Q161 Transcript

Transcript prepared by Fielding M. McGehee III. If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you.

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To read the Tape Summary, click here. Listen to MP3 (Pt. 1, Pt. 2).

Part 1: Jonestown meeting

Crowd: Applause

Marilyn Pursley: Thank you very much. Uh— It’s very hard for me to speak to so many people, that I’m— I— I’m so overwhelmed by all the things I’ve seen here. Every place I turn, I see uh, things that indicate how much labor and effort and money have gone into building Jonestown. And it’s just overwhelming. Uh— It’s going to be very hard to leave, but I’m leaving my three brothers here, I’ve got Cynthia [Pursley] down, and I feel as if there’s no place in the world where Cynthia could be happier than— than here in Jonestown, where she’ll love— be loved and— and learn, and be well taken care of. Today she came back, and she went to a class, came back and said, (brightly) “Well, I’m learning Russian.”

Crowd: Laughs

Marilyn Pursley: (Laughs) And she sa— said a few words in Russian, and uh, that’s just an example of what’s happening to all the children here. Every place I’ve turned, I’ve just seen people learning and growing. And my own grandson has uh, changed so much and grown so much since they’ve been here that uh, I just— Words fail me. And I guess everyone who comes here feels that way. It’s just overwhelming. And thank you for having me.

Crowd: Applause

Marceline: Thank you. I think you said it very well, and uh, I think you should know that— as you well know, we’ve had a struggle the last year and a half, but when we needed marchers, she was there to march. When we needed someone, she was there. And one of the beautiful things that happens out of the kind of thing we’ve been through in the last year and a half, we find out who our friends are and who our comrades are. And it’s deeply appreciated. Thank you so much.

Crowd: Applause

(tape edit)

Male: (Reading) To your poor and your workers whom you oppressed, is this why I must die? Because I came mili— became militant against your corruption? Then I don’t want to hear about law and order, when your laws are in a state of disrepair, and your so-called order is synonymous with maintaining an immoral status quo. I don’t want to hear about violence. It is your system that is violent. It is your system that allows senior citizens to die, freezing in each other’s arms, and your babies to go to bed hungry at night. It is your system that takes the dignity away from black people, that forces them into prostitution and crime, just so that they can survive. Don’t talk to me about violence. It is you that is pointing the gun at me. And I say to you, like all workers of the world must say to the corrupt systems they live under, kiss my ass. Now I want to see the faces of those brave men who stand ready to pull the triggers. I want to see them. I want to see. I want to see— (tape silence for two seconds) cowards. You stand behind a wall. Capitalist cowards. Then be done with me. Kill me. But watch one thousand rise on my left side, and ten thousand on my right. (Pause) You can kill me, but you can’t kill my song. And it will lead my comrade workers on to organize. I’m ready now. Go ahead and fire. Why don’t you fire?

Sound of three gunshots

Jones: (mike switches on) —dead. For the third time running, someone has tried to poison my food. We have the sediments, and we’re going to study them under the microscope. What kind of beast do we have in our midst?

Crowd reaction.

Jones: But don’t you worry. If you’re guilty, we’ll find you.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

Jones: My feet may not be ready, but what I can put in my hands is.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: —know I’m tired of this shit. If I catch you, the court won’t have any opportunity to deal with you, ‘cause I’m going to hang you on the highest tree I can find.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: —(unintelligible opening) food, to watch that food from beginning to end. I don’t worry about myself, as much for our people. I want you to watch that food. ‘Cause we’ve got some kooks in our midst.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

Jones: You may be seated. (Pause) Fact of the matter, I’d like to be a sampler, ‘cause I can take the food better than you can. I’ve got a resistance that’s not ordinary. It’s a little bit higher than ordinary. So (tape edit?) I would like to take a taste of every bit of food that goes through this house. (Pause) You think you’re smart, don’t you. You think you’re dealing with just an ordinary man. Wait’ll I get through with you.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

Jones: Can we go on with the program? Whatever we have to take care of in business-wise— Turn the lights on in the center section now, folks, so I can see the whites of everybody’s eyes. (Murmured aside, unintelligible) First place, I have question if it’s not coming right out of the kitchen, so that narrows my— narrows my investigation. So we’re going to put surveillance on the— on food. I’m sick of this, it’s— it’s enough trouble trying to stay awake, alert, and uh, on the ball to defend my people, to have somebody give me enough to knock out a horse, goddamn you. You can give me enough to knock out an elephant, and I’ll still be there to beat your ass.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: —the most beautiful society he’d ever seen. But he suggests when we have new guests, that we close the windows of our big uh, our dorms. Who will be responsible for that? I mean responsible. Can you get around quick when you hear they’re coming? Thank you. My Louisiana kid’s always in there. (Pause) Give us a little time, we’ll have enough, we won’t have to use those, those can be used for hospitals and other facilities, lots of room we— we can use, or they can be converted into smaller quarters by— by walls. There’s a lot of, of reason there— there’s no waste. Now (tape edit?) whether anybody doubts that we don’t have housing (unintelligible phrase)— where’d the hell they go?

Voice too soft.

Jones: You ought to go get the map, to keep that map up all the time.

Voice too soft

Jones: Well— revise, that’s sweet of you. I want you to look at what we’ve got in mind, by the goddamn treasonous defector back there, and I’m not saying yet till I get— have a choice. That’s cost us another news story in Los Angeles. Everything was dying, till that started. And they’ve got a congressman [Leo Ryan] they want to come in who’s close to the member of the John Birch Society, just to drop on— drop in, and my opinion is, to tell them to stick it.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

Male voice: That’s right.

(tape edit)

Jones: —people just— out of (unintelligible word) safety, and there uh, is an element in here trying to kill me. And I know who you are now, I’ve down— I’ve got you singled down. I’ve got you singled down.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: I mean, I got will. You may mean to put me in a goddamn bed. I was so out of it— I was so out of it 20 minutes ago, or 30 minutes ago, that it— it took two people to drag me out. I couldn’t see straight. I saw two, but by God, I’m here seeing one now.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: Just want to warn you. If you’re caught, by God, you’ll get to eat some of the poison you’ve been giving me.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: —(unintelligible word) the life cycle, the life cycle of uh, revolutionaries over and over again repeat themselves. I’m not Lenin, I don’t have that great capacity. We weren’t the originators of the hope of the world, October 17 Revolution, although I’m sure I would’ve been if I had been there, and uh— to some, I just don’t dwell on it, because people get carried away with this reincarnation shit, so I’m not going to talk about that anymore. But some of you remember who I said I was—

Crowd: Applause and cheers

Jones: —but— before they— before they killed Lenin, they shot him with two bullets with cyanide. (Pause) Two bullets with cyanide. And he lived. (Pause) Finally, they got to him, but he lived.

Male voice: That’s right.

