(Editor’s note: This tape was transcribed by Vicki Perry. The editors gratefully acknowledge her invaluable assistance.)
To read the Tape Summary, click here. Listen to MP3 (Pt. 1, Pt. 2).
[Better copy requested and received 2018] MP3.
To return to the Tape Index, click here.
[Editor’s notes: This tape of HAM radio transmissions between Jonestown and San Francisco has several periods of static, punctuated by other HAM operators breaking in with requests for identification. Where this traffic is unintelligible, no real attempts at transcription were made.
[The first two minutes of this tape are at double speed. It is repeated at normal speed after two minutes.]
Sandy Rozynko: I just haven’t seen or spoken to you in two years. You all right?
Male: And the call is America, in Pennsylvania. We’re here in Pennsylvania.
Joyce Roztynko: (Crosstalk) I’m just fine. I don’t understand what you’re hollering about.
Sandy: Well, every time I tried to get a hold of you, they wouldn’t let me talk to you.
Male: This is probably ten years. And I couldn’t figure out (unintelligible)–
Sandy: Why didn’t you write? Because I tried. You never got any of my letters.
Male: That has to be 19 or 20 years ago. At least that. And uh, perhaps (unintelligible word) memory but I think perhaps– I remember now after that (unintelligible)–
Sandy: If you wanted (unintelligible).
Male: Did you (unintelligible)?
Sandy: Well, I don’t– and I would rather have talked to you, okay?
Male: Well, you know we’re hearing a lot of things in Pennsylvania. You have the same last name as we do business with. But it’s not changed, they came back together, and it’s nice to hear you back on the air with a (unintelligible).
Sandy: (unintelligible) Wait, I can’t call you back again (unintelligible) come down in two weeks (unintelligible word). ‘Cause right now I have a very busy life of my own but I just wanted to tell you I love you.
Male: When you transmit music (unintelligible) every time (unintelligible). Try not to.
Joyce: (Crosstalk) We’re going to stay. We’re going to stay. Don’t you get (unintelligible)?
[Period of conversation among other HAM operators]
Joyce: I’m happy (unintelligible) if you’re happy. If that’s true, then all right. I also want to tell you that I’m getting married.
[Tape edit]
[Period of conversation among other HAM operators]
Sandy: I just haven’t seen or spoken to you in two years. You all right?
Male: And the call is America, in Pennsylvania. We’re here in Pennsylvania.
Joyce Roztynko: (Crosstalk) I’m just fine. I don’t understand what you’re hollering about.
Sandy: Well, every time I tried to get a hold of you, they wouldn’t let me talk to you.
Male: This is probably ten years. And I couldn’t figure out (unintelligible)–
Sandy: Why didn’t you write? Because I tried. You never got any of my letters.
Male: That has to be 19 or 20 years ago. At least that. And uh, perhaps (unintelligible word) memory but I think perhaps– I remember now after that (unintelligible)–
Sandy: If you wanted (unintelligible).
Male: Did you (unintelligible)?
Sandy: Well, I don’t– and I would rather have talked to you, okay?
Male: Well, you know we’re hearing a lot of things in Pennsylvania. You have the same last name as we do business with. But it’s not changed, they came back together, and it’s nice to hear you back on the air with a (unintelligible).
Sandy: (unintelligible) Wait, I can’t call you back again (unintelligible) come down in two weeks (unintelligible word). ‘Cause right now I have a very busy life of my own but I just wanted to tell you I love you.
Male: When you transmit music (unintelligible) every time (unintelligible). Try not to.
Joyce: (Crosstalk) We’re going to stay. We’re going to stay. Don’t you get (unintelligible)?
[Period of conversation among other HAM operators]
Joyce: I’m happy (unintelligible) if you’re happy. If that’s true, then all right. I also want to tell you that I’m getting married. And just (unintelligible) us.
Male: (Unintelligible).
Joyce: Well, thank you. I was hoping to invite you to the wedding.
(Background noise) (Unintelligible male voice in background)
Joyce: I’m not going back to America.
(Muffled music in background)
Sandy: Well, I’m going to miss you an awful lot, Mother. It’s just– I don’t want to think that I’ll never see you again.
[Period of conversation among other HAM operators]
[Tape edit]
Sandy: You don’t sound like my mother.
Male: (Crosstalk) ETA one thirty five over (unintelligible). I’ll get it and I’ll send you one of mine. I’ve had mine for a long time. They’re not so– (voice fades).
Sandy: Well, can I talk to Mike and Chris?
Male: (Unintelligible).
Male: Your (unintelligible) are on some of this. And uh, they (unintelligible).
Joyce: (Crosstalk) Chris doesn’t want to talk to you, but Mike’s here, he will.
Male: (unintelligible), Sandy? (Pause)
Sandy: Mike?
Mike: Yes. This is Mike. How are you, Sandy? (Pause)
Male: We’re waiting for you to transmit this.
Sandy: I love you, Mike.
Mike: Much love to you, also.
Sandy: I don’t know what you heard about me, Mike, but it isn’t true. I’m living a very happy life now, and I like it where I am, and I’m doing what I want to do. And I’m going to college, and doing great. And I have a good life here, and it’s not what he said it’s like. I swear to you, Mike. It’s different.
Mike: Good. But you couldn’t be as happy as I am.
Sandy: Well, Mike, I’m really glad you’re happy. But if you ever want to come back to the United States, please tell me.
Mike: You people all know I’m happy.
Sandy: Yeah, Mike, I think you are. But if you ever don’t get happy, if you ever want to come back, please call me. Call Dad [Vitale Rozynko]. He says he’ll get you a plane ticket out of there. He’ll send you first class. He’ll pay for your college education. He’ll give you a new life. We all will. We all love you. We all don’t ever want to– we want– we don’t want to think that we’ll never see you again, Mike. We want to give you a chance.
(High pitched squeal over radio)
Mike: Well, why don’t you (unintelligible word) the Temple, we’ll connect you with some of the people who have– (unintelligible word) so much evil.
Male: (Unintelligible).
Sandy: Mike, I love you. I’m not sure if anybody is doing anything (unintelligible word) to return.
Mike: Oh, you know what I’m talking about.
Sandy: Mike, I know what you’re talking about, but whatever you think, it’s not true. I love you. I love Mom and I love Chris. So does Dad. He wants to see you happy and he wants to see you again. He doesn’t want you to stay down there forever.
Male: Negative copy. Negative copy.
Sandy: Do I have a (unintelligible)?
Male: Yeah.
Sandy: Mike, whatever you heard, it isn’t true. I love you, and I love Mike, I love Chris, I love Mom, and so does Dad. He loves you, and he wants to see you. He doesn’t want you to stay down there forever. He doesn’t want to think that he’ll never see you again. He loves you, and I want to make you sure that you know that. We love you and we don’t– we don’t want to hurt you.
Mike: Well, then quit, because I’ve seen what you’ve done with my own eyes.
Sandy: Mike, what did I do?
Male: It’s a long time (unintelligible). Can’t call him back. Uh, similar to what the (unintelligible) used to have when they were a bit more on the discreet side. Ten years ago, and then put up (Unintelligible) for it until they could (unintelligible).
Mike: Negative copy. Negative copy. Negative copy.
Male: Uh, if I could inter– interrupt for a minute, uh, for my records, here could all the parties involved in the phone patch, please uh, state your name and the date. Over. Uh, go ahead, 8R3, uh, state your name and address, or state your name and the date. Over.
