Pause) (Struggles for words) The other night when you was talking<\/i>, uh, it was something about guilt<\/i>, and uh, you were saying about revenge<\/i>\u2014<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Umm-hmm.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> \u2014and all down through my life I have hurt people because I felt that uh, uh, people had hurt me<\/i>, which, you know, I should have been a zero<\/i> on that, but I wasn\u2019t, and I hurt her\u2014 (Jones talks over him)<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Well son, you\u2019re a fine worker, and uh, to me, you would be a fi\u2014 a good person for somebody to be a companion. And I\u2019m not going to hound you much about this. Do<\/i> leave her alone, though. The next time, I\u2019ll have to. Do<\/i> leave her alone. But I can understand that, and I do<\/i> think that you should not have to be in the same house, I don\u2019t think that we\u2019ve\u2014 are that evolved. I think something should be arranged. I feel for you.<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> Oh we\u2019re not in the s\u2014 we\u2019re not in the same house.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> Oh. Well, ah, didn\u2019t you say you had been in the same house with the man that\u2014<\/p>\n

Robinson:<\/b> Oh no, that\u2014 that don\u2019t bother me. That don\u2019t bother me. Oh, at first, first couple of days I had to adjust to it. But it don\u2019t bother me now. Uh, we talked about it and I\u2014\u00a0I\u2014\u00a0I\u2014 I just\u2014\u00a0I asked him to treat her better than I did, \u2018cause I fucked over.<\/p>\n

Jones:<\/b> I like you. (Pause) Thank you. (Pause) That\u2019s the only reason I can stand<\/i> it, is I see growth in some people and it\u2019s natural like\u2014 not to\u2014 you can\u2019t<\/i> be justified in bothering\u2014 it\u2019s a relationship that\u2019s been broken, but it, uh\u2014 I\u2019ve seen a lot of growth in that young man. (Pause) Touching, touching me. It touches me, and it\u2019s awful hard to be touched when your kidney feel it\u2019s coming out of your front end or something. (Pause) Oh, God. Chris Newell and Lu\u2014 Lawanda Mitchell, Stephanie Smith, Michele Bogue, James Ford, Joe Jones, Derek Walker, Lori Fields, Youlanda Smith, Juanita Bright\u2014 Even since Isaac Edwards was hit in the head Sunday, these youngsters\u2014 and he was blind, he was dead, and I had to heal him\u2014 have been playing game where they hit each other on the head and other parts of the body, Chris Murrell hit Michele Bogue hard enough for her to have a temporary hearing loss. (Sighs, voice of resignation) Learning Crew, suggestion of the teachers, I have nothing to say, I have nothing\u2014 you people\u2014 I\u2014 we will not accept violence, when I accept your bouncing on each other. Tommy Kice and Edward Ford, physical fighting with intent to cause pain. (Voice of resignation) Learning Crew. All physical violence that doesn\u2019t happen befron\u2014 in front of this group for teaching purposes will be (Pause) in Learning. (Pause) O\u2019Neal Johnson. (Pause) Well, uh, if he does a good job tomorrow, he\u2019ll automatically be off. If he woulda been off now, if it hadn\u2019t been for acting up at noon yesterday. (Pause) Irvin Perkins doing good, Ricardo Arterberry, you\u2019ll get off but you\u2019ve been on there too many times, so I can\u2019t let you off yet. Orlando Robinson? (Pause) Also good, but you\u2014 I just can\u2019t\u2014 you haven\u2019t been\u2014 oh wait, been a good worker with a good attitude the last three days. Orlando Robinson, if you are\u2014 can keep this record up by next people\u2019s rally which would now\u2014\u00a0this is Thursday, isn\u2019t it? Maybe, I don\u2019t know when it would be, would be Saturday perhaps\u2014\u00a0you will uh, you will be uh, off. You hear? (Pause)<\/p>\n

End of tape.<\/p>\n

Tape originally posted March 1999<\/b><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Transcript prepared by Fielding M. McGehee III. If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you. To return to the Tape Index, click here. Listen to MP3 (Pt. 1, Pt. 2). To read the Tape Summary, click here. Jim Jones Jr.:\u00a0(unintelligible) Music Jones: \u2014 are not carrying. (Pause) There are some voices […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":6,"featured_media":0,"parent":27291,"menu_order":550,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"footnotes":""},"class_list":["post-27597","page","type-page","status-publish","hentry"],"acf":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27597","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/page"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/6"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=27597"}],"version-history":[{"count":11,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27597\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":127872,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27597\/revisions\/127872"}],"up":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/pages\/27291"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/jonestown.sdsu.edu\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=27597"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}