Jones: For years. Fourteen— Four more years, to help build the revolution. He lived. Got it on its feet. That’s why I get disturbed when I hear people talking about [Soviet dictator Josef] Stalin, ‘cause of whatever the hell excesses he made, as I told the ambassador, said, anything about Russia you disagree with? I said yes. Those films showing Stalin being pulled down, his statutes [statues] being pulled down, his pictures being defec— defaced, and picking that man up out of the mausoleum, and moving him to a common grave. I said that nobody in the world, nobody in God’s half acre, I told that ambassador, could ever’ve brought the Soviet people together and resisted the fascists as well as they did. Where was the major turning point? At what point did the war turn? It was Stalingrad, that’s where it was. The city named after Stalin, that’s where the turning point came.

Crowd: Applause

(Tape edit)

Jones: I’m not— And he took it very well. I said, I— I want to know right now, if I have to go over there and voice sentiments against Stalin, I’m not going. ‘Cause nobody on earth would pick up— no leader— there’d one in a million, that would’ve picked up an ordinary carbine, and gone to the front lines with the— while they were shooting at him, by God, and he was firing back. He coulda been killed. He was on the front lines of Moscow. You’re never gonna make me dislike that man, no matter how many tales you tell me.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

One male: All right.

(Tape edit)

Jones: And that’s a mistake. So it’s a— made all kinds of wonderful, wonderful progressive decisions. They’re on the post side, the positive side, the side of no— of Africa. They’re liberating our brothers and sisters in Ethiopia. They’re black, just you— like you and me. They liberated them, and they were being run over by a bunch of imperialist hordes, who raped their women and everything else, until Russia and Cuba came in, and the same goddamn thing was going on in Angola, of rape, murder, mercenary, until the Soviets and the Cubans moved in. And uh, one of the presidents, president of Zambia— of Mozambique [Samora Machel] said we’re going to call the Soviet Union in, and even, uh, Uganda said this afternoon, they’re having a major war with Kenya, said we’re going to pull the Soviet Union in, because they’re the major heroes of Africa. So for that reason, not because of perfection— some of you look for perfection. While you’re looking for perfection, why don’t you look at your dumb ass faults?

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: —they, it’s because I have a slight— a slight sympathy, a slight sympathy for a man who would carry his gun to the front, because I had six days of it. It wasn’t as long as Stalin, but I know what it is to agonize over your people, and to be tortured to death over whether your people are going to be killed or not killed. I have at least— (Angry) And I know some of you fuckers want to kill me. Goddamn you, but you— you’re not going to get a chance, ‘cause I’m gonna tell you, you move near my house, like two— it happened last night, two of the people next door, in the apartment next door, s— reported, you move against my house, I am going to tell you, if there’s any rustling in the brush, I’m gonna shoot first and ask questions later.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: (unintelligible aside) Go ahead— Go ahead, I’m sorry. I wanted to interject thoughts right away.

Voice in crowd: (unintelligible) — about how you feel.

Jones: That’s all right, men. (unintelligible)

Closer voice: That’s right.

Jones: There’s some things that the human language can’t bear. It’s better to let the s— talk of this— of the mind or the spirit or the emotion, talk on. I always like to hear him say, his shouts forward—

Closer voice: Yeah.

Jones: We are not defeated. We are not going to be defeated. I don’t give a goddamn how many of you want to defeat us, we shall overcome.

Closer voice: Amen.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Jones: There’s one advantage we have. There’s one advantage we have. (Pause) We are not afraid, some of us, to die.

Closer voice: That’s right. That is right.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

Jones: Well I remember too well how 400 of you stood up. Bowsmen— [Tom] Grubbs had bows uh— We had this, we had that. And we didn’t bl— flink an eye— flinch an eye.

Crowd: Right.

Jones: And honey, if you are not afr— If you afraid of death the first day, by three days, you ain’t afraid of it no longer.

Crowd: Applause and cheers

(Tape edit)

Male: Thank you, Dad, for those words—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —is this you’re going to get, you’re going to get rid of the anteater, uh, two ducks, the opossum, (stumbles over words), and they’re costing— how much are they costing us a day?

Male: Well, it—

Jones: —owl, I’m glad— It’s the most beautiful owl, you need to take a look at that owl. I have a very— I have a strong sentimentality, don’t hesitate to criticize it, but anything that comes my way is like cutting my heart out, to have to de— to take its life or to move away from it, and leave it behind. Uh— Is it this much cost, these little animals?

Male: It wasn’t the cost, Dad, that the analyst uh, discussed it tonight. Uh, it is getting a place that is suitable. Uh— we need to reconstruct— (tape edit?)

Jones: —way we can’t hold them where they are until we get something built? You don’t know how to— You people are very good, and you’re tremendous in your departments, but you’ve forgotten one thing, how much a child loves its pet, and how important it is for a child to have a pet. If a child doesn’t have anything to love, any personal thing to love, it’s gonna be difficult—

Male: Yes.

Voice in Crowd: We have some of that (unintelligible word). I’ll tell you right now.

Jones: (Laughs) Thank you, Mike. Good man. You’re a good worker. You can say whatever you want to say. The worst I can ever say, if you have any trouble, let me know, and he said, I’ll take care of it right now.

Crowd: Scattered laughs.

Jones: He tran— he translated his unknown tongue. (Laughs)

Closer voice: It wasn’t that bad.

(Tape edit)

Jones: —getting adequate care?

Closer voice: The caging and—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —a lot to do, but I know there are some men around here that could build something in nothing short, if you turned ‘em loose. Uh— metal cage or whatever.

Closer voice: Umm-hmm.

Child: I think that—

(Tape edit)

Jones: Yeah, what does she do during the day? What does she do that’s bothering people so much during the day?

Child: It’s— She doesn’t—

(Tape edit)

Jones: (unintelligible opening) —In my, in my um, par— parents, and they noticed no smell. I don’t know what’s the big, uh, big kick. I’d rather smell some of these animals than smell some of these human beings.

Crowd: Stirs, then applause

(Tape edit)

Jones: I just don’t willy-nilly like to say, we’re going to annihilate anteaters and ducks, possum and monkeys. (Pause)

Child: The animals aren’t—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —see the problem is, the proper place to stay. They’re also dealing with the problem of finances. But what— Can some of you uh, who are good builders fix, can some of you tell me uh, some of you that I’ve seen do things, Ken Norton, Tom Grubbs, and uh— They got dexterous hands and uh— Our welder, Jane [Mutschmann], uh, who in the hell else was it so— that’s so creative to make things around here? Surely to God there’s some way we could make— It’s a lone anteater. If you put— If you put that anteater out, it’s going to die. It doesn’t know how to fend in the jungle anymore. ‘Cause it’s so tame. It’s so tame. It wouldn’t climb— It wants to climb up on you. It doesn’t want to hurt you. It’s just got such big claws. But if you put that out— if you put that uh, that uh, anteater out in the jungle, it’s dead. (Pause) I mean it. A tiger’ll have it in nothing flat, because it won’t know how to fend for itself. That’s the problem with domesticizing something. And when we domesticize these animals— we’ll quit it now, we won’t do— domesticize anymore, but when you domesticize an animal, it cannot function in its natural habitat. (Pause) (Tape edit? Microphone turned back on?) —zoo in Georgetown has got more animals, I imagine, than they can take care of. If you can, call to tell them to ask the zoo, but by God, I— I— I’m telling you, I’ve got a complex about me, anybody that comes to me, animal, human, I feel a responsibility. And I don’t like to go around killing ‘em, just because we can’t find some way to take care of them. It may come, it may come. I— I’d give my own body to feed you, if it came to disaster, and you were starving, I’d let ‘em cook me and let you let them eat me, but by God, I wish to hell they would try to find some way. I don’t see anybody moving. (Slurs over words, unintelligible) group I used to (sighs) talk to that knew how to make things. I think it’s a uh, dreadful thing to let that anteater, a rare creature, uh, die without giving him a— giving him a chance. He’s just a baby.