Male: (Unintelligible) medical clinic deep in the jungle of South America . (Unintelligible).
(Several voices in background)
Male: (Unintelligible) WB6, MIB Portable 8R3. Copy. If so, please state your name and the date, uh, for my records. Over.
Male: I’m sorry I have to run out on you. (Unintelligible) 382Y.
Male: WB6 MIB portable 8R3, this is WA6 D2J. Do you copy?
Mike: This is December 2, 1977.
Male: Okay. I have person– all parties uh, in the phone patch. Please state your names also.
Mike: This is Mike Rozynko.
Sandy: My name is Sandy Rozynko and (unintelligible).
Joyce: This is Joyce Rozynko. December 2, 1977.
Male: Okay. Uh, Sandy would you repeat please?
Sandy: My name is Sandy Rozynko, and the date is December 2, 1977.
Male: Okay. Thank you. Uh, there was a– Sandy, there was a negative copy on your last– uh, I think they asked for a repeat.
Sandy: Mike, I want to know what I did that you feel so mad about.
Mike: You know what I feel mad about. Let’s not go into that now.
Sandy: I don’t know, Mike. I don’t know what you’re so mad about. Tell me.
Mike: All the things that you’ve done. You hurt me and my best friend, and I’ve seen it with my own eyes.
Sandy: What, Mike? I assume that you can’t go into details when you don’t even know yourself. I guess somebody is trying to tell you, but whatever they’re telling you isn’t true. You must believe me.
(Mixed voices over radio)
Mike: (Unintelligible word) I have seen with my own eyes. I have no need for anybody to tell me. I have seen with my own eyes what you have done.
Sandy: Well, Mike, I’m sure that they have told you things like we’re racists, etcetera but we’re not. Patti and Carl, everyone’s (unintelligible) interracial children living with us now. Andre is living with us now. We’re not racist, Mike. We have black people living in our home. We are socially with them every day. They’re just– they’re our own children now. That’s why the stares. We aren’t racist. We’re not fascist. We don’t believe in– in Germany and– and [Adolf] Hitler, like they tell you. We’re just normal people.
[Period of conversation among other HAM operators]
Male: Okay. WB6 MID portable 8R3, this is WA6 D2J. Someone is uh, complaining about music broadcast on the air, which is not coming from my station here. I don’t know uh, where the problem is coming from. Uh, I will have Sandy repeat her last transmission. Go ahead, Sandy.
Sandy: Mike, I’m sure that they have told you different things about us, like we’re racist or we’re Nazis or something like that, but it’s not true. Patrica and Carl (unintelligible name), they’re living with us now. Andrea Mertle (unintelligible word) , they’re living with us now. (Unintelligible name) and Deanna and all children, they’ve adopted us. We’re not racists. We’re not Nazis. We don’t believe in the Ku Klux Klan. We’re just normal people, living normal lives, getting back into the swing of things. Okay? (Pause)
Mike: Listen, there’s no need to debate this. I’m happy. I’m living my own life and you live your own life.
Sandy: Okay, Mike. Let me tell you about some things that are happening over here, so at least you know some news in the United States, okay? All right. (pause) Mike? The Klan is not marching in the streets. There are no riots or blacks in the streets. Marshall Kilduff is not dead. Whatever you’ve heard, is probably a lie. Okay? But life is going on in the United States. It’s normal. There are no race– racists hanging blacks in the projects.
(Unintelligible exchange with HAM operators)
Mike: Sandy, why don’t you live your own life? I’m in agricult– agriculture, and I’m enjoying it very much.
Sandy: Well, how come– why don’t you come back and you can go to college and you can– You can do the things that I know you’ve always wanted to do. I know you wanted to be a doctor more than you wanted to live, you said. You can come back and you can continue your photography. I mean, why did you go down in the first place? I mean, Tim Clancey’s taking your pictures now, and (Unintelligible word) and I know that he couldn’t be as good as you. I mean, why would you give that up? I mean you’ve got a whole life ahead of you. You can go to college. I’m giving you this chance to do what you wanted to do, and I– I know you could be happy doing it. I just– I just don’t understand.
Mike: I’m a free moral agent, and I came down here because I want to. I love you, Sandy.
Sandy: I love you too, Mike, but please remember, if there’s ever anything you need from me, you know what to do. Call me. Write a letter. Somehow. Go to the consulate down there. They’ll help you. You know, if you need me, if you need Dad. If you want to leave but they won’t let you, call me and I’ll send a ticket down or I’ll come down myself and you will be (Unintelligible word), but you’ll get out. You can come up here, and we have a home for you. We can give you a job. We can send you to college. I just want you to know that if you want to, you have an out. And we can– (Pause) And if we need to, we can get you an emergency passport.
Mike: I don’t need a passport. I have a passport. No one has a hold on me. I am here on my own free will, and I will notcome back.
Sandy: Okay, Mike. Just remember, if you need me, I’m here, and I love you. And tell Chris I’m sorry he didn’t want to talk to me, but the same goes for him. The same goes for Mom, and I love every one of you. Very much. So does Dad, and so does everybody up here.
Mike: I love you too, but I just don’t like the way you try to hurt people. (Pause)
Sandy: Okay, Mike. Well, I love you. Bye-bye. (Pause)
Mike: Bye-bye.
Male: WA6 D2J terminating from patch. WB6 MID portable 8R3.
Part 2:
[Period of conversation among other HAM operators]
(Unintelligible male voice)
Jim Jones: The (unintelligible word) remind. It’s one of those things that Martha received. There’s questions that we want resolved. Just how we would uh, find out uh, how this man ticks and uh, what he is– what his game is and what he’s up to.
Male: Roger, roger.
Jones: I know one thing. He better hope I stay healthy and stay alive, ‘cause there’s sure a lot of folks that are aggravated with him.
Male: That is most definitely for sure. Roger, roger.
(Mixed unintelligible chat)
Male: Irene, Ed’s secretary, and Martha are going to see him right now. Over.
Female: (Unintelligible), no.
Male: They are going to see, uh, Hank right now. They are going to see Hank right now. Do you copy?
Jones: Roger. Is your (unintelligible word) over there?
Male: Negative.
Jones: (Unintelligible) still going there, right?
Female 2: –two at a time.
Deborah Layton: Sidney– Sidney’s uh, in charge of the program right now. Over.
Jones: Negative. You talk too fast, Martha. You’re the most dedicated person in the world, but you talk too fast.
Layton: Sidney. Sidney is in charge of the program right now. Over.
Male: Okay. Roger. Everybody (unintelligible)
[Tape edit]
Jones: Tell them to find (unintelligible name) and put him in.
Layton: They did.
Jones: First class. Upper class. (unintelligible) because that’s what (unintelligible word) boils down to.
Layton: Roger, roger, roger, roger.
Jones: ‘Cause there’s assurances that he don’t want life doing what he’s doing, but uh, they’re very secretive and so forth, so we don’t know what’s up with him, and uh, I still want to know where it’s at because he can live to– live to clear a li– How did he react on the– on the phone?
Layton: He uh– he called me back. I left a message, and he called me back about 11:30 last night and we did not talk. We just set up an appointment. Over.
Jones: Well, all right. I see. Well, maybe you’ll talk today.
Layton: Roger, roger. We’ve got our– we’ve got our uh, group together. Over.
