Q734 Transcript

If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you.

To return to the Tape Index, click here.
To read the Tape Summary, click here. Listen to MP3 (Pt. 1, Pt. 2).

(Editor’s note: Transcript prepared by Richmond Arquette. The editors gratefully acknowledge his invaluable assistance.)

(Transcriber’s notes: The sides of this tape are mismarked. Side B takes place first, with the continuation of the recording on Side A.

(The Peoples Rally in Jonestown, which takes up almost the entirety of the tape, includes scores of calls and cries from unidentified members of the audience in the pavilion, many of them at the same time. Rather than attempt to differentiate amongst them, or even to number the different men and women who speak separately, we designate the voices only by sex and – where discernible – age.

(Finally, a warning on content: The violence contained here make this one of the most difficult tapes in the Jonestown oeuvre.)

Side B

Part 1

Several moments of silence.

Tom Grubbs: If you will, and you say, look, goddamnit, I’m gonna– I will trust you people. It’s going to be hard, because I haven’t done it in the past, but I will trust, I will be straight, I will request help, and I’ll be honest about my hostilities, and I’ll deal with my hostilities in safe situations and responsible ways, and we say, “Fine, hey, we got no damn trouble with you now at all.” (Pause) But I’m concerned about your hostility level, ‘cause I think you’re still (Emphasize three words) hostile as hell. As long as you’re hostile as hell, and haven’t come to grips with this, and found a better way to channel it, I don’t think you’re safe outside that box.

Barbara Walker: (muffled, almost unintelligible) I’m not hostile.

Grubbs: Uh, well, I’m sorry, I– I have seen hostility, uh, a whole hell of a lot of hostility, and you have masked it quite well. I mean you mask it, you cover it up, you try to come off as the passive, quiet, almost meek child. But sister, it’s there, a lot of it, and I’m not deceived by it. In fact, the only way I’m gonna be convinced at all that this– that this thing is dealt with, is that you can come out with it, and deal with it, discuss it, describe it, show what triggers it off, and come up with some responsible alternatives as a way of handling it. Because I wouldn’t consider this therapy at all successful, unless we’re able to do that. Masking it does not deceive me at all. (Pause) I’ll let you think on it. I’ll get back to you later.

(Tape edit)

Grubbs: Uh, I see. What co– what’s that medication for? Has he got some kind of condition it treats?

Walker: I don’t know. (Pause)

Grubbs: You don’t know, huh? That’s interesting. (Pause) You seem to, uh– Judging from the tone of your voice, though, you seem to be fairly mellow right now. You– you feel that way generally?

Walker: Yeah, except when there’s a lot of racket.

Grubbs: Except you which?

Walker: Except when there’s a lot of noise.

Grubbs: Yeah. Uh, by the way, we’re really sorry that somebody threw a dirt clod and hit the side of your box a while ago. Yeah, we– we caught the culprits that were responsible for that. I– I find that really very unexcusable, and I’m sorry it happened. And I think it’s really unfair and unthoughtful for the kids to do that.

(Tape edit)

Part 2

Rose Shelton: Speak up. Why– Why are– are you getting us in trouble like that?

Laura Johnston: I gue– I must be losing track of it, I thought I was doing better, I tried to hold my tongue, but it wasn’t good enough.

Female: Keep your hands down.

Shelton: I don’t see why you can’t work and keep your mouth shut, I don’t know why you’re saying anything–

Female: You what?

Female: Keep your hands down!

Shelton: (striking Laura repeatedly as she speaks to her) How come you can’t keep your– keep your mouth shut and do your work? Huh? How come you can’t keep your mouth shut and do your work and stay off of–

(Tape edit)

Jones: (suppresses a laugh)

Shelton: You can’t keep your mouth shut and do your work.

Laura: All right.

Shelton: You can’t do the right thing, say the right thing, or do the right thing–

(Other crowd noises, including a crying baby)

Male: Dad give you– give you (Unintelligible)–

Male: Come on, Laura. Goddamn, would you say something?

Male: Yeah, speak up, shit.

(Other voices call out)

Male: Hurry up!

Laura: Okay. (Pause) All right, I talk, uh– I talk too much, I should be absolutely quiet because I know I lose– I trying to be too bossy and saying anything at all, I just lose– I just uh, am bossy–

Jones: But what do you like– do you like to get beat on? We don’t like to see it, you know, in the goddamn middle of the night, midnight.

