Transcript prepared by Fielding M. McGehee III. If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you.
Jones: (begins in mid sentence) – how stupid this sounds, and I’m using this language because that’s just how stupid the whole stuff sounds.
Jones: (Ministerial cadence) And this very day, this very day, you women are– you’re treated, not like a whole piece of shit – men are treated at least like a whole piece of shit – but women are treated like a little side shit. (Pause) The big shit show goes for the man. But the woman just accounts– You say, well, why are women treated so– why are women still not able to make the mon– as much wages? Women still do the s– the same jobs and make half the pay. We don’t need black liberation. We need women to be free, women just cannot even get free, they can work just as hard. (Unintelligible name- sounds like “Bucks”), up here in the office, there’s a woman working on my letters, there’re thousands that come from these people that want another God. Thousands up there, they’re working on my letters, getting them out, because I’ll never fail to give them some kind of help. They get to me. All right. (Voice calms) That woman up there is a purchasing manager– she’s a director of purchasing. She’s the purchasing agent in the– agent for the whole of Masonite. But she gets half the pay of the man that had that post. Half the pay of the man in the other factory that had the post. She’s (unintelligible word). Who [do] you blame for it? You blame your Bible. You can blame your Bible, you can blame your Skygod. Because a woman has never accounted for nothing but a little side shit. She’s never been anything. She’s never amounted to anything. Woman’s supposed to’ve been the fault of man’s fall. Poor damn fool. The moment she gets out of his a– side, she goes out lookin’ for something to– get him something to eat. Naturally, naturally. That’s the way the Skygod would make it. So poor little ol’ Eve, she– all she count for is some of his shit, so she gone have to go feed his big shit, so she’s goes out huntin’ around to find him an apple. At least she wants to see him fi– fed. Skygod don’t worry about feedin’ him. Skygod said (pseudo-authoritative voice), “But don’t you eat of that tree. By God, you do what I tell you. If you starve your ass, you gone do what I tell you, you don’t eat of that tree.” (Normal tone) Well, there’s a nice apple up there. He said, “You eat that damn apple, the day you eat, you gonna die, you bitch.”
Congregation: Calls out. Scattered applause
Jones: I’m tellin’ you how it happened, honey, I’m just telling you the truth. (Pause) “You eat that tre– you eat that apple, and I’ll put your ass down.” [Eve] Said, “But that apple– my husband needs the food.” (Low tone) That ol’– (unintelligible word) with that serpent that come up somewhere, I don’t know where in the hell he come from he, he Lucifer, he now, he, he’s a snake. He– He’s turned into a snake. He was beautiful, now he’s a snake. You see the story– The most beautiful angel one day, the most beautiful thing God ever made, according to your Bible, then the next day, he’s a snake in the goddamn Garden. Well, he’s crawlin’ around down there, and he says, “Don’t you pay no attention to that omniscifart– now I know that sonbitch don’t know what he’s doing.” He said, “Don’t you pay no attention to him, because I’m gone tell you, you eat that apple, and you won’t die, but the day you do eat that apple, you gone know right from wrong.” Ain’t that what Lucifart– uh, Lucifer said?
Jones: He said, “The day you eat that apple, you going to know”– and God said, (pseudo-authoritative voice) “Don’t you eat that apple, ’cause the day you do, you gonna die. Don’t you mess with me, by God. (Pause) I run this damn show.” (Pause) (Normal tone) Well, he run it pretty poor, because a little ol’ snake crawls through the garden, and says, “Don’t you pay no attention to that old shit. He don’t know what he talkin’ about. Because when you eat that– he’s only afraid you’re gonna eat that apple, and have as much sense as he does.” (Voice rises) That’s what your Bible tells you, and you been carrying that thing around for years. [Lucifer] Says, “He’s only afraid that when you eat that apple, you will have the knowledge of good and evil, and you will be like the gods, and he doesn’t want you to be like Him, he wants you to stay down here sniffin’ His shit.” (Pause) You say, well, it isn’t written just that way. Don’t make any difference how it’s written, that’s the way it comes out. (Pause) (Normal tone) It said, the day eat– the day they eat, you’ll be like the gods. And exactly who told the truth? The little ol’ snake told the truth. She ate– (intake of breath) (Quiet tone) She took the apple, took it to Adam– course, she didn’t eat it, of course not. She’s a woman. God wouldn’t dare let the woman eat first. She took the apple, and gave it to Eve, to A– to Adam, whatever his name was. And Adam (quick intake), he took a bite. And then she took a bite. And by golly, (Pause) they didn’t feel like dying.