Male: Could I— Could I make a suggestion?

(Tape edit)

Jones: —all right. Don’t drag us in no more. Don’t do it. Don’t drag any more in.

Male: And I think that—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —(unintelligible opening) really doing.

Male: Now we just don’t want—

Jones: Animals are pretty foxy, they know— they know humans better than we do.

Male: Well, I’m talking about when folks go downriver to—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —parrots. I like to see the place with those beautiful parrots. Those are lovely. They add to the setting. And I don’t think it’ll kill us, feeding them. I don’t think the price— Don’t you love to see those beautiful birds? Toucan? You ever met Lenny? You ever talk to Lenny? (Pause) About two or three o’clock in the morning, you get over there, he’ll be— he’ll bounce in the window and bounce on the table. One time he bounced on the window, bounced on the table, and took his bill and turned the damned radio off. He was tired of it.

Crowd: Laughs

Jones: I— I think— I think that creatures like that should be uh, should be preserved. I don’t think we should look for them, I agree with Johnny [probably Johnny Moss Brown, aka Johnny Jones], we shouldn’t, and something— you know, a little thing. You gotta watch, if it’s very little, and there are all kinds of diseases you can get. Let’s face it. You can get diseases. (Stumbles over words) Who would know? Dr. [Larry] Schacht or Tom Grubbs, how many diseases are contagious, how— I— to man? The only one I ever heard— knew was A— African green fever, from the African green monkey. Does anybody know? (Pause) Any— Does Dr. Schacht know?

Voices too soft.

Jones: Yeah, there’s a parrot fever, but you have to get— you have to get bit by the thing, don’t you? (Pause) Well, let’s do some— let’s do some researching on that, ‘cause parrot fever’s no fun. (Pause)

Male: Well, we’ll get—

Jones: Will somebody— Who’ll go and get— Who— Raise their hand, to go over and research parrot fever right now. (Pause)

Woman: John Harris will— (balance of sentence ender Jones)

Jones: Thank you, Harry— John Harris. (Pause) (Tape edit?) —tame, they’ll get killed, they won’t rela— they won’t last a minute. Some predator will kill them. That’s what comes from making pets out of things. (Tape edit?) —(Unintelligible word or name), your owl is tame.

Child: I— I know.

Jones: You’re a beautiful creature, and you turn that owl loose, and he will not know how to protect himself.

Child: That’s— I’m saying he’s fine where he is—

(Tape edit)

Jones: (unintelligible opening) —That bug wasn’t hurting you. I saw you. Don’t you tell me you weren’t. I saw you step your foot on that bug. (Pause) (tape edit?) And playing with animals, dissecting them. You do that in biology out of necessity, when they’re dead. You don’t need to— wha— why’d you do it? Will you tell me why you stepped on— (tape edit) Don’t you have any— Do you have any counseling set up for these kids? When we get a kid like this, do you have any counseling set up in the teacher program?

Voice too soft.

Jones: (tape edit) (unintelligible opening) —I’m going to give you a break this time, and let Comrade Grubbs put you in the principle, in a— into a uh, class, where we’ll talk about why you did step on that bug. Huh? You understand what I’m saying? Don’t— don’t torture things, it’s just like— I— I— (Soft laugh) The world is so full of pain. And that poor bug was still alive when you— when you finished— still alive. Did you— did you tear his wing off? (Pause) I wonder how he lost a wing.

Voice too soft.

Jones: When I looked down there, the bug was all right. Now I— I hope you wake up, some of these kids. I’m sick of them doing this. They— they do this all the time around here.

Voices too soft. Tape edit.

Jones: You gonna go— you gonna go on the ass.

Voices too soft.

Jones: He— He did, he did, he did, he said yes, he took the wing off the bug. (Pause) I’m— Am I overreacting? You people tell me—

Male: No, you’re not. No. No.

Crowd: Stirs

Jones: But for me— but for me, if you don’t learn sensitivity for life, you know, you sure ain’t going to learn it later.

Crowd: That’s right.

Soft voices

Jones: Well, I’d rather not put the onus of cho— so much pressure on him. I’d rather he went to counsel, um, but this is— this is ridiculous, son.

Man: But he can’t stand there and lie to you in a— in your face, now. (Pause) Now he’s talking like— to you, ‘cause he loves you, and you don’t need to be—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —which is nothing more than a counsel. Nothing more than a counsel. I can put you on public services, and it’s quite different.

Voices too soft.

Jones: —public services. It su— It sure had a nice effect on Jonathan. (Laughs) (Pause) Do— do you recommend the PSU [Public Service Unit] for him, John? (Pause) You do, (laughs) all right. (Pause) Oh, you kids. You don’t want to— You don’t want to recommend it to another kid, he— he— he’s younger than you. No, he’s not. How old are you?

Voice too soft.

Jones: ‘Cause he’s younger than John. (Tape edit) —counsel your brother there. I think some of the kids are the ones who ought to talk about it now. I want you kids to hear— Get that kid up and wake him up. I want you kids to hear one thing. I’m tired of seeing— Wake him up. I don’t want to see no more— I want you to hear it. I don’t want to see any more stepping on animals, pull— teasing ‘em. You go around here and tease dogs, and you tease cats, and by God, we’re going to tease you, if you don’t stop it. And we’re going to tease you in the Public Service Union.

Crowd: Stirs

(Tape edit)

Jones: Unnecessary pain. Well, why do you suppose I— I— I’d rather— I— I can’t even eat chicken. I can’t even eat chicken. I’ve watched too many of them die. I can’t even eat it. Just can’t eat it. I saw those chickens die, and they die calmly, when you love them, and they’re frustrated, you can tell, your— you can tell distinctly that they know that they’re dying. They’re waiting the guillotine. You can tell. You don’t need to tell me. I been back there. You that cut chickens, it’s the truth, they can tell, they make ‘em excited, and uh, and that’s why, for health’s sake— I’m not suggesting we don’t. I’d like to be a vegetarian, but I don’t know how in the hell it’s ever going to work out here. But I’d like to be vegetarian someday, ‘cause I don’t like brutality. And I hate to see chickens— young chickens, uh, their heads snapped off of them, and you can tell it every time, every da— time you pick that chicken out, you can tell that chicken knows what’s coming. (Pause) It’s not anthropomorphic. I mean, I watched that chicken. You can tell what is coming. (Pause) The chicken knows it, and we try to love it. (Changes tone) Okay, sleep on there, I know it don’t make no difference to you about chickens, but you know, it may be a step up sometimes. Somebody may decide to chup— chop your head off.