Laura: I know. I know.

Jones: What is– what is your trip? Do you think it’s going to get by? Don’t you think someone’s going to report it?

Laura: No, Dad. Before I knew I was really fucking up, I thought I was doing better. So uh, it just took me by surprise uh, tonight. It really took me by surprise.

Jones: Well, how much better is she doing? Or is she?

Female: I don’t see how it could take you by surprise, and I’ve been hollering at you.


Tinetra Johnson: Dad, Dad, number one– Laura, you had no excuse about that bullshit about being late.

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Jones: All right– Let’s hear it, uh, let’s hear it.

Tinetra: I was– I was out there working in the– at the Piggery, and I was on time for Socialist Class, so you should’ve been. Uh, number two–

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Male: Come on, y’all–

Tinetra: –everybody else up there knew what time it was. Okay–

Jones: I announced it on the PA system. Did you hear it? How’d you get on, Tin– uh, on time?

Tinetra: I– I knew, I knew, I don’t know how I knew, but when I– when we got in town, everybody knew that class started at seven-fifteen. We got in town at six-thirty. And everybody knew that class started at seven-fifteen.

Jones: I announced it.

Female: You announced it since, yeah. You announced it–

Jones: I know I did.

Female: And work habits–

Tinetra: And then work habits.

Jones: It’s a matter of listening.

Tinetra: I worked out there with you too and you wasn’t working worth a fuck.

Female: Don’t be cussing.

Tinetra: You was working like you was scared to hit the bush like someone was gonna jump out and grab you.

(Tape edits amidst various short unintelligible comments.)

Jones: What’s your situation?

Female: When I was on Lear– when Learning Crew was working with Ruthie’s Crew, I– Ruthie [Quinn] and I were both supervising and I noticed too, Laura, you working too slow. Kept– keep– kept your hand on your hip and just like you were afraid to hit the bush, like Tinetra said.

Female: And she won’t stop talking for nothing.

Female: Are you still carrying the first aid pack for your crew?

Laura: No, I’m not.

Jones: She won’t stop talkin’ for nothin’, huh?

Female: I have the first aid, but she didn’t give it to me ‘til she got off Learning Crew.

Jones: (unintelligible)

Female: No, Dad, she won’t stop talking. And I have to–

Jones: Talking about what?

Female: She be talking about when she was in the United States and all, cocaine and shit with Jackie Rochelle, her and Jackie Rochelle was talking about that. Today.

Jones: What’s this now– what has this got to do with– with gettin’ our production?

Male: Speak up– let her–

Laura: I don’t– uh, I don’t know Jackie could be talking about. I don’t– I– Usually I work by myself. I mentioned just one time to Jackie that I had been on cocaine when I came back from the States and we were working by each other, and that I’d come off since I came here and that I was screwed up there. Uh, I don’t know.

Male: Let me rem– let me remind you, Laura, you was– when she gave you, she told you, you had to cover up the peanuts, you know, with more dirt and you had to do it faster, you said, “Well, I thought I was doing all right.” You know, you– you– you just kept giving her backtalk like you thought you knew what you was doing, but everybody there was– was messing up because at first we didn’t have the right, uh–

Jones: (Unintelligible word) you giving a black woman back talk. You in the middle class, don’t you think we owe something better than that?

Laura: Yes, Dad, I do, I know we owe better than that. I don’t– I just– I haven’t seen it today–

Jones: She been one of the people that give me more gratitude, in the sense that when I risked my life for her to keep her from being arrested, risk going to jail with the FBI, she showed a responsiveness towards– She really showed a genuine responsiveness. Why in the hell you want to give her some backtalk? Well, get out of her h– hair, get out of her hair and to be in Learning until you can get your ass together.

Laura: All right. Thank you, Dad.

Female: Thank you, Dad.

Jones: Hands off ‘em. I’m gonna get into Learning now. Hands off. (Pause) I want– uh, shit is the next now? Rory Bargeman is– Watch Bargeman, he got hit in the head there, so watch him. Th– Though I’ll take care of it, but watch him in the– when the– nonetheless. Here, tonight.

Male: You hear that, Kenny [Reed]? Watch him–

Jones: (unintelligible) Yes, yes, we wake him. (unintelligible) Piggery (reading) Workers– Wait, I can’t see– Workers work well today, by getting things done even with a fast pace. Workers slow due to the fact that they need more help. Piggery. Well, what can be done about that? Cassava crew, work– uh, I’ll leave that to this– the job change people. I don’t know what the hell to do with this. Mary Griffith slow in her work today. Eric Baker, Anita March, all working fair. Warnings. Any other people there? Any other warnings?