Jones: That’s good. That’s great.
Layton: Irene and uh– uh, Ed’s secretary and I are on our way now. Over.
Jones: Negative copy.
(Two female voices in background; unintelligible)
Jones: (unintelligible word), you can go. Sign out. Clear the landline. I’d like to ask– I’d like to find– point out to him some of his uh, (unintelligible) liabilities. Uh, (unintelligible) uh, there are some opinions that he’s just a highly impressionable soul, and always has to look like the moral crusaders, no matter who (unintelligible; high pitched squeal) That’s what what Ed and Sarah thinks. ‘Cause I’m an idealistic soul that’s always trying to talk to somebody before they destroy themselves and others.
Layton: You say he is an impressionable person, uh, and I copy your idealism. Who was this directed to? Over.
Jones: Uh, negative on that. I– I didn’t copy that.
Layton: Okay, uh, Lily got it. Lily got it. Okay. (Pause)
Jones: It sure ought to be mindful. Copy? (Unintelligible) mighty appropriate on (unintelligible). I basically say do you copy?
Layton: Roger, roger. We ought to be mindful.
Jones: Negative. (Unintelligible) be mindful.
Layton: Roger. Remind him.
Jones: But no matter how much he sells his soul to the devil. Do you copy?
Layton: Roger.
Layton: They want to make their independence (unintelligible) frame-up, and they are in a position to do so. Better be mindful. It never pays to lie. (Pause)
Layton: Roger, roger. Uh, is that in regards to uh, Shorty? Over.
(High pitched sound)
Jones: Do you copy?
Layton: 8R3, is that in regards to Shorty? Over.
Jones: Negative copy.
Layton: (Louder, slower) Is that in regards to Shorty? Over.
Jones: In regard to what?
Layton: Shorty. Chris. Chris. Over.
Jones: Oh, that’s a roger. That’s a roger. (unintelligible) I’m– I’m talking about, like can he uh, (unintelligible). He needs to be reminded he– That– Uh, well, I don’t know how to put it. I don’t know how to put it. (Loud intermittent beeps). Do you copy?
Layton: Negative. Negative. We have someone tuning of it on top of you. Over.
Jones: I say we need to talk to Eric about some way of reminding (unintelligible word) Do you copy?
Layton: Yes. Roger. We copy.
Jones: That they’ll make their own independent claim up on him. Do you copy?
Layton: Roger, roger.
Jones: And there are– the means is Julie but– but Julie kept (unintelligible word) about this gentleman.
Female in room: Julie. Julie.
Layton: Uh, we– uh, we have only partial copy. Uh, something about Julie. Over.
Jones: What Julie kept. What Julie kept.
Layton: That’s a roger. (Pause) Roger, roger, 8R3.
Jones: Kind of documentation you would not be accustomed to.
Layton: Roger, roger.
Jones: So I– I don’t– I don’t want him to try to hurt people. Thinks he’s gonna come out (unintelligible word) clean by lying on other people.
Layton: Roger.
Jones: I don’t care at this point. If people are that wicked– Well, most people are that wicked, and I been trying to be nothing but (unintelligible). Our country and this country have been settled with the best ambassadors of goodwill they’ve ever had. All ambassadors (unintelligible). I don’t understand what they’re trying to do. I read all the stuff they’ve got cooked up, and certainly by officials back there. Government officials. I read it all. It’s silly. It’s silly to try to do that kind of stuff. It (unintelligible word) people. (Unintelligible), get to it, but they will. (Pause) But just find out from Hank how he feels some of the message, uh, some of the uh, questions, they should be– (unintelligible) be answered. All of them (unintelligible).
Layton: Roger.
Jones: He gave– he said he believes his son is the worst thing. He believes the worst about him, and his own friends believe the worst about him (unintelligible). [Tim] Stoen’s worst friends– his old friends think the worst about him. (Unintelligible) why– what a (unintelligible) concerned about him. They all believe he’s gone all the way to do evil anyway.
Layton: Roger.
Jones: I guess that’s why he’s so civil. But as to him, doing anything that he has in mind, you might as well try to uh, climb Mount Everest. That they uh, thread the needle.
Layton: Roger, roger, roger, roger. Stand by for, uh– Stand by.
(Two female voices in the background; unintelligible)
Layton: The frequency’s in use. The frequency is in use.
(Two female voices in the background; unintelligible)
Male: (Unintelligible) (Crosstalk over radio)
Layton: WA6 D2J standing by with WB6 MID portable 8R3. The frequency is in use and is standing by.
Jones: I’d like to ask him what he thinks they’re trying to do with the (unintelligible) down here. Uh, we can’t live– (Pause) Well, we won’t– we will not be victimized by a criminal. It’s not my uh– it’s not my characteristic. I have had some kind of sudden turn. (Unintelligible for ten seconds)
Layton: 8R3, uh, we are– We ought to be going now. If, uh– if there’s more we can– we can uh, make an excuse for a later appointment. Over.
Jones: What time is better (unintelligible). My life insurance (unintelligible).
Layton: Negative copy. WB6 MID portable 8R3. WA6 D2J. (Slowly, enunciating) Negative copy. Negative copy.
Jones: Tell Leann– (Unintelligible). You uh, you won’t have to worry (unintelligible) get this. Nearly half my life is uh, (unintelligible). Life is uh, (unintelligible) people are doing now. (Unintelligible) lies, that’s all. ‘Cause I know what you people (unintelligible). I must (unintelligible).
Female: (Unintelligible).
(Squeals, crosstalk)
Jones: Copy.
Female in room: It’s okay. You don’t have to worry.
Layton: Uh, we copy. Tell him that you don’t have to worry, and that was all. Over.
Jones: That’s a (unintelligible). In this situation he’d get a (unintelligible).
Layton: Negative. Negative. Uh, the– negative.
Jones: Have (unintelligible) about my life. (Unintelligible), do you copy?
Female in background: Ask him.
Layton: Listen, (unintelligible).
Jones: Do you copy?
(Female voices in background)
Layton: Uh, we copied about Marceline [Jones] and uh, your life insurance.
Jones: That’s right, and we can have that. But I do have– I’ve got a– I’ve got problems here (unintelligible) taking care of a thousand people and uh, I don’t know. I don’t know what to tell the man. Don’t you worry. Don’t you worry. I know (unintelligible) None of you worry. Anyway, you’re a very courageous, brave people. But don’t worry. But we’ll call you (unintelligible) my life insurance.
Layton: Roger, roger.
Jones: (Unintelligible). I want to find out– I want to find out– now he’s got them– they let him go on. I want to find out about uh, uh– I’m talking now about uh, (unintelligible). You know Maxine’s sister, Melanie?
(Female voices in background; unintelligible)
Layton: Uh, stand by.
(Female voice in background; unintelligible)
Jones: You know Maxine’s sister, Melanie?
Layton: (Hesitant) Uh– Uh, we copy you, but uh, we’re not too sure.
Jones: You know Maxine?
(Female voices in background; unintelligible)
Female in room: Which Maxine?
Layton: Roger. Uh, we–
Jones: Too afraid of too big ears?
Layton: Roger, roger. Yes. Thank you for checking, old man. This is WA6 D2J with– that the frequency is in use and thank you for checking.
Jones: Tell me. Tell me.
Undetermined gender voice in background: Oh, my God.