Crowd: Stirs

Jones: I don’t like violence. I deplored it. I deplored its use. Some of you have thought it was necessary. I have found we’ve gotten along very well without it. Although some have tried us with an indeed immense amount of patience. So you children better wake up and you better listen. This one right here is another one I caught torturing and fooling with a bug. The little one. The one in your lap. (Pause) Raymond. (Pause) I— I’d— I want no fooling around, I don’t want no fooling around, no fooling around with stepping on bugs or stepping on fishworms or playing with a bug like a cat. (Pause) No teasing these dogs. That’s what I mean. I mean that right now. And that’s the last lesson I’m going to give on it. It’s the last, ‘cause anybody gets caught doing it, it’s now a matter of court record, the moment you have caught killing something, taking the wings off of bugs so it can’t fly, or torturing— how much more torture— We’ve been tortured, some of us, we lived 47 years, you I guess haven’t been tortured very much, although if it hadn’t been for Dale [Parks] and Joyce [Parks] and me backing it, to adopt you, you never would have made it.

Scattered voices: Right.

Jones: ‘Cause it took money to adopt you. And you should feel ashamed that you would purposely take the wings off that— that— that little bug. It’s not a thing you can’t overcome. It’s something you need to realize your mistake, just realize your mistake, and say inside, I’m never going to do that again. (Pause) (Tape edit) —pain in the world without torturing people, or animals. (Unintelligible phrase) being up here is not to pick off— on little bugs or any— do wrong. Do you know what I mean? Okay, it’s all right. Sit down, and report to Comrade Grubbs— What time was the counseling? I— I guess you’ll have to have some time. Be sure to (tape edit?) (unintelligible with tape break-up) (Tone of person reading) coming Sunday to spend the day, to visit Jonestown and confer with our medical staff. He is a general practitioner and surgeon. Also Margaret Ackman, one of the top people in the Peoples National Congress, our party, the avant-garde party of uh— Prime Minister [Forbes] Burnham. How many know your PNC? You better get your ass in there and listen to that tape, ‘cause you— I’ll stick the tape up your ass if you don’t have it ru— done right. If a one person doesn’t pass this tape— now you people can get your ass in there and study that tape on how to talk to strangers. (Pause) Did you hear what I said?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: Everybody who— Nobody who asked you anything, you’re happy here, you wouldn’t live anywh— anyplace else, ‘cause it may be a CIA trying to provoke some situation. (Pause) You hear what I’m saying?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: We know our— We know that relatives on one of the cases here, offered to get one of the people out of here, with agreement with the police that they would even turn them over to the authorities for a crime they committed two or three years ago. (Pause) So you want to be goddamn careful about your relatives. I know, you always see some (unintelligible)— (Pause) Well, you’re too old to have a mother anyway. (Pause) [I’d] Like to announce that national sports um, country— director of the country of all Guyana with (tape break-up) has gone back and praised Jonestown on his radio program. He praised them on two of ours. He wa— praised us in front of thousands of boxing match this week, uh, where he was a sports announcer, and also in front of thousands where he was the announcer for the rugby game. He’s coming back to spend five days with us on November 16. Now tell me. Tell me about this man. Is there uh— Grubbs, you’re a boxer. Is there any way you can box safely?

Grubbs: (Too soft)

Jones: —you talk to him about how far they go? I don’t know anything about Guyana boxing, but he’s a boxing fan, and I’m sure we could find some boxers here.

Voice too far away.

Jones: (tape edit?) —be dangerous then, isn’t it?

Grubbs: Sixteen ounce gloves.

Jones: Huh?

Grubbs: Sixteen ounce gloves.

Jones: Sixteen ounce gloves.

Grubbs: That’s what they use in uh, amateur. (Mike turned off)

Jones: Uh, would you ask the radio room what they can do? They might be able to procure some gloves for us. Uh— Would you, Larry? Would you go ask them? Um— Anything we can endear ourselves with a team like archery, for instance. They’ve not asked. And I wonder if we had— But when I’ve come to find out you didn’t have it— very many could pull the string. Most people didn’t have the pull, did they?

Grubbs: (Too soft)

Jones: Yeah, I— I want to ask him, the next time he come, about archery, ‘cause that would be a new sport, and they might find it fascinating. Introduce something new. Folk like something different, some of the time. Rugby. What is rugby? Is that kicking that damn thing, carrying it—

Several voices, unintelligible

Grubbs: It’s almost like football with no rules.

Crowd: Scattered laughter.

Jones: (tape edit?) (unintelligible) —Shit with that. Shit with that. I don’t want any of my people injured. Football’s dangerous enough. I am interested with you showing a demonstration that day, with the arch— with the arrow, if you got— Anybody else that’s as good as you are, or close to that, I’d like for them to see it, (Pause) when he comes back, ‘cause I think that might, you know, be a new attraction. I don’t know. I don’t know. Maybe it won’t.

Voice too soft.

(Tape edit)

Jones: There’s a ping— natural— national ping-pong— do they have a ping-pong cu— uh, ping— ping-pong ta— do they have ping pong uh, games here in the— in Guyana.

Voice too soft, but in assent.

Jones: Yeah, I know China, China’s the best. China, out of a spirit of goodwill, even let people beat them, though, that’s how uh, uncopetentant— uncom— (Pause, then deliberate) non-competitive they are, and— and that’s very touching to me that they’d do that. I don’t understand why they’re so stupid in their foreign policy. They’ll— They— They’d stand back and let their guest win, and wouldn’t play their best, just to develop harmony and good will.

Voice too soft.

Jones: (Stumbles over words) Well. See what we can do. I don’t know how many people’ve played ping-pong.

Voice too soft.

Jones: (unintelligible sentence)

Voice too soft.

Jones: Okay. That— some of it would— problem would be resolved before long. Shift again please. (Tape edit) I’m going to have to limit it some play— I don’t know whether they play tennis here— Yes they do, I saw them in Georgetown, play tennis. (Pause) I don’t know. That, to me, that was always a bourgeois game to me, because I couldn’t reach up— I couldn’t reach out to uh, to do it. Uh— I was a working class kid, never had time for those sorts of things. I believe sports has its place. Only one thing, I’m gonna tell you, by God certain, I want you to hear this. The kind of shit that was given to the teacher, in Marxist-Leninism, you people tomorrow afternoon better have a fucking good class. (Pause) You better have a fucking good class, and a cooperative class, or you’re not going in for basketball. I don’t like what you did to the teacher. (Pause)

Voice too soft.

Jones: It’s improved class? Fine. That’s fine. I want to be sure they have another class for the class that they didn’t do well on.

Voice too soft.

Jones: Then go on and schedule one, because I don’t want no shit from anybody. I’ve got my children on there, and you— some of you got yours, but we have no room for smart aleckiness. When you go to Georgetown, if you can’t be calm and sweet before you get to Georgetown, I know how you’ll be in Georgetown.

Crowd: Stirs

Jones: And I hope somebody stand heavy on their head. Lee [Ingram] sometimes I think is a little soft with them, in my opinion. I’m just talking frank today. (Pause) I’m talking to you, Lee. Lee, I’m talking to you.