Jones: Jocelyn [Carter, aka Jocelyn Brown] and Tinetra crew all worked steady at one point, but did slow down at another time. Billy Jones, Dee Dee Lawrence need to talk less and work more. Yolanda Brown needs to pick up her pace. Any warnings there?

(Unintelligible responses)

Jones: Piggery. The class at the Piggery seems well taught, but some of the students don’t bother to write the reports and don’t seem to, uh, care. Janet Lenin [aka Janet Tupper], Marice Anderson, Kim Fye: no reports made and no excuse given. Also, Sandy, did the– all the security give me the report that they were supposed to?

Sandy Cobb: (Unintelligible)

Jones: Okay. Also Garnett Johnson and James Johnson said theirs was at home. Those are all warnings. Any others?

Sandy Cobb: No, Dad.

Jones: Flies at the Piggery still out of hand. We got to move on that, we’re gonna make– talk to the entomologist tonight. Right? Try to– over the amateur [radio]?

Sandy Cobb: Yes.

Jones: Robert Franklin was taking a piss where the cut lumber’s stacked, plus the restrooms were, uh, were very close.

Sandy Cobb: (Unintelligible)

Jones: Robert Franklin?

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Jones: Well, tell it–

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Robert Franklin: The reason why come I did, because that uh, I was working and uh, I didn’t want to take time to walk all– all the way over to the– to the restroom– over there to the restroom, so I just, what I did, is just do a piss real quick. That was the reason why I gone and did it. I mean I felt that walking over there, you know, all the way to the restroom just to use the restroom–

Johnny Moss Brown: Could you’ve gone some place else? Could you’ve gone some place else?

Franklin: Yeah, I did–

Brown: Would you like to pick up– would you like to pick up lumber had piss on it?

Franklin: No, I wouldn’t.

Brown: All right then. (unintelligible under Franklin) That’s the damn point.

Franklin: Thank you, Dad. Thanks, Johnny.

Brown: (unintelligible) And I don’t know if that’s some disposition or not, but that’s something you shoulda thought about while you [were] pissing.

Crowd: (Scattered response, including the name of Jerry Livingston)

Brown: Well, can you all, if you d– if you’re not going to go all the way to the bathroom, can you go to the windrow and not s– not piss where somebody’s got to put their hand in it?
 Jones: (off mic at first) I’m going to tell you what’s gonna happen. I’ve got fifty problems and all of mine (Unintelligible) walk. But I’m going to have to, I’m gonna have a container or I’m going to be rupturing my bladder. This is what you’re doing to me. I’m not going to be able to piss, and I– and I will not walk all the way to the toilet, and to hold this meeting up. It’s psychological. I won’t do it. So you better have a container here. Now, has he had second warning?

Female: Yes, Dad. He had one the other day.

Jones: Well then, he knows where he goes. Hmm?

Female: He’s not the only one.

Jones: Of course they’re not. So then get a container and have it here. Have it in the radio room, or I will just go and let the goddamn bladder burst. I’m not gonna fuck with this. I’ve told you over and again, when I piss out– I sure wouldn’t piss on nobody’s lumber, I do have enough sense to know better than that.

Male: Where’d you piss?

Male: Piss on the ground–

Franklin: I wasn’t pissing on the lumber– It was– it was on the ground, and instead (Unintelligible) I walked all the way over there to the– to the– to the windrow. Right, uh–

Male: Come on, man– Come on, come on–

Robert Franklin: Well, I mean– (Unintelligible)

Male: Right, uh–

Jones: Aw, God–

Male: It’s just laziness instead of walking to the bathroom, I just go out there and piss behind the tents. Uh–

Jones: No more pissing. Get a container for me. No more pissing in the ground. And I hope it doesn’t have bad affect on your leader. You people all tighten me up! (angry) Goddamn you sons of bitches, goddamn you! I sure as hell would gladly to walk to the fucking toilet, but I don’t have the time to walk to the goddamn tawket [toilet].

Voices in crowd: That’s right!