Jones: Marge– Marge worked with her a lot. Marge and uh–
Female in room: Marge worked with her a lot?
Female in room: Marjorie.
Jones: Lisa’s daughter works with her a lot.
Layton: Uh, whose daughter?
Jones: (Unintelligible).
Layton: Negative copy on the daughter.
Jones: Lisa. Lisa, Lisa, Lisa,.
(Female voices in background)
Layton: Okay, roger.
Jones: Uh, Melanie.
(Unintelligible female voice in background)
Layton: Okay, Roger.
Jones: Uh, (unintelligible) need to see if uh– (Pause) Stand by.
(Female voices in background)
Jones: (Unintelligible) Do you copy me?
Female: Roger, roger. We copy.
Jones: Uh, tell Melanie to just uh, bring back what she needs for travel. Do you copy?
(Unintelligible female voices in room)
Jones: Do you copy?
Layton: Roger. We copy.
Female in room: I can’t (unintelligible).
Layton: Uh, we’re a little bit hazy, though.
Jones: You know what a (unintelligible) does?
Layton: Yeah. Okay. Roger, roger.
Jones: A lot’s going to (unintelligible) that uh, that uh, (unintelligible) that’s her. That’s Melanie.
Layton: Oh. Okay. Roger, Roger.
[Period of query from other HAM operators]
Layton: Uh, frequency’s in use. This frequency’s in use.
Jones: Do you copy, WA6 D2J?
Layton: Roger, roger, roger.
Jones: (Unintelligible). The other day when we did so (unintelligible) Venezuela by getting the medicine they needed. (Pause) Okay, I’m– I think that uh, folks like– No, I think that all of the (unintelligible) and uh, (unintelligible). Do you copy?
Layton: Negative. Wait a minute.
Male: Stand by. Somebody’s knock–
Female: Stand by.
Male: Somebody’s knocking you out. Uh, I– Irene would like to know if she could leave now. Over.
Jones: Well, of course, but I wanted to hear one thing. I want to find what’s going on (unintelligible) really (unintelligible) a fellowship.
Female in room: Fellowship?
Male: We copied “Henderson’s people” and “fellowship”.
Jones: (Unintelligible). We’re tired of this song and dance. I write to good people– (unintelligible).
Layton: You’re tired of this song and dance.
Male: We copied “you’re tired of this song and dance” something–
Female: Tired that good people have to go through that thing–
Male: Uh, tired that good people have to go through that. Uh, we don’t completely understand what you’re saying, though. Over.
Jones: Well, I wasn’t (unintelligible) everybody works (unintelligible). All the family and (unintelligible) and anniversary fellowship.
Female in room: Well, don’t say (unintelligible) family.
Male: Roger. You say you want all the family in an anniversary fellowship. Is that roger?
Jones: Yes. Totally right. All good people should be able to (unintelligible).
Male: Roger, roger.
Jones: And Melanie. Let’s do what she needs to travel. Do you copy?
Male: We copied. We cop–
Jones: (Unintelligible) can do uh, (unintelligible) possible (unintelligible), Dexter. Do you copy?
Female in room: Negative.
Male: Uh, just copied “Dexter”. I’m sorry.
Jones: Guys, you can do what you can to help him.
Male: Do what we can to help Dexter.
Jones: Do what?
Male: We copied “do what we can to help Dexter.” Over.
Jones: Yeah, (unintelligible). Be sure not to get Melanie (unintelligible). Only Melanie’s got to travel. Only Melanie’s got to travel.
Male voice in room: Melanie’s got to travel.
(Crosstalk)
Male: Roger, roger, roger.
Jones: I want her family to be able to (unintelligible).
Male: Roger.
Jones: So everybody gets themselves to work, ‘cause I– I do a lot better– I’ve always done better when everybody gets to enjoy the (unintelligible). (Unintelligible) for life like it can be enjoyed.
Male: Roger, roger.
Jones: Better than all the liars do what they want to do. I’m sick of the liars.
Layton (in room): He wants–
Male: Roger, roger.
Layton: In other words–
Jones: (unintelligible). They’ll fade into the woodwork, and they won’t know how to hear from us anymore.
Male: Roger, roger.
Jones: (Unintelligible).
Male: Roger.
Jones: That’s all I had to say.
Male: Roger. Thank you. Uh, Irene uh, should go now. Is that right? Over.
Jones: Roger. That wasn’t (unintelligible) I don’t want to go into the (unintelligible), do you understand? I just want– I wanted the– uh, the good people to know about his (unintelligible). Do you copy?
Male: Roger, roger. Understood. Thank you.
Jones: Do you copy?
Male: Roger, roger. We copy. We understand. Over.
Jones: Yeah, been thinking (unintelligible) three years of this (unintelligible). Ask if somebody needs help. (Unintelligible).
[Several moments of query from other HAM operators]
Jones: (Unintelligible) get a hold of (unintelligible).
Layton: Uh, negative copy. Get a hold of who?
Male: (Unintelligible).
Layton: Roger, roger. The frequency is in use old man. Thank you for checking.
Jones: (Unintelligible). ‘Course, this’ll– this’ll stop, this will stop. This’ll stop. This will stop. (Unintelligible).
Layton: Uh, negative copy. We only copied “this will stop.”
Jones: (In unison with female) “This will stop.”
[Period of query from other HAM operators]
Male: Roger, roger. Go ahead. Please say again. And we copied is “this will stop.”
Female: (Unintelligible) that we not. (Unintelligible). Over.
Jones: They– they–
Female in room: Turning over. Turning over.
End Of Side 1
Side 2
Part 3
Male: WD6 MID portable 8R3. WA6 D2J. Do you copy?
Male: (Unintelligible).
(Crosstalk over radio)
Tom Adams: Okay. Phone patch is connected. For my records, please, at the beginning of where the– at the beginning of the conversation uh, all parties state your name and the date of the conversation uh, complete with your conversation. Uh, go ahead uh, first, 8R3.
Charlie Touchette: Uh, this is Charlie Touchette. Uh, December 3, 1977, and I’m living in the most beautiful place in the entire world. Hey, Mickey. I overheard you (unintelligible).
Mickey Touchette: I can’t hear you.
Charlie: That forged check for several hundred dollars, and it didn’t take long for you to blow through it.
Mickey: What’d you say? I can’t hear you, Dad.
Adams: Okay. Mickey, uh, first state your name and the date and then uh, I’ll have him repeat.
Mickey: Okay. Uh, my name is Mickey Touchette and this is uh, uh, December 3.
Adams: Okay, now when you get through talking, you’ll have to say “over,” so that I know you’re finished and then I’ll switch him over.
Mickey: Okay. Now what was that word?
Adams: When you get through your (Unintelligible), when you get through talking and you want– you’re ready for them to talk, say “over” so that I can switch the– the key. The microphone key.
Mickey: You mean– Oh.
Adams: You can only talk one at a time.
Mickey: Oh. I see.
Adams: Okay. Uh, go ahead uh, WD6 MID portable 8R3. Over.
Charlie: Now I have no idea. But I said that–
Adams: Uh, 8R3, please repeat your last transmission.
Charlie: This is Charles Touchette. December the third, 1977. I’m living in the most– most wonderful place in the entire world, and uh, I uh, (Unintelligible)– I don’t know, but you know, things are strange. I haven’t heard from you for several years since you forged that check for several hundred dollars and went out on a terrorist spree, I believe to blow up some things. Over.