Jones: (Cries out) We’re free. (Ribald tone) She say, “Oh, Adam, I don’t know what you may like, but come on tighter.” (Laughs) She say, “I feel good. I’m gonna (unintelligible word), I’m gonna eat these apples all night (Unintelligible phrase)–”
Jones: You see, nonsense and foolishness. Nonsense and foolishness. Nonsense and foolishness. And we built a story around that kind of (Unintelligible word– “paganist”?). God was a liar. The snake told the truth. They did not die, their eyes were opened, and they did have the knowledge of good and evil, they did become like the gods, because they could choose whether they wanted evil or good. And then, because they did what was natural to anyone, to eat when you’re hungry, Eve was cursed– all women, not only Eve– what the hell did Eve have to do with you? What the hell did Eve have to do with Mother [Marceline] LeTourneau? But because Eve took the apple obediently to Adam, from that day forward, Mother LeTourneau and every other woman had to bear children with pain. (Pause) All right. That’s what the Book says. That’s what the Book says. And because Adam ate the apple that his good wife brought him, he must work from that day forward and earn his bread by the toil and sweat of his brow. He had to be a nigger from that day forward, because he ate a apple that his good wife brought to him. Now why have we listened to this shit? Now you’re getting tired of listening to my shit, and I’m makin’ it interesting. But you’re gettin’ ready to go home. You’re ready to quit. You’re ready to close up on my shit, and my shit’s a whole lot funnier than that shit.
Jones: I feel like tearin’ this mess up. I don’t tear it up, because of my faithful socialist, ’cause it’s a cushion to them. So I’ll try to get it out of the– this area and kind of halfway back, so we don’t get too far out here, ’cause some people feel like they– their ass is hanging out now, they don’t know– (phrase drowned out by laughter). Have to get back here and get it– And they say, I don’t want to step out of my britches too far, Father, just give me one of my britches at least, so I can come stragglin’ along here. So I’m gonna have to kind of– because I love you– Oh, you don’t know how hard it is to be (breathless) God, how awful it is to be God. I’m gonna back up now. Start the backward motion. So that everybody won’t quit. ‘Cause if I kept on, said all I had to do, and all I want to say tonight, we’d only end up about a hundred here. (Pause) Ummm-hmm. No. ‘Cause I love you too much. ‘Cause we only had a hundred, that street gang of devils, that God folk out there, those good Christians, those Bible-fearing people, those people that love God on Sunday, and hate blacks Monday through Saturday, if I told you everything I would like to tell you, they’d come in here and get us. I don’t give a shit what they do with me. I wish they’d come. I wish one– I bet you one thing, I may be just an ol’ shit God, but I’m gone tell you. I’m the only God there is. Peace. I’d just like to– right now, I’d like to call it a day, and say come on, you honky bastards, and if it wasn’t for you, ooohhh man, I’ve got that quickest (unintelligible phrase, then crowd reaction drowns him out).
Jones: I’ve had my toe in one body, one’s eye in an– heal another’s throat, and I’ve had the finger up somebody else’s ass, and (Calls out) hey now–
Jones: (Unintelligible cry)– and I’d had so many folk out there say that sonbitch must be God, ’cause he’s sure knocked a whole lot of us down. (Pause) I just keep on fightin’ and fightin’ through a bunch of these honkies, and say let me tell you, this is nigger power. You don’t like it, kill it.
Jones: Well, that’s what I would do, if I did not love you. ‘Cause I’m a– Come back and see us now. Yeah, I know you, I’m not (unintelligible word), just– I got people leavin’ on all levels here tonight, and all– all levels. (Puffs into microphone) (Laughs) The whole Bible story is as crazy as my story was about Lucifart. Just that crazy. Jonah and the whale, and Job, the only one he– the poor fool, He could fart up stars and He could throw out space and He could build planets, but He couldn’t even make a faithful man. ‘Cause Adam ate the apple He told him not to, Eve did it, then by God, He went through and finally got him one. Couldn’t get Him a trustworthy sonofabitch. But He found it in one named Job. [He] Said, “By God, Lucifart, come here. (Calls out) Come here, Lucifart. Hey! Lucifart! Lucifer.” Lucifart say, “What the hell you want now?” (Pause) Ol’ God said, “I’m gone tell you. I’ve told you I’ve got somebody, I’ve got somebody”– You wanna get– you wanna get healed when you get a heart attack? Better not talk about me now, ’cause I’m in a– I’m in a holy place. I– I’m just tellin’ you the truth. I’m gone tell you now, don’t you shit with me now. (Pause) ‘Cause you think that I’m in power when I’m up there talkin’ about Jesus and God and the Spirit and the Consciousness? Mess with me when I’m tellin’ the truth.