Voice too soft.

Jones: Trying to poison me, every joint’s sore, I want to tell you, I heard that you— I don’t know whether the teacher’s right, but I heard that you supported the anarchy in that classroom, that went on that night about Marxism and Leninism, and that bullshit about intellectualism, and that the best intellectuals had turned out to be um, the worst traitors. Now that— that’s stupid. I can show you as many ordinary warehousemen and ordinary workers that have also betrayed communism too.

Lee: True. That— That’s true. But—

Jones: Well, why didn’t you back the teacher? She says you didn’t back her at all. She said she had to— to put up with a goddamn bunch of insults, and you didn’t back her up. (Pause) I don’t se— I don’t understand why you burped over that microphone at 5:30. Will you tell me? (Tape edit?) Meet me when they come with something in my hand.

Male voice: Thank you, Dad.

Crowd: Light applause.

(Tape edit)

Jones: (unintelligible opening) —go over and shake their hands and embrace them. Or if they beat you, go over and shake their hands and embrace them. I’m interested in socialist conduct. (Pause) Yes.

Another male: I— I am— I am too, Dad.

Jones: Thank you. What is it? What is it, uh, Gwen [Gwendolyn Johnson]?

Gwen: Um—

Jones: —In there when they think they’re boys, it’s not unique to him. After you get through my age, you’re glad you’ll never be a boy again. (Pause) I— I hear no “Amen.” You really shock me.

Crowd: Stirs

Jones: I said, after you get my age, you’ll be glad you never will be a boy again.

Crowd: Scattered “right.” Applause

Tape edit

Jones: —Live like that. I didn’t sweat 47 years, 27 of them— 27 of them, shit. To— I was 18. Twenty-nine years I’ve sweat to build a communist movement, and I did not sweat to have it come over here and die in no fuckin’ jungle.

Crowd: Right. Applause.

Jones: All right. (Pause) Don’t try to be li— a child when you’re not a child. Don’t try to be a teenager when you’re not a teenage. Don’t try to act like you’re pregnant when you’re 60 years of age.

Crowd: Stirs.

(Tape edit)

Jones: —perfection, and I see anybody else doing it. If there were someone struggling as sincere and had the experience of my years, I would resign this moment, because I’d like to be in Namibia right now, where the U.S. has sent some mercenaries, trying to destroy that country. I’d like to be there. More than I’d even like to go back to America, ‘cause I’d like to be there to save their land. Fuck all of our traitors, then— Life will take care of them. They’re miserable. They’re miserable. Anything else? Any of you thinking just about getting your enemies? You— You— You are— You’re on a personal vendetta. When I— Personal vendetta. How can I break that down? Come on, somebody. Vern— vendetta. What do— What I want. Personal vendetta.

Crowd: Scattered calls of “Personal revenge.”

Jones: Personal revenge. That is— Socialists don’t do that.

Male: Eye for an eye.

Jones: I— I don’t want to have to go after people may— abuse me. I— I— I’m— I’ve got to go after people that are most important, and right now, I could, I think, carry on quite a little— I’m still a pretty good shot, and I could help someplace where they needed it. So— Watch all of you, that you set a model before your people. And if you don’t set that model, have the good graces to get out of the job. (Pause)

Man: I agree with this—

Jones: He [W.E.B. duBois] was a communist. And he went to Ghana in the west coast and spent his last four years teaching, and died happy on his own continent.

Man: I— I— (stammers as Jones speaks)

(tape edit)

Jones: Yeah. That’s what I got. Somebody’s guilty of writing that shit up to me. Who did it? ‘Cause that’s what upset me most (tape edit?) (unintelligible word) and provocateurs. Let us not make our standard by the past. Let’s make our standards by the present. I sure have not been untrue to communism.

Man: Could I— I— I’d appreciate it if I could finish, ‘cause it’s— you’re— you’re misun— you’re misunderstanding the whole thing. I did not

Jones: You don’t rem— know Marxist-Leninist, you couldn’t be a communist.

Man: I’ve lived the communal life with you all my life, and I don’t know— I—

(Tape edit)

Jones: Don’t minimize. No, you’ve— Well, you’ve done it when you bow to them. I’d bow to them when they lost, or they made a point. I’d clap for them.

Man: That’s the way I play.

Jones: Okay— I’m not condemning you. But that’s the kind of example. You can win us lots of friends and help these babies. I don’t need any help. I’m asking for the— our babies. But they see su— a superior consciousness. None of that hitting the seat or stamping the floor, like stupid American ballplayers do, but conscientious— And you do get beat, bow to them. And re— run over and hug them.

Man: That’s the main— Like we— That’s the main confrontation we have—

Jones: It’s a— it’s a Chinese— The Chinese do it symbolically. They do it like that, and in Ind— and the Indians do the same. And it’s— it’s— must go uh— must go back thou— hun— hund— thousands of years. And it shows that you respect them. And then I’d take their hands and hug them. And you could— don’t know how many you may lead to communism there. If you te— if you get your asshole behavior— and you know, I’m not talking to you. I know one thing, Tim [Timothy Glenn Tupper Jones], I’m talking to you, you got an arrogant ass— asshole, a lot of time. You’re arrogant. You can’t say nothing to you. (pause) (unintelligible name), you’re staying here. And the first day I hear some of the shit that I heard the last time that there were sports in there, no cooperation, messing up the floor, up all night, taking food that wasn’t supposed to be taken out of the refrigerators, that wasn’t just— I’m not talking about basketball players, now. I’m not going through that. I’ll call you home. Or you can paddle to America.

One voice: That’s right.

Jones: I mean it. I’m damned serious about this. ‘Cause you’ve got in your hands the opportunity to make or break Jonestown. You are out— and they’ll listen to you, ten thousand times more [than] they do my two radio broadcasts on both stations. They’ll look at you, listen to you. They oughta know my sons, they oughta know who my sons [Jimmie, Lew, Stephan, Tim] are. Jim’s one, two. He’s not here. That oughta stand out. That oughta be pronounced someway. But you’ve gotta show a lot of character and grace. And I see tremendous growth in you, Tim, and I’ve seen immense growth in Ti— in Stephan. But there won’t be no dar— damn chance, no matter how much it hurts, for you to show. You under— understand? If the fucking referee works against you, you won’t dare show it. Just— Just go right on. And believe me, that superiority will communize some of those youth. It’ll draw women— particularly are going to be attracted to you. It’ll draw men also. “What kind of people are you? What kind of a people these are, that they don’t get mad?” Do you understand what I’m saying? And you’ve to drill in this, drill in this, not to get mad, and to show appreciation when they— and clap for them (claps lightly) when they make a, you know, a goal as it goes in, then run right back to your post.