Adams: So did you copy that?
Mickey: Yeah. I copy. Okay, Daddy. I miss you very, very much. I can’t wait to see you again. I love you. And uh, uh, whenever you decide to leave the church, whenever you decide to come back to the States, I’m here in San Francisco, and you can get a hold of me. I’m listed. Daddy, I love all of you and I miss all of you. Uh, what you just said to me uh, was not true at all, Daddy. I was never going to blow up anything. You know me better than that. You know, uh, we left the church because of– of uh, Jim Jones and because of uh, of his sickness, Daddy, and I don’t even want to get into that. I want to talk to you and I want to make sure that you’re all right. I want to know how your health is, I want to know what you do and I want to know how all my family is. Uh, over, Tom.
Charlie: Darlin’, I want to tell you something. You better wake up your ass (unintelligible). What bothers me is you wrote that check you forged (unintelligible).
Mickey: Dad, I did not forge a check that had uh, I don’t know. It was either your signature or my mother’s signature. I asked for some things that I needed. I did not forge a check. That is a lie. Over.
Charlie: Oh. Well, (Unintelligible), we know you did. I’ve still got the check, darlin’. Over.
Mickey: Okay. Okay, Daddy. The check. That’s a different issue you know. We can talk about that when we can see each other. How are you? Over.
Charlie: Mickey, I’m doing just fine. I couldn’t live in a better place in the entire world. Over.
Mickey: Well, I– I’m glad you’re happy. I just want you to know though that when you decide to leave, I’m here and I love you and I miss you. I wish that when we had been able to talk before I left the church, we had– we’d had been in private. I wish I could’ve talked to you like a father and a– and a daughter talk, instead of with tape recorders and with Planning Commission uh, members around us. I wish we’d had some privacy. Is mother there? Over.
(Unintelligible chatter over radio)
Female: (Unintelligible). International phone patch. This frequency is in use.
Male: (Unintelligible) \
Adams: 8R3, did you copy the last? Over.
(Distorted unintelligible voice)
Female: This frequency is in use. Negative copy on the line.
Adams: Okay. Repeat your last transmission.
Mickey: Me?
Adams: Yeah.
Mickey: Okay. What did I say? Uh, Daddy, uh, is mother there? Can I talk to her?
(Unintelligible male voice over radio)
Adams: WD6 MID portable 8R3, did you copy? Over.
Charlie: Before walking off, you’re still involved in those terrorist activities? Over.
Mickey: Uh, is mother there? I want to speak to my mother. Is she there? Over.
Charlie: I’m asking a question. Over.
Mickey: Dad, I know you’re not asking about that yourself. Jim Jones is prompting you to ask me that question. Is my mother there? Charles Garry told me I could talk to her. Over.
Charles: Nobody’s prompting me, Mickey. You just don’t want to answer that question, and you know it. Over.
Mickey: No, I am not involved in terrorist activities. Is my mother there? I want to talk to her.
Female voice in room: Terrorist.
Female voice in room: That’s a good thing. It will give (unintelligible) more time to (unintelligible) call (unintelligible).
Mickey: Tom?
Adams: Hmm?
Mickey: What– what’s going on? I can’t hear anything.
Adams: Are you finished?
Mickey: Yeah.
(Muffled sound on radio)
Adams: Over.
Joyce Touchette: This is your mother. This is December 3, 1977, and (unintelligible).
Mickey: I’m fine, Mom. How are you? Over.
Joyce: Couldn’t be better. We’re– It’s beautiful down here, Mickey.
Mickey: I (unintelligible). I just want you to know that I love you and I’m here in San Francisco and I can easily be reached.
Adams: Mickey, I don’t– I didn’t have the key down on that time (unintelligible word).
Mickey: Okay.
Adams: Go ahead.
Mickey: I want you to know, Mom, that I love you and I miss you and when you come back in San Francisco, I can be easily reached. I’m listed. Over.
Joyce: And I love you, but I hope you change your ways, Mickey. (Unintelligible). There’s a newborn baby that we’ve adopted [Neal Shaun Welcome, age 2]. It’s the most beautiful little child. Over.
Mickey: I heard– I heard that you adopted a– a child. That’s wonderful. You should see your new grandson. He’s beautiful. He’s three years old, and he’s uh, very intelligent, and I’d love for him to know all of you. When are you going to come back to the States? Over.
Joyce: No intention to. I wouldn’t leave this place for anything. We also have an anteater, Mickey. You know Mr. Muggs. He’s here also. And we also have a little baby monkey here that (unintelligible). Over.
Mickey: Okay, mother. I just wanted you to know again that I miss you very much and uh, I wish you’d been close to me when I had my child. I wish you were all close to me right now. Uh, is Michelle there? I want to speak to Michelle. Over.
Male: Okay (unintelligible).
(Crosstalk; two male voices; unintelligible)
Joyce: Well, Mickey, I love you too but I– I hope you’ll get out of that– that terrorist activity (unintelligible). Over.
Mickey: You know, I have never, ever believed in my life that it would get to a point to where my two parents would accuse me of being involved in a terrorist activity. Mother, you are listening to that man, that are– you’re listening to lies. And until you ask me personally and until you talk to me and uh, get my side of the story, then you’re– you’re– you don’t have any right to form an opinion against me. I’m your daughter. You know me better than he does, and I know you all better than he knows you. I know that he’s telling you to ask me those questions. So I’m just letting them slide by. They’re invalid. Is Michelle there? I want to speak to her. Over.
Joyce: I do know you really well, and if you’ll recall, you did tell me all about your activities, out of your own mouth. Over.
Mickey: Mother! Don’t lie. Nothing, nothing in this world is worth lying against your daughter like that. Nothing is. I want to speak to Michelle. Over.
Joyce: I don’t know what to say. You’re willing to help (unintelligible). Over.
Mickey: I didn’t copy that, Tom.
Adams: Say again, 8R3. Say again, please.
(Distorted male voice; unintelligible)
Adams: 8R3, repeat your last, please.
(Distorted male voice; unintelligible)
Joyce: Negative copy. Negative copy.
Adams: Repeat your last transmission, please. Over.
(Distorted voices)
Joyce: Uh, Mickey, I– I do hope you get away from those (unintelligible)– those revolutionary violent activities. Do you copy? Over.
Mickey: Yes, mother, I copied. I want you to know that I work eight hours a day at a very hard job. I take care of myself. I take care of my job. I take care of my son. We’re both healthy and we’re happy and we’re doing the best we can to have a productive, good life, and I wish for you all the same. I want to speak to Michelle. C– Over.
Joyce: Mickey, (unintelligible) and Michelle’s right here but, did you ever get married? Over.
Mickey: I didn’t copy, Tom.
Adams: Say again, 8R3.
Joyce: Well, Mickey, I’m glad you found your way, but did you ever get married? Over.
Mickey: Did I ever get what?
Adams: Say again please.
Mickey: I– I hope you’ve changed your ways, uh, but did you ever get married? Over.
Adams: She’s asking if you ever got married.
Mickey: Did I ever get married?
Adams: Yeah. (Pause)
Mickey: No. I never got married. Uh– I want to speak to Michelle. Over.
Joyce: Uh, negative copy. Negative copy.
Adams: She wants you to say it again.
Mickey: No. I never got married. I want to speak to Michelle.