Jones: Just mess with me when I’m tellin’ the truth. (Pause) You never seen no power like you do when you get me talkin’ shit. That’s shit power. You know shit’s got power, honey. (Pause) It’s a smell to those that don’t want to grow, but it’s fertilizer. It makes growth in people that want be new and change. Shit’s the way you fertilize the seed. (Pause) Well, He said, Lucifart, “I finally, by God, I been fartin’ all over this place, but I tell you now, I’ve farted me out a Job. I took a long fart, and I got me a Job. And I gonna tell you that one thing, you can’t take him.” And the Bible said, he’s the only one left. There wasn’t nobody else left faithful. Angels had all gone u– bad, everybody in the whole damn planet gone bad, He’d wiped them out with water once and He– He– He– He’d drowned ’em, and said, “The next time, I’m gone burn their ass.” [He] Said, “I’ve drowned them once, next time I’m gone burn ’em.” What kind of God is this? (Pause) If I made something, honey, it’s me that I’m makin’. I shouldn’t kill the thing I make. I shouldn’t– it oughta be me I shoot. ‘Cause if I make something that turns out wrong, it was me that did it, so it’s my ass that oughta be shot, not them. But God made Him all kinds of farts, and He didn’t like the farts, and He said, “I’ll drown ’em, ’cause I don’t like the way I’m fartin’.” [He] Said, “The next time I get through, I won’t drown the fart this time, (unintelligible phrase) burn ’em, I’m gone see if I can’t burn these farts out.” (Pause) (Sniffs) I’m gettin’ nasal passages that were congested with people’s shit cleaned out. If you don’t get help, I am.
Jones: Anyway. (Voice lowers) Anyway, “Job,” He said, “Now Job’s been faithful.” He said, “Now Lucifart, you take him, Satan” – Lucifart changed to Satan now, ’cause somebody else got to mix their religion, and Satan meant Saturn, and the astrologers got messed up– your Bible messed up with the– all kinds of superstitions. Every kind of weird superstition that came along, they changed that Bible. He started Lucifarting and he ended up Satan. Then he ended up Beelzebub. Hell, you never know what he gonna end up, ’cause whoever’s writing, that’s what he ends up. Bible just written by a whole lot of liars, who want to make a little money, and keep the people slaves, so– ’cause King James was the greatest slave holder of all, and sent King James Bible– the king sent the first ship over, as I told you, to bring the blacks back in chains. And he did the same to poor whites and uh, all over the world. He pl– he was a slave master. “Well, Job,” He said, “Now, you’ve got Job,” He say, “He’s gonna pay for it. He’s kept my sayings, he’s done all I ever wanted anybody to do. He’s a perfect man.” (Pause) Now if you were perfect, and God knows – no, he don’t – I know that you’re not. But when you even try, I go to jail and get you out, I’ll go to the jaws of death to save you, and I’ll– what I try to be more– I’m not working so hard to save somebody from death any more, I really ought to, but I’m trying to save you from cancers, we’ve had nobody in our group that came under my ministry, that started under my ministry, that’s developed that thing. Mother [Rosie] Ijames has been me all the years, it’s been stopped. I’d like to stop more, because there’s been a lot of good people who died with cancer. But I– I’m only able to stop some things on the basis of people knowing all I’m saying. It’s very hard to understand me, ’cause I talk so simple. People don’t like simple talk. It’s the– they want it all complicated, because the more complicated, then it– it– it– it– it looks less real, because the real don’t look like we want it to look, so we gotta make it complicated. I’m so simple, and anybody can understand simple shit can understand me, but most people don’t, and if you do understand me simply, less trouble comes your way. (Clears throat) But anyhow, I’m trying hard to keep anybody from– believe it or not, some people have even spit in my face, I mean, they tried to kill me, but I’ve gotten them out of jail. Why would they ask me to do something for ’em, they just done so much to me. I mean, against me. And I don’t think anything about it, I save you from horrible deaths, I save you from painful experiences, and your car, all the capitalist things, maybe tore the head off, ’cause I don’t worry about cars. And how many time you seen cars tore the hell out of ’em, just tore up, and you’ve walked right out of them. Just tore all to hell. Walked right out of them.