Man: Okay, all you are— are American, right? (Balance of sentence under Jones)

Jones: It’s a— it’s a different kind— and sure, and I know it come from a di— whole different culture in basketball. Hell, they believe in basketball, stomp on your enemies is the best thing in the United States, but it— you can’t clap too much, you get off, but just say, you know, (claps lightly) just a quick clap when you see it’s gone through, then back to your post fast. I’m not talking about the guy under the basket, for Christ’s sake. But if they got time, they made the— made the— made the— I— Yeah, you do have time, when they make the basket, then you— you— I’ve forgotten the damn basketball, and I was a (unintelligible word fragment)— I was a basketball su— a star for— believe it or not. I’m not big enough. If I had my sons’ hands, I— Hell, I’da made a pro— I’da made a profession out of it. But I was a very good forward. And I played basketball hard. But in United States, nobody was kind. I quit basketball, because I saw them treat one black man wrong, and I walked out of that goddamn game, and I told the coach he could give me an “F”, I didn’t give a damn. And he give me an “F”, and I didn’t give a damn. (Pause) You hear what I’m saying? You got time. They put you— when you— when they basket, when they make the goal, they— then you’re opposing team, you take the ball still from behind the goal. Basketball hasn’t changed, has it, to that degree?

Voice too soft.

Jones: Clap. (claps lightly) Clap. (claps lightly) Just for that few seconds, clap (claps lightly) for them. It’ll blow their minds. It’ll fuckin’ blow their minds. (Pause) I want that done, because— not only pla— and then play hard as hell. Play hard as hell. Fast as hell. But when they make a point, (claps lightly) do that. They will not understand it, because they’re not evolved like that. They haven’t reached that point. They’re— They’re going to be competitive, and when they see that in you, they’re going to wonder, what kind of fuckers are these? They don’t get mad, they don’t get unha— they don’t get— take everything personal, or sta— stamp on the floor, because of an usher’s decision. Do you see what I’m saying? You can do a great deal of good. And Walter [Williams]? You don’t dare go out of that house, ‘cause if you steal anything, Walter, you— uh, you’ll ruin this country for e— You’ll ruin us. Now you got to— You got to stay in, and I— I want— I’m telling you, I love you, but I— We all know about your one problem. Everybody’s got a problem. I want somebody to put a mattress by a door, and which, if they have to open that door, by God, when you’re abed. (Pause) That’s what I mean. I won’t play no tricks with you. I love you. But you haven’t shown enough appreciation for me. You are paralyzed, man. You couldn’t move, and the brain fluid was moving out of your mouth, what they call spinal fluid, was moving out of your mouth, and I’ll be damned if you’d had any legs to— or arms to play with. And since then, you’ve stole things. And by God, better be no stealing there.

Walter: (Unintelligible word from near mike)

Jones: ‘Cause (Stumbles over words) for you, if they can get along withou— out you, we’ll bring you home. (Pause) If they can’t get along, then we’ll just have to cancel. (Pause) And I mean it. Don’t you leave that house. Don’t you— I don’t want you any moment— ‘cause you seem to cannot control stealing yet. Someday you’ll probably overcome it, but right now you can’t overcome— You haven’t overcome it. You’re still stealing. Right?

Walter: Right, Dad.

Jones: So you guys are gonna have to watch one another’s weaknesses. You understand what I’m saying? I want a mattress in front of the goddamn bed, from the door, when he goes to bed. I ain’t going to pull no shit with any of you. I’ll talk straight to you. Think you got a lot of good virtues. But that’s one thing we couldn’t have, you going out and trying to steal something. You steal shit that don’t make no sense. I mean, really, you’d steal shit— you— you— you— you ste— I— I— I never saw anything like you. You’d steal a paper doll. I don’t know what the fuck it’s— it’s all about but (stumbles over words)— Boys, you listen to me, ‘cause this is the goddamn truth, you’re gonna have to watch this kid. You gotta help him that he doesn’t do that. You gotta put a mattress in front of that bed, to the door, and then when he oughta be it in— to cross that bed, he’s got to open that door. And you have to understand why I’m doing that. Be— Not because I don’t uh, love you. I trust you in many areas. But how many times have you been up here for thieve— thievery.

Walter: Twice.

Jones: That’s enough, isn’t it.

Walter: Yes, Dad.

Jones: Okay. That’s all I got to say to you, to the team. You don’t need to explain it any further. And you don’t need— (stumbles over words) and Tim, take it. Don’t— there no use to talk about what I said about arrogance. I know, I could get up here and talk all kinds of good— good points. But it’s the bad points that will ruin you.

Tim: Uh— I— I agree that there’s the bad points that’ll ruin you, and I agree that, you know, I— I just want to point out that Lee brought books on syphilis down to us today, made us look through them, see what it can do to you, so nobody will be fucking around in Georgetown. He talked to us about thieving.

Jones: I— That’s good. I’m not worried— I’m not worried about many of you doing that. I want to tell you frankly, that I’m not worried about many of you doing that. But what— But it is thick in the capital. It’s good that he did show it. It’s thick. And then they’ve got a new kind of go— a new form of uh, I— I don’t know, they call it something, number Z, some new kind of venereal disease that has broken out in other parts of the world. I don’t know whether it’s here or not. But likely it’ll soon be here, because everybody comes here— uh, Yorktown [Georgetown], like any capital that’s not been communized fully, is a cauldron of whores, whoremongers, cheats, steal— they’d steal your damn shirt off your back. They like to broke Patty’s [probably Patty Cartmell] arm, by taking— grabbing her watch off of her arm. (Pause) So don’t get cocky and think you can go out on the street alone at night. Now you can’t do it.

Male: I would— (mike clicks on) say something about Lee, not to the good, but to the bad, that I feel like one thing that the team needs is a, a more of a camaraderie, right? And you know, not to be afraid to tell a guy you care about him, but the same time, he’s doing something wrong.

Jones: Right, right.

Male: And I have think Lee has an air of— of masculinity that— that needs to be broken down a little bit, to where we can, you know, we can show our affection for each other, because I think that’s necessary in a team.

Jones: Agreed. Agreed.

Male: But along with this, I feel that he is—

Jones: I hope all the rest of you men are hearing this.

Another voice: I agree with that.

Scattered voiced of assent.

Jones: Go ahead.

Male: But I feel that also he— he’s not as passive as he’s been put off with us. Sometimes, I can find (unintelligible under Jones interruption) saying “Fuck you” too easy to me.

Jones: I know you’ve praised him, and I’ve heard your praises. But I had these complaints, and I had to bring them up, because I am not going to practice in discrimination. They were— That’s where they were, and I want to let the truth, the light of truth fall on it. He said he’s arrogant. He says he’s not. But he— even he himself says he’s arrogant. And that’s what I admire in the man. More than anything, he— he coulda take cushy— he coulda cushioned with uh, with uh, buffered (Buford?) with uh, Tish [Leroy]. But he says, I am arrogant, I am condescending, and I feel a hell of a lot better sending him in that way than if he were defensive.