(Distorted, unintelligible male voice)
Joyce: Did you want to get married for the child’s sake? Over.
Mickey: I didn’t hear it. Did you hear that?
Adams: No. I didn’t. Say it again, 8R3.
Joyce: Uh, Mickey. You really should get married. You really should because of the child’s sake. Over.
Mickey: Thank you for the advice. I want to speak to Michelle. Over.
Michelle: Hello, Mickey. This is Michelle. Over.
Mickey: Hey, Michelle! Over. Is– it, wait a minute. Is it– is Michelle– Michelle say something again. It doesn’t sound like your voice. Over.
Michelle: This (unintelligible) Michelle (unintelligible).
Mickey: Oh, how are you? How are you, Michelle? I tried to reach you at the dormitories, but they wouldn’t let me see you. I miss you very much. I want you to know that I love you, and I want to see you as soon as possible. If you ever decide to leave the church, try to contact me, and I’m here in San Francisco and I’m available for you to reach me. I know what life is really like in that place, Michelle, and if you want to go, you’ve got a safe place to come to. Over.
Michelle: Are you suggesting we leave this beautiful place to go to the people that you’re involved with? Over.
Mickey: I don’t know anything about that, Michelle. That doesn’t even make any sense to me. That’s coming out of Jim Jones’ mouth, nobody else’s. I want to know, Michelle, uh, are you happy there and do you want to come home? Over.
Michelle: Mickey, I love you, and I never want to come home. Jim Jones has told me nothing about this.
Mickey: Okay, Michelle. Well, I’d like to speak to you a lot more but uh, I’d– let me speak to Michael. Is he there? Over.
(Distorted male voice)
Michelle: Mike doesn’t want to talk to you, but Albert does.
Adams: Say again, 8R3.
Michelle: Mike does not want to talk to you but Albert is here.
Adams: Okay, go ahead. Mike– Uh, she just said uh, Mike doesn’t want to talk to you, but Albert is there.
Mickey: I hear. Okay. Okay, Albert. Let me hear Albert.
Albert: Hey, Mickey. This is Albert.
Mickey: Hey– oh, Albert. Hello! I miss you, sweetheart, and I want you to come home. You want to come to San Francisco? Over.
Albert: You sound like Sarah Bernhardt. (unintelligible word)
Mickey: I didn’t hear what words you said, Al. Say it again.
Albert: I said you sound like Sarah Bernhardt.
Mickey: Well, whoever– I don’t know who that is, Al. How are you?
Albert: I entered college about three or four years ago, Mickey. This is the first time I’ve heard from you.
Mickey: Because, Albert, Jim Jones said whoever left Peoples Temple would be killed, and I was afraid. I was hiding, I was staying away from Jim Jones and Peoples Temple, Al. Uh, do you want to leave? If you do, I’m here in San Francisco. Do you want to come to me? Over.
Albert: Mickey, that’s a lie. You know that’s a lie, and I’m happy and I’m home and I love (unintelligible word).
Mickey: Okay, Al. If you ever– this goes to everybody. This goes to all of my family, that if you ever change your mind and if you want to leave Peoples Temple, you can do it. Jim Jones has no power over you at all. You can leave Peoples Temple and you can live lives or– in– in the United States. And I’m here and you can contact me whenever you want to contact me. Uh, let me speak– uh, uh, is Michael– I don’t believe that Michael won’t talk to me. I think you’re keeping him from me. Is uh– I want to speak to Grandma [Helen Swinney]. Over.
(Distorted voices; unintelligible)
Albert: Mickey, your grandmother’s in (unintelligible). Your grandmother does not want to speak with you. Over.
Mickey: Al, your voice has really changed. You sound like a g– you sound so grown up. Uh, is Grandpa [Cleave Swinney] there? I want to speak to Grandpa then.
(Distorted male voice; unintelligible).
Albert: Uh, (unintelligible) doesn’t seem to be around but we’ll call over there and ask him. Over.
Mickey: Okay. What about Uncle Tim [Swinney], is he there? I want to speak to Uncle Tim. Over.
Albert: Your Uncle Tim definitely does not want to speak to you because you got some friends that (unintelligible word) on him. Over.
Mickey: Because I have what? Look, I didn’t understand the last part. Over.
(Static, distortion)
Adams: Repeat, 8R3. Repeat.
Albert: Mickey, by the way, while we’re talking, you’re the one that sounds like a robot. Over.
Adams: (Unintelligible).
Mickey: Uh, is Uncle Tim there, Albert? I didn’t hear what you said. Let me speak to Uncle Tim.
(Distorted male voice)
Albert: (Unintelligible). Over.
Mickey: Okay, Al. That’s all right. Uh, I– I want you to know, Al– please tell Michael and tell everybody else there that I love them and I miss them. And when they decide to leave Peoples Temple, they can call me. Contact me, and I’ll do all I can to get ‘em back here. I miss you all and I know what your life is like down there. I know how awful it is. I know how miserable it is. So please call me when you want to leave. You don’t have anything to be afraid of. There’s nothing to be afraid of. I know how much– I know how a few of you want to (Unintelligible word) going out. Please, leave there as soon as you can. It’s not worth it. Over.
(Unintelligible female voice in room)
Albert: (Unintelligible). I never said I want to leave here. It’s such a beautiful, wonderful place. We’ll probably live here the rest of our lives. Over.
Mickey: Okay, Al. All right. But if you ever change your mind, please do. Please contact me. Does anybody else want to talk to me? Does anyone have another message for me? Over.
Joyce: Uh, this is your Mom, Mickey. You really sound crazy. I just wonder who’s been talking to you. I’ve never heard you talk so silly. Over.
Mickey: Okay, Mother, and I want you to know that I love you and I miss you and I’m doing everything I can to get you back to the United States. Over.
(Distorted, unintelligible voices over radio)
Michelle: Mickey, I don’t want you to bother me any more (unintelligible). Goodbye.
Mickey: What’d she say?
Adams: Say again, 8R3.
Michelle: Mickey, I don’t want you to bother us any more (unintelligible). Anything you (unintelligible). Goodbye.
Mickey: Well, Michelle, I don’t believe you. I believe that all of you down there that are my family, I believe that you dolove me. I believe that you do miss me, and I believe that eventually you‘ll be away from there, and when you will be away from there, we will be a family again. I will– I will not give up on that. I believe it will happen. We will again be a family, away from Jim Jones, because he is not going to be able to keep all of the people down in that jungle the way he’s trying to keep– the way he’s trying to keep you down there. I imagine that he’s probably there listening to me right now. Is he? Over.
(Distorted crosstalk; unintelligible)
Michelle: (Unintelligible).
Mickey: All right– all right, Michelle. Does anyone else want to talk to me? Over.
Male: I have your grandpa, Mickey.
Mickey: Hi. (Unintelligible) Grandpa. Hi! I’m so glad to hear you! How are you? Over.
(Distorted voices; unintelligible)
Mickey: Can I talk to him?
Adams: Uh, WD6 MID portable 8R3, WA6 D2J, did you copy, 8R3?
(Multiple distorted voices; unintelligible)
Adams: WD6 MID portable 8R3 with WA6 D2J in an international phone patch. Did you copy? Over.
Cleave Swinney: Negative copy.
Mickey: Could I talk?
Adams: Okay. Say it again.
Mickey: Can I just talk?
Adams: Yes.