Jones: I’m not so good with cars, but I’m pretty good with people. And a lot of cars I’ve saved, come to think about it. (Laughs) Some of your cars running, when you– like Edith Cordell’s on bald tires, and runs for all these years, never did run out, just finally– (unintelligible word) it wasn’t quite the thing to do to keep her driving, but it drove for years and years. I tried to reward half-assed faithfulness. I reward people who are lousy. I’ve been down this week– Tuesday, I was down fightin’ for somebody who threatened to kill me. (Pause) Got him out. That’s the kind of stuff I do. Now here’s what God does. God say, “See Job, Lucifart. You see Job. Now you just take Job and you do with him anything you want to do.” (Pause) Now that would’ve been enough for me. I’da throwed my damn Bible away right then. But not some of you folk, you’ve kept it and held it on. But that’d been all for me. (Pause) Job? What happened to Job? Good Reverend Edwards, what happened to him? Good Comrade, tell some of the shit that happened to Job. ‘Cause I’m tired of talking.
Voice too soft.
Jones: Lost all of his cattle, lost all of his animals.
Voice too soft.
Voice too soft
Jones: I– Uh, repeat. (Laughs)
Edwards: Lost his children.
Jones: He lost his children.
Voice too soft.
Jones: Lost his land.
Voice too soft.
Jones: Last thing was the wife, and if God had been just, that’d probably been the first.
Jones: No, not in those days, ’cause probably she was very much a slave like she’s supposed to have been. Just like God wanted her to be.
Edwards: (Voice too soft) –skinworms– (Too soft)
Jones: Skinworms, boils and skinworms. And then what that poor ol’ fool say?
Voice too soft.
Jones: (Mimics Job’s voice) “Yeah, they in my flesh. Those are skinworms destroy my ass.” [Job] Said, “Though they destroy my flesh,” said, “Yet will I serve God?” (Pause) Now I’m gone tell you, if one skinworm got in your ass, you’d say, Jim Jones, I’m finished. All you’d have to do is go home and find one maggot – that’s what he’s talking about, maggots in the Hebrew – maggots eat the poor man alive, just as Job– yes?
Voice too soft.
Jones: No, no, I wasn’t referring to you. You– you don’t need to worry about it. You’re not– you’re not one of those uh, uh, paper ch– church-goers, I– I’m not worried about you.
Voice too soft.
Jones: Oh, no, don’t worry. Honey–
Voice too soft.
Jones: If you– If you burned your husband’s Bible, then there’s hope for anybody, honey. (Pause) And I say– She– She used to be a slave, her husband was one of them folks that thought women was supposed to bathe their husbands. Now she’s got so free around here, and so cocky, he’s threatened to kill me, he don’t make no difference. She’s got so free now, she’s burned that ol’ fool’s Bible.
Congregation: Claps and laughter
Jones: (Laughs) He used to tell her, you gonna do this, you gonna do that.
Voice too soft.
Jones: Well, you– you– you look pretty smart to me, honey. He was telling her about a– the Bible story, about obedience and all that, and saying– and glorifying the Bible, and she got tired of it, and she burned it. And that’s a free woman. (Clears throat) It makes me open– open target– I have to be very honest, and I have to love you very much, because when– every time a woman does a thing like that, it makes the man determined to murder me. And I don’t care, because I’d rather have you free. And I’d rather be dead than to see women slaves or blacks slaves. I’d rather be dead than see how you were when he first– you were so tight when he came in, he walked in, cocky little bastard, he was. Cocky little bastard. He just, (makes noises in imitation of bossiness), do this. He don’t do that anymore, huh? ‘Cause she don’t do– she tell him where to get lost. But he just gonna put her in a mental institution, but all– he said to me right down here in the (unintelligible word), he said, well, I’ll put her away. You put her away, he’s a good holy Christian, he gonna put her away. But now she tells him to get lost.
End of side one
Tape originally posted April 2001