Jones: Son of a bitch! Pour liquid in to keep my– my urinary system to function. So it’s nothing but liquid. But do you all gotta take– So– Okay, okay. Now I got to piss in a pot, and there won’t be no pot, so I’ll stay in until the goddamn bladder bursts. (sips a drink) There won’t be no pot. No, there won’t be– (angry) ‘Cause you sons of bitches, anything I do, you gotta do. Goddamn ya! Why don’t you work like I do then? Why don’t you take the burdens I do then?

Voices in crowd: That’s right!

Jones: Son of a bitch, I never saw anything like this. I hate these goddamn meetings.

Voice in crowd: (Unintelligible)

Jones: I’m sure. I’ve just had a long time of them, goddamn ‘em to hell. Look at some of your faces– I got your ass out of jail on the way from Los Angeles. You out there, set an example like that!

(Several tape edits over different people speaking, unintelligible)

Male (tentative identification as Jerry Livingston): –time from now on, and– and not be anarchistic and lazy.

Jones: Piss all over the place, you all stop pissing in. (Pause) Everybody pisses in a pot, in the toilet, okay?

Voices in crowd: Yes.


Jones: He got his warning? His– his just one warning?

Female: Uh, no one passed (unintelligible)

Jones: That won’t do. It’s very nice, but it won’t do. It makes it– makes it film over. Can’t see anything now. Okay, okay. Want to say something to him?

Female: Yeah, I’d like to say, piss in the toilet next time, lazy fucker.

Jones: (pause) Then where in the hell else are we? Where was the last one?

Male: (Unintelligible)

Jones: He’s already gone, isn’t he? He’s gone onto Learning?

Male: (Unintelligible)

Jones: (Unintelligible, sounds like “de’HeJennifer May.”) All– Overall production is not up to par. This is horrible. The overall production better step up to par. (Pause) Michaeleen Brady’s still hostile. Four days in a– in a b– in the uh, isolation chamber, hmm? As you know, we had, uh, Walker had to go in there – Barbara Walker – because she tried to sh– bother my son, and think he’s me in some kind of messed up thing about wanting to fuck, and he can’t even go to sleep at night, Stephan [Jones] can’t go to sleep tonight, so she was asked to leave and then she hit Emmett Griffith in the head with a ball bat, so you all better be warned about her. She struck him in the head with a ball bat. It’s a miracle it didn’t kill him. (Pause) You know who I’m talking about? She’s in the chamber. I only make mention of it because we have to be publicly w– aware, to see what the hell happens when she gets out. My recommendation is that she does– that she be kept there so she’s no capacity.

Male: I agree, Dad.

Jones: It’s my recommendation she not be given– she– she’ll be quiet and she– only reason she’s not hostile is she’s just biding her time to get out, do exactly what she said she’d do, kill Emmett. She said she’d kill Emmett, wasn’t it, and, uh, Al [Touchette]?

Male: Everybody.

Female: –to keep her away from Stephan.

Jones: Everybody tries to keep her away from Stephan. Well, that’s lovely. Well, you keep her away, doctor.

Laurence Schacht: Yes, Dad.

Jones: Put her in– put her in infirmary.

Schacht: Yes, Dad. (Unintelligible)

Jones: Not gonna let sons of bitchin’ crazy people run loose.

Crowd: (Scattered murmurs of approval)

Jones: But she stay in there, stay in there, let her stay in there, till the full time. How we going to do with this Michaeleen Brady? (Pause) She hostile as hell too.

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Jones: It’s a shame to have to waste medicine on goddamn incorrigibles. (Chews ice)

Tom Grubbs: She came up as hostile tonight, until I reminded her it could be– you know, that the program was success, and it could be a (stretches word) long time, and she changed very quickly. She did throw her food up against the inside of the–

Jones: What’s that?

Grubbs: I said that she was ho– quite hostile tonight and she threw– took her food and she threw it up on the inside of the walls. And uh, I responded by saying that uh, the program was to be a success, and she could be in there a very long time and (snaps fingers) she sobered up very quickly.

Male: I think, uh, she’s–

Jones: (short laugh) Gentleness again. You’re so gentle and calm and moderate in your approach and very fair, and then these goddamn people just walk all over it.

Female Voices: That’s right. They do.

Male: I think Michaeleen’s uh, really hostile because she knows she’s gonna have to face it this time, there ain’t no– there’s no getting out of it, and she’s not gonna manipulate out of it, that’s why she’s– this is, uh, the longest hostile pattern she’s had, since I’ve known about this–

Jones: Her mental game doesn’t work anymore, hmm?