Mickey: Grandpa, I want you to know that I’ve got your first great grandchild here. Would you like to see him? Over.
Cleave: Negative copy.
Adams: Say it again. Say it again.
Mickey: (Slowly) Grandpa, this is Mickey. I have your first great grandchild with me. Would you like to see him when you get back to the United States? Over.
Cleave: (Unintelligible) the most beautiful place in the world. Goodbye.
Mickey: I heard that, Grandpa. All of you are telling me what a beautiful place that jungle is. That’s fine. What I’m telling you is that when you decide to leave there, I’m here in San Francisco. I’m here, waiting on you. I want to have another Christmas. I want to have another Thanksgiving. I want to have a family, and I want you all to get out of there as soon as you can. Over.
Cleave: All right. You also (unintelligible).
(Multiple distorted voices; unintelligible)
Mickey: That wasn’t real clear, but I understand that I have to wait. I’m willing to wait. I’ve waited all these years, and I’ll wait more. I’ll wait as long as it takes for Jim Jones to give up what he’s doing to you and to everybody else. Does anybody else want to talk to me? Over.
Cleave: (Unintelligible) I’ll never come home.
Mickey: Okay. That’s all right. That’s– You tell me that over the radio but I– but believe whatever you want to believe in your heart, and follow what you feel to be true to yourself. Is Grandma there? Over.
Cleave: The thing is she does not want to talk to you, honey.
Mickey: Well, tell her that her grandchild loves her. I love her and I miss her. And I wish that she would talk to me. There’s nothing that I can say that would hurt her. I want to tell her that I love her and I miss her and I want to see her as soon as possible. Over.
Cleave: (Unintelligible).
Mickey: I didn’t hear that.
Adams: Say again, 8R3.
Cleave: We know that there’s nothing you can say that would hurt us.
Mickey: Okay. I want to speak to Uncle Tim. Over.
Cleave: He says he doesn’t want to talk to you, child.
Mickey: Well, tell Uncle Tim that I miss him and I love him and I’ve got– tell– tell them all that their nephew and their grandchild is here with me. And I want them all to see him. We’re family. And I want us to be a family again. Jim Jones is not strong enough to break up a family, no matter how hard he tries. It may take him a few years, but we’ll get back together again. Over.
Cleave: Negative copy. Negative copy. Repeat (unintelligible).
Mickey: (Unintelligible). What I said is, I have your grandchild here and your nephew here, and I don’t care how many years Jim Jones tries to keep you away, he cannot break this family up forever. Nothing is stronger than the family and uh, (gust of exasperation)– Over.
Albert: I think he is trying to say that nobody is quite the same because you went out and left your family.
Mickey: Who’s talking? Who was doing that talking?
Adams: Who’s uh– who is on the other end? Over.
Albert: Mickey, I’ve (unintelligible) tied to family. The family is not the same. You ran away and left the family.
Mickey to Adams: Is that Albert?
Adams: You can go ahead and ask him.
Mickey: Is that Albert? Over.
Albert: Roger, roger.
(Distorted voices)
Mickey: Okay, Albert. You understand what it had to made you like that, Al. You understand because Jim Jones said we would be killed. That’s why. I left on my own. Albert, you can leave on your own too. You can leave just like I did. You have to make that decision yourself. You have to decide that you want to leave Peoples Temple, you have to decide that you want to leave Jim Jones. You have to decide that you’re not afraid of him. You have to do it yourself. And when you decide that you want to get out of there, then just call. Just leave. You know there’s a lot of people here who will help you. You don’t have to stay there the rest of your lives. Nothing was telling you have to stay there. Uh, you– you will not be on– uh, you will not drop dead when you leave. He does not have a gift. He is not metaphysical. He cannot heal. You– he– you have no reason to be afraid of him. Over.
Male: (Unintelligible)
(Squeal; distorted, unintelligible voices)
Adams: WD6 MID portable 8R3, did you copy?
(Unintelligible background chatter on radio)
(Mickey speaks to Adams in background; unintelligible)
Adams: WD6 MID portable 8R3 and WA6 D2J in an international phone patch. Traffic (unintelligible) would be appreciated. Did you copy, 8R3?
Cleave: I said I want to go back to my little cottage here so we are really happy. (Unintelligible).
Mickey: That sounds like Grandpa, and if it was Grandpa, I’m happy to hear your voice. I’m glad– I hope that you’re getting the proper medical care down there that you need. You’re probably not. But I hope you are.
Mickey (off the air): Hmm?
Mickey: Uh, Uncle Marvin is very concerned about you, and he wants me to say hello to all of you and that he misses all of you. Uncle Bob feels the same way and so do all of the Touchettes. They’re all rooting for you, and they hope that you will leave there as soon as possible. They miss you. They hold no grudges against you. They understand. They say– they leave– they understand the sickness of Jim Jones also. Over.
Joyce: Uh, Mickey, I don’t really know what you’re talking about because we just talked to Emily the other night, and for a long time (unintelligible) and uh, she was very happy for us down there. Over.
Mickey: Well, she wasn’t a member of Peoples Temple the way I was, so she’s– maybe she doesn’t know some things. That’s all right. But she still hopes that you leave the church. She hopes that you leave and she hopes you get out, as do all the rest of your family. They all miss you as a family. They all want to be a family together again. Like I said, he cannot break up a family the way he’s trying to. That was one of the first things he told us in that church was, “break your family ties” and “call your parents by their first name”. And swear and uh, uh, de– deny your family ties, like I said before, and he’s tried to do that within the church also. Over.
Mickey speaks to Adams: (unintelligible)
Adams: Uh-hmm.
Joyce: Uh, you guys still– the children were calling us by our first names before we even joined the Peoples Temple. Idon’t know what you’re talking about. Over.
Mickey: Mom, that’s a lie. I never called you Joyce and I never called my father Chuck, until Jim Jones encouraged us to do that. He tried to break up the family. Now, I wanted to tell you, Mom, how much– to get away from Jim Jones. He’s not the reason I called you. I called to see how you’re doing, and I called to say– tell you that I love you and that I miss you. Uh, there’s a lot of things that I want to talk to you about in regards to raising a child. I really want your advice on a lot of things. Uh, it’s kind of hard to talk to you over the screaming like this over the radio but uh, if you can get a letter to me, if you can write to me if possible, without it being censored, do that. And if you can get– uh, just write to me if you can. Send me some private thoughts though, that he will not– that Jim Jones will not know about. Over.
Joyce: Hey, Mickey, I’m really tired about you talking about the best friend I have ever had. Uh, I’m really tired of talking to you, but I do have some advice. You really should get married to the child’s folk. Goodbye, Mickey.
Mickey: Goodbye, Mother. And it was good talking to you, and I’m glad to hear your voice. I’m glad you’re still alive, and I have not given up that you’ll be back in the United States again, so that I can talk to you like my mother without having Jim Jones’ interference. I want to see– I want to talk to my father. Over.
Charlie: Mickey, this is your Dad. I’m not interested in talking with you any longer. Good night.
Mickey: Good night, Daddy, and I know you’re all interested in talking to me and I know that if Jim Jones wasn’t there, you probably would have a lot to say to me. When you come back to the United States, we’ll have a lot of time to talk in private. Goodbye, and I love you all. Tell Mike that I’m sorry he wouldn’t talk to me. I miss him and I love him too, and the same for Albert and the same for Michelle, Grandma, Grandpa, Uncle Tim and a lot of people there. I want to how Ava– I want to know how the Cobbs are doing too. I want to know how everybody there is doing. How they’re reallydoing. Over.