Another Male: I’d like to say that we all are arrogant, you know, and we talked about it, because I feel — and I always will feel — that a certain amount of arrogance is necessary on a ball court, if you want to perform, and you want to uh— and I learned to play ball in the States, but I— I’ve always been a firm believer in intimidating the opponent, you know, and I’ve always said “Good shot,” and I’m not a— I don’t even— I don’t believe in fouls, I don’t call fouls, but I do feel that there’s a certain degree where you need to intimidate an opponent if you to be— if you want to get the best play out of it. You know we could—

Jones: I— I’m not talking about their playing. I’m not playing with the game. I’m not talking about how you play the game. When they— (claps lightly) When they make a goal, you can do like that. Sincerely. Then run quick. Don’t do it long, ‘cause they’re gonna pass that fucking ball, the moment that they— they’re under the uh, post, they (stumbles over words), ah, shit, I’ve forgotten all I ever knew— under the basket, uh, goal. They’re going to do it, you haven’t got much time, be clapping (claps lightly), but just do it. Just do it. (claps slightly more vigorously) Sh— That— That’ll take care of all the fighting you do in the floor. As long as you don’t hit people and foul people, or look like you’re mad. You can look stern on the floor, you can look sure of yourself, and be aggressive, but also be humble. And grab them between recesses and hu— hug them before they leave. They won’t know how to deal with it. (Pause)

3rd Male: I don’t know if they’ll let you do it. Then how— You know, I’ll sure as hell try, I’ve tried before, and I’ve been, you know, treated like some kind of fag, you know or— you know, I’m not going to the locker room with him.

Jones: Well, shake— shake hands. Shake hands with them.

3rd Male: You know, I— I’ve always played that way. I believe in breaking down (unintelligible fade)

Jones: Shake hands. I— I— I agree with you. I can see some uh, idiot misinterpreting. Sh— Shake hands with them. If they don’t want to shake hands, that will make them look like assholes to all the people watching.

Crowd: Stirs

Jones: I’m telling you, not only are you winning and— your winning of the game is essential, but it’s how you play that game. ‘Cause a lot of people are gonna be watching. We are Americans, they’re going to say, these people are something else. They show us superiority, they’re not getting angry, they show us superiority, they clap when we make a uh, make a goal. That’s gonna stand out. You can do tremendous P.R. for us. (Pause)

3rd male: They uh— If you get too cool, they try harder of breaking your cool than they do at making points, too. (Unintelligible phrase) You can play that way. One thing that rattles another player more than intimidation is just completely and total, you know, cool, you know, you don’t even— like he’s not even nothing. You know what I mean?

Jones: Well, that’s what I (unintelligible interruption). If that’s what works, I’d suggest that. It’s been too long for me to remember. It’s been too long for me to remember. I— I don’t— I hardly remember the game, uh, because I had to quit it out of conscience. I didn’t want to quit it. We were in a sectional championship, we’d never made it. We almost looked like we were going to be the champion of the state of Indiana. I didn’t want to quit it, but I had to quit it, because my team — and the coach upheld them — called uh, one of theirs, black, it’s an awful thing, (unintelligible word) that word that they use for black. No, no, no. Goon! Goon. Coon, coon. Coon, that’s what they called them. I said, you apologize for that. I told the principal, I said, you apologize for that, and you see, that— that our boys apologized for that, or it’s over for me. He said, I’m not going to apologize for nothing. They are coons. I said, goodbye. And I took my wraps, and I never went on the court again. But I wanted to be on the court, because it was a game I enjoyed. You won’t have that kind of problem. Fortunately. You didn’t live in a racist town, you weren’t re— brought up in a racist town. But they’ve been a problem with foreigners. There’s also that prejudice you have to deal with, but the way to break it down is to be extremely kind to them in between. (Pause)

Male: (Mike clicks on) —they really ex— We talked to them on the Burnham Court, and they’re really friendly, and they, you know, they talked about the game and—

Jones: Excellent. Excellent. Invite them up to see us and things like that, before— before the tournament starts. Before the tournament starts, invite them up to see us.

4th Male: In fact that was— That was—  I— I’d like to say that is one— That was one of Tim’s ideas, to invite them up to, you know, to our house, pre-game, before the tournament even starts, and meet all the teams, and have snacks and so—

Jones: That’s excellent. (unintelligible) —my Tim? That’s excellent.

4th Male: And also show slides of the project, and tell them about the project, what we’re doing out here.

Jones: I agree wholeheartedly, I agree wholeheartedly.

4th Male: And Jim was going to do that.

Jones: But watch the young women there. Who’s there? (Pause) ‘Cause some of these bitches cannot keep their vagina unless we put a zipper on it.

Crowd: Scattered calls of assent. Applause

Jones: I’m telling you what I feel. (Tape edit) Don’t let nothing— You women, if— they tell any woman in Georgetown, stay off. This is a boy— This is a brotherhood gathering, and the sisters vacate. (Pause) You hear what I’m saying? It’s between boys, they’re trying to make fellowship betwe— And the girls will only be a distraction. So, get ‘em out of the way. They got something else to do that night. Hmm?

Voice too soft

Jones: Be sure I— Be sure that’s announced. I mean this. I don’t want somebody get one or more in a corner and getting the damn sex play going, so they won’t be watching our brothers trying to sow good will. (Pause) Been that’s Tim’s done an excellent job being my security (unintelligible word)— There all sorts of things. When I tell you something, I tell you in love, or I tell you, you have a headiness, it’s— it’s because you have headiness, in my opinion. (Pause) There’s others of you I could criticize, I suspect. (Pause) Calvin [Douglas]. Calvin, sometimes, his attitude’s not the hottest. Now the other two, I don’t know, there’s— I don’t know the— the attitude of these two lads. I’ve heard that Carl’s [most likely Carl Barnett] very— got a good attitude. Is that correct?

Male 5: Uh, I’m cocky at times too. Uh, wh— when Jann [Gurvich]— When Jann confronted us out on the pathway, I got cocky with her. My name wasn’t on the report. I don’t know why. But you know, just to feel like I’m not (unintelligible end of sentence). I was cocky with Jan about—

Jann: I didn’t remember exactly what you said. That’s why I didn’t write you up, or I would’ve.

Jones: Well, I— I’m not (unintelligible phrase) the past, but you guys— Do you realize what I’m saying to you? You realize what you’re saying, what we’re saying? You can open up— You can open up the whole door of Guyana to us, to the people. Once the people are behind you, it don’t make no difference what the politicians want. If they like your playing, and they like your character of— and that’s why I say, I’m not asking you to clap till they get uh— just a second, just a second. It don’t take long. But don’t fuck around long, ‘cause it can get your mind off, and there’ll be a long pass, and then pass the center line, and then somebody’ll run in and dribble in and make a shot. I know it can’t be long. Can it be done? (Claps lightly) Can’t you do it, just a pat, like? Just a pat like that?

Voices unintelligible

Jones: It’ll be your ball, so all clap as you take the ball. (claps lightly) All clap as you take the ball. That will blow their mind.

Young Male: The thing is, though, we do it, you know, as soon as the ball is shot, I know I’m going to be snatching and throwing as fast as I can, ‘cause we’re too small to be a slow team.

Jones: Well, I— I’m not— I’m not asking you not to snatch the ball. I’m talking about a courtesy between times. (Pause) I don’t want you to fight with them, I don’t want you to foul, naturally. But I want you to fight to win. To show that you’re a champion team. To get a chance to— to move on up in the tournament. I’m not asking you to do away with those— Break up, goddamn it. Uh, uh, if these young people go in and make a good name for us, nobody’ll be able to harm us. They’ll impress so many people, that they can— they’ll do worlds for us. (Pause) You guys have got that world ah, world on you. Mark [Cordell], I’ve heard you’ve been uh, condescending and hostile and arrogant too at times, is that true?