Male: That’s right. And she– and she knows this doesn’t work anymore, and she’s hostile, and I think this is going to be a breaking point, and we ought to leave her in there for a while until she gets damned nice.

Jones: Okay, we’ll do it. And save us our– save us our pills.

(Crowd noise in pause)

(radio noise in background)

(Tape edit)

Jones: All family– all family members should – something should be said about that – all family members should uh, say that, si– sign that, and then all the persons going in should sign it. Mm-hmm [Yes]. So who– that– that’s gonna be held responsible. Who’s going to be responsible to see that’s done?

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Jones: Yeah, well the lawyer can follow it through, the lawyer can follow it through. Vernetta [Christian], will you see it’s done?

Vernetta: (Unintelligible)

Jones: The lawyers, that they all sign the release. (Tape edit) Accepting their uh, just and due rehabilitation.

Johnny Brown: (starting off mic) Dad, what I think too, we all should– we all should do it, if uh, we ev– never go in there, I think we all should do it just to show our faith.

Female: (Unintelligible) Not in, not in (Unintelligible)

Brown: Why not?

Female: No, because we (Unintelligible word) the same prob– that’s the problem we ran into–

Brown: Okay, all right, all rig–
Jones: Well, that’s what the hell [Tim] Stoen got us tricked into. It has effect after, but ever, ev– don’t let a one, none of you analysts that’re sitting there, don’t let a one go by that they don’t sign. It has its purpose. Patty Dennis, who there’s a lot of talk here– what, who is this, I didn’t get this report, a lot of report about her and uh– (smacks lips) I guess all over the goddamn place. But that’s what– that’s a problem you take.

Female: Let her come through the middle, please.

Patty: Uh, like, af– (Pause)

Jones: (pointed) Well, get up, asshole.

Patty: Uh– After what happened, and–

Male: Are you sitting there?

Patty: –you came in there and uh, and talked–

Jones: You got a lot of nerve, asshole. You knew then– You didn’t get the whole story. She screamed and cried when you had her down on the bed, and then– and cried out, trying to get you off of her. Asshole!

Crowd: (Angry response)

Brown: Hold it, hold it. Take– take his tooth out. Hold it! Hold it! Take his tooth out. Hold it! Take his tooth out!

Female: How dare you!

Brown: Take his tooth out!

Voice: It don’t come out.

Male: Oh, Lord.

Brown: Well, don’t give him no head shots.

Crowd: (Angry response)

Jones: (Unintelligible) You want to know the fact of it? Make this little girl look like a– a whore, that’s– that’s– that’s not the case. That’s how the security got into it. She was screaming to get away from you!

Jerry Baisy: (Unintelligible)

Jones: Oh yes she was!

Male: That’s right, Dad.

Male: She was, he told me she was–

Jones: That’s how– that’s how he had– that’s how Billy, uh, found you: her screaming to get away from you. You a grown man and she a child.

Female: (striking Baisy as she speaks) I’d like to say Dad’s give you plenty of chances and you a fucked up already–

Male: That’s enough!

Jones: Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. (Pause) I give you a chance to go at– off of Learning Crew into town.

Crowd: That’s right!

Brown: To get your mouth fixed.

Jones: I did that a separate and apart from it, I– I sent him in there, uh, trust him, when he– I took him off of Learning, he wasn’t even supposed to– he was in some fuck-up trouble, wasn’t even supposed to go, and I– I trust him, put him out. He come home and– a little twelve-year old girl. Prick.

Man: (grunts in exertion while striking Baisy)

Jones: Hold it now, hold it, hold it, hold it, hold it, hold it, Stephan. Are– you get out of the goddamn stuff, Stephan! You get out of it! Stephan! You get out of it! Stephan! S– Don’t you take your pent host– hostilities like that, Stephan. Get out of there.

Stephan Jones: They ain’t pent hostilities! I hate to see a fucker my goddamn age on a little fucking girl like that. Ain’t no fucking pent hostilities to it, you cool ass motherfucker. Tough! So tough!

Jones: I agree with you, but get out of it. You can’t be in it. You’re risking organizational problems. Get in– get out of there! (Pause) Well, get out of there now! (Pause) I said get moving! (Pause) What is it?

Female: No, I didn’t s–

Jones: You want to say something?