Charlie: I can see through you. I can see through your game. Don’t– I am never coming back to the States. Goodbye.
Mickey to Adams: Was that Charlie? Was that Charlie?
Adams: Ask.
Mickey: I don’t know if that was my father or not. Was that Charlie talking? Over.
Charlie: Mickey, this is your father, and I am tired of this nonsense. Over.
Mickey: Okay, Daddy. Call it nonsense, but I know I’m telling the truth, and I know that in your heart, you know that I’m telling the truth. I want you to know that I’m here in San Francisco, and I can easily be reached. Call me when you want to get out of Peoples Temple. You don’t have to stay there and live that life you’re living for the rest of your life. You can get out and be free and be your own person and make your own decisions. Over.
Charlie: Mickey, government people from all over the world come out and look at this place and tell us what’s– how beautiful it is and what a good job we’ve done here. You talk like a fool. Over.
Mickey: I’m sorry you think that, Daddy, but like I said, when you decide to leave and when you want to get out of there, come out. We’re not going to give up here. Tell Jim Jones that. We’re not going to give up, and he can sit back there and he can laugh and laugh and laugh, because we in the United States are going to continue until our families are returned to us. Over.
Charlie: Mickey, are you going to kidnap us? Over.
Mickey: No, Daddy. That’s your word. I didn’t say that. We’ll do it legally. Everything will be done legally, and like I said, Jim Jones will not be able to continue ripping up families and controlling people’s minds the way he does it. Over.
Charlie: Mickey, I’m an adult and I have made up my own mind. Over.
Mickey: Okay, but I’m telling you, Daddy, that’s just to keep talking to you, it’s wonderful hearing your voice. It’s great. I’m glad that you’re okay, and I’m glad that you’re able to at least keep talking. Uh, over.
Mickey to Adams: Oh, there’s– Hey! Can I keep talking, Tom?
Adams: Go ahead.
Mickey: I want you to know, Daddy, that your grandson needs a grandfather and he needs his aunts and his uncles and his grandmother. And uh, as soon as you get back here, you will love him. You can see him. He plays– he– he’s a little athlete. Already he’s a little athlete. And he’s uh, he– he– he plays baseball. He– he tosses a tennis racket and he uh– he’s a lot of fun. You would have a ball with him. You would enjoy him so much. Over.
Charlie: (Unintelligible) Bring him down here, and we have a beautiful three bedroom home. Over.
Mickey: Well, I have a beautiful city apartment, and I did my time with Peoples Temple, and I’m not going to do any more time, Daddy. I had enough of it. I don’t want Jim Jones. I don’t want Peoples Temple. I want my son out to where he can make up his mind to do what he wants to do, when he wants to do it. I don’t want anyone telling him what to say over a radio. Over.
Charlie: (Unintelligible) of hate. Over.
Mickey: I don’t want no hate. All I have told you is how much I love you and how much I miss you and how much I cannot wait to see you again, and your little grandson here, he can say– he’s been taught how to say Aunt Michelle, he’s been taught how to say Uncle Mike, Uncle Al, Grandma and Grandpa and Uncle Tim, Aunt Ava, Aunt Sandy and Aunt Brenda, Aunt Jo– Uncle Johnny and Uncle Joel. He can say all that. He’s waiting on the day when he can come ba– when all of you will come back and see him. Over.
Charlie: Mickey, what are you trying to do? You know that we use aunts and uncles and grandpas and grandmas, moms and pops, (Unintelligible word).
Mickey: No you– no, you don’t. No, you don’t. Don’t even tell me that. Why did Jim Jones’ own daughter [Suzanne Jones] leave the church if it’s so fantastic?
Charlie: Mickey, you are a nasty little liar. You know what we do. Over.
Mickey: Daddy, I’m not lying to you. You did not teach me to lie. You taught me to tell the truth. You taught me to think for myself. You taught me to be individualistic and you taught me to be independent. And that’s what I’m being right now. I’m not lying. He told us to call– he told us to break family ties. He told us to call our parents by their first names, (Pause) and I don’t want to adapt, I don’t want to uh– I don’t want to be what somebody else tells me to be. I’m Mickey Touchette, and for me to adapt to Jim Jones’ way of living is sick and degenerate. Over.
Charlie: I said, I would not teach you to get involved in drugs and violent revolutions. Over.
Mickey: You’re right. You never taught me to do that, and I never did it. Over.
Charlie: You are a liar. Over.
Mickey: Well, Daddy, if that can all be proven, please do it. Please prove it. Tell Jim Jones to produce records that shows me getting involved in that type of thing. When I left the church, he told you that I was in jail. Make him prove to you that– the jail copies. I never did anything like that. Over.
Charlie: Mickey, I didn’t know that you was in jail. Were you in jail? Over.
Mickey: No, I wasn’t, but Jim Jones said I was. Over.
Charlie: That’s another lie, Mickey. That’s another lie. I didn’t know you were in jail. Over.
Mickey: Like I said, Daddy, I wasn’t, but the– if I had been in jail, then the copies could be proven. Daddy, look at us. Me and you are fighting. Daughter and father are fighting over Jim Jones, Daddy. That’s not even right. It’s not natural. I don’t want to talk to you like this. I want to tell you how much I love you and I want to talk to you about raising my child and about you being a grandfather. That’s what I’m interested in. I want to know if you can ever leave the church. Over.
Charlie: Be (unintelligible). I’ve got five acres. You’ve got an apartment. Why don’t you come down here? Over.
Mickey: I have no desire to go down there. I want you all to come back up into the United States. I know you want to leave, Daddy, and that’s all– that’s good enough for me. When you decide to, I’m here in San Francisco, and this con– I know what this conversation means, and I know what’s prompting it. That’s okay. That’s okay, I understand. I love you and I miss you. Nobody understands Peoples Temple and Jim Jones better than people who have gone through it, than ex-members. When you decide to leave, I’m here. I’m waiting for you. Over.
Charlie: Mickey, any psychologist could tell that you’re filled with hate, and I don’t want to live in your apartment. Over.
Mickey: Okay, but I want you to know that if I can, if there’s any way I can get down there, I’ll try to get to Guyana to see you. Will Jim Jones pay my way there and back? Over. (Pause)
Charlie: Negative copy. Negative copy. Over.
Mickey: It figures that would be a negative copy. I– I wanted to know that I’ll try to get to you in Guyana, whichever way I can. Will Jim Jones pay my way there and back? Over.
Charlie: Mickey, with all the hate that you have, I wouldn’t let him pay your way down here and back. Over.
Mickey: I have no hate, Daddy. I have no hate. I’ll go even if I have to pay my own way, and if I do, then what will you do? Over.
Charlie: Fine, fine, Mickey. Over.
Mickey (Off the air): Fine. Over.
Mickey: How are you, Daddy? Besides all that, what do you do with your time during the day? I’m interested to know how you live. Over. (Pause)
Charlie: Mickey, I’m finished with this conversation. I’m finished with this combin– conversation. Terminate the phone patch.
Adams: Okay. WA6 D2J, terminating phone patch with WB6 MID portable 8R3.
Mickey: Okay. (Unintelligible).
End of tape