Mark: Yeah, that is true, Dad, I am arrogant at times, I do have a bad attitude, too, and I have to watch my mouth.

Jones: Now I— now I— I’m empowering you— I’m empowering you with a lot of trust and faith. I won’t speak to you, if I don’t have a lot of faith in you. I won’t criticize you publicly. If I don’t— uh, if I criticize you publicly, I’ve got a lot of faith in you, unless it’s some dodo that wants to go to Kansas City uh, and after the bomb, that— that does cause some slight reaction. But, Lee, you’ve got the responsibility to enforce this rule, this teamwork, and you’re got to give him your word that he will do that. Don’t you (unintelligible word), because if you lose every game, I don’t give a goddamn, you’ll still have won something in the minds of those people. And in my opinion, if you was at practice, you’re gonna get— you’re not going to lose every game.

Lee: I don’t think— I don’t think we are either. Um—

Jones: I think you are— I’ve watched you play. I think you have an exceptional team. It’s going to take work, and nobody can be out at night. Listen, brothers (claps hand once), you can’t be out at night, you gotta get your rest. Can’t be a night crowd, you’ll lose your fucking strength, you— you— it’s gonna take all you’ve— time you’ve got, getting ready for that game. (Pause) Okay, okay. I ain’t got any more to say. Uh, go ahead, you had something to say.

Woman: I have a—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —have watched these papers, I take samples from them. Generally, they don’t grade that hard.

Woman: (unintelligible intro) —84.

Jones: Huh?

Woman: I received a eighty—

(Tape edit)

Jones: —on this, that’s where your news people are here, with— there on the board, ought to do it. That’s a basic, and we should understand it. Most people don’t understand this. It’s been years since I talked about it.

(Tape edit)

Jones: —next class have— have that ready, will you? Is sending in two weeks a karate expert, which you need. (Pause) He’s a karate expert in the Caribbean, and I want you to listen to him.

Male: (mike turns on) —right now with a really badly injured (unintelligible word)

Jones: Keep it that way. What is it you want to say, Teddy [probably Theodore McMurry]. (Tape edit) —you to all listen to this tape tomorrow with much degree on how you greet guests. We have Americans who will be coming, and uh, friendly, ostensibly, but you never discuss what your politics are. You always talk about how much you love this place, that you never would want to go back for anybody. Do you all understand that?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: You better say it, ‘cause you’ll regret the day you didn’t say it.

Scattered: That’s right.

Jones: And if they asked you, uh, if you have food, what kind of food do you have, we say, well, we have meats and uh, we have uh, (clears throat) you know, poultry, uh, chicken, and we have uh, eggs, we have pork, we have all kinds of meats. So what—

Woman: (too soft) —Guyanese dish.

Jones: Yeah, a Guyanese dish. You— Uh, what’s that?

Voices too soft

Jones: What’s (unintelligible word) that?

Woman voice: Pepper pot.

Jones: Pepper pot. We have pepper pot, which is a good food. Say— and they may try to trick you, and ask several, so I will tell you, you must tell them the first day they come, before they get in, because there could be a CIA anywhere. Tell them what the meal— they had that day. You understand? It was (stumbles over words) uh, cooked wheat, with toast and an egg, and uh, orange juice at noon, with um, chicken and uh, rice and uh, uh, cassava, and greens. You understand what I’m saying? And a piece of pie. That must be done Tuesday upon arrival of one group, and it must be done on the eighteenth, if we, uh, we don’t uh— if we don’t, we’re foolish. (Pause) Uh, tell (unintelligible name; “Larry”?) to come here. Uh, things while I remember. And please, listen to him about botulism and so forth. (Pause) We are going to be visited by Dr. (unintelligible name) wants us si— to sing. He’s coming here Sunday to spend the day, to visit Jonestown, and confer with our medical staff of ways to help. He’s a general practitioner, and so a lot of questions should be asked about tropical medicine and surgeon. Also, one of the top, biggest po— most powerful woman, and a personal— I suppose the prime minister doesn’t have any more personal a friend, Margaret Ackman, will also be coming out Sunday to spend the day here. This is the general secretary for the PNC, and chief whip. She’s the top of the PNC. Now, what we gotta do on that day is to know who our prime minister is. I’m telling you, everybody get it under that tent, or I’m going to kick the hell out of somebody, if they get up and say the PPP’s our party. I’m tired of ignorance. We’ve been through this long enough. How many do— Who’s our party?

Crowd: PNC.

Jones: What does it stand for?

Crowd: Peoples National Congress.

Jones: You better rehearse— Every supervisor, I’m asking for every home, head to announce this, practice it, our prime minister’s Forbes Burnham, and we don’t like the PPP, because of what?

Crowd: Apanjhat.

Jones: Apanjhat. Which means, “vote your own kind.” We believe in this government, we would die for this government, because they gave us a home. Do you understand?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: Particularly say that to Margaret Ackman. (Pause) (tape edit?) —there’s not so pro-government, so you just tell them, we’re glad to be here. You understand what I say?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: You got two people— There’s a lot of freedom in this country, they keep talking about not freedom, but this is a doctor running around, making good money, and he’s anti-government. So you don’t— You know what you say about this. Say, we love the pri— we have the l— we love the privilege of living cooperatively. You understand?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: Please know the doctor before— Know him. He’s East Indian, and Margaret Ackman’s black, isn’t she?

Crowd: Stirs.

Jones: Hah?

Scattered replies: Yes, she’s black.

Jones: She’s black, and she’s a power. To show you how powerful she is— and she’s a fighter. When they needed some money from uh, East Indian business people, to help the party — the party was raising money for black li— liberation and also their own activities — she went, by God, and she got some information on one East Indian businessman, and she said, you either give me a check for twe— ten thousand dollars, or I’m going to turn you in. (Pause) They gave her— They gave her the check for ten thousand dollars. (Pause) She’s tough. She’s tougher than nails. Huh?

Male: We have the clinic on Sunday.

Jones: We have the clinic on Sunday. That’ll be good.

Male: (Voice too soft)

Jones: Well, show her the activities. Show her the activities. Let her watch (unintelligible pronoun) treat the people. It would be a good time for the doctor to look. Cer— It’s a ideal time for them to come, the ideal time. (Pause) Um, then— okay. (Voice trails off as moves away from mike, then returns) Anybody have any— any problem or anything that needs to be mentioned from the floor.


Part 2: End of previously used tape—

Jones: You say, I don’t want to clap, but I’ll tell you, if you were laying like that little girl was, and unable to talk, looking at me with her eyes, wanting to talk but couldn’t, sobbing at— coming out of her mouth, couldn’t move her legs and arms, until Father said, “Talk,” I tell you, you’d start singing then. (Unintelligible closing; could be “Know what I’m saying?”)

End of tape

Tape originally posted February 2003