Marceline Jones: (off-mic at first) (sounds like) I don’t know what to say, but whatever the disposition is, she’s going to have to have a lot of support right now.

Jones: Well, okay, well, just be careful what you saying back here, because it could be interpreted as you’re trying to moderate for– for him, and he doesn’t need it.

Marceline: Oh, no–

Stephan: How in fuck– I had no alliance with her, folks. All right, and, uh–

Jones: No, nobody thinks you have. But when she looks over here a certain way, nobody’ll know what the hell’s being happening. Mother shouldn’t do this.

Marceline: That’s right, I shouldn’t. I wasn’t modifying what he was– I was only saying that whatever the disposition here is, this child is going to have to have a lot of support. That’s what I was saying.

Jones: Uh–

Male: There you go–

(Sounds of beating)

Jones: Hold it, uh, hold it, hold it, hold it!

Brown: (shrieking, unintelligible) Night [Timothy Borl Jones]! Let go! (Pause) Will you guys control yourself. (Pause) Everybody else (unintelligible). Everybody else (unintelligible)

Jones: You know, technically– technically you can be hung. You’re an adult and she’s a child. Technically you can be hung in this country–

Voices: That’s right!

Jones: A socialist country. Uh. That’s rape.

Female: That’s what it is! That’s what makes it so hard–

Jones: A child, a child. Uh– There’s no differ– honey, it’s no difference if you had put your fingers in there. There’s no reason– I don’t– I don’t agree with m– making you an issue like that, Marceline. Publicly, you shouldn’t’ve even brought it up, ‘cause there’s no need. Anybody it can happen to, the best women in here, who’ve never had any problems thereafter, because they s– he, what he told you, he didn’t want nothing from you, he didn’t want you, didn’t want you at all. (Pause) Then she proves she didn’t want you, by trying to get away from you, and you prick, you wouldn’t let her out.

Male: It was the same fact that me and, uh, Jerry got in the same kind of incident, and that’s why his tooth got knocked out. And then Karen’s stupid ass, when we was in Georgetown, she was hanging all around him–

Karen: Yeah, I have nothing–

Male: Shut your ass! Just shut up! Shut your ass up!

Karen: Shut up!

Male: Wait, hold it! Hold it! Hold it! Hold it! You got–

Male: Shut up!

Male: –you got something to say, you carry your ass up there, and everybody else that don’t belong up there, sit down. I mean it! Sit down, if you don’t belong up there! Everybody pushing and shoving and hanging and carrying on. Karen, move up there. Hurry up!

Male: And uh, then I told Karen to quit hanging around him, because I thought the same thing’d happen. And then uh, Karen she c– she constantly hanged around him. And this past Sunday she quit, uh, you know, just kind of laid off, but she kept hanging around, and I thought the same thing happened, and when– when this happened the other night, uh, I was totally shocked, you know, and he did this. I mean that’s why, you know, I’m totally pissed at him, ‘cause me and him got put in the sa– we was in the same predicament w– with another sister and, you know, he got his tooth knocked out and you paid for it, and he comes do this again. I mean he really ain’t thinking, you know?
Jones: He’s a hard worker, and a good (Stumbles over words) less punky than some other people from LA. But I don’t understand this goddamn miserable shit– This is– There’s nothing so bad as rapists of little children.

Male: He’s a punk.

Male: That’s what he asked for, easier discipline, easier discipline– going to the Learning Crew.

Female: Easier?

Male: Can you, can you step out? Thank you. Sebastian [McMurry], get up here and do your job–

Female: Now what you– what you crying about?

Crowd: (Stirs)

Jones: Honey, nothing about that, honey. Just because something’s inside a vagina don’t make you any difference.

Female: That’s right.

Jones: What the hell’s the difference? Your Father’s good, and he’s been everywhere. I’ve been in everything coming down a river. And up the river, and out of the river and out of the swamp and above the swamp. And I’m still good. I wasn’t there for anything but goodness in the first place. But don’t lo– don’t pay attention to that shit, that’s all m– middle-class morality, you have to talk about that shit. But you, fucker, why didn’t you let her go?

Male: Answer!

(Sounds of Baisy being struck.)

Voices: Speak up! There you go.

Jones: Why didn’t you let her go?

Voices: Hurry up! Better do it quick! Speak up!

Jones: Why didn’t you let her go?

Baisy: I don’t know, Dad. It was stupid. It was just something I wanted to do, and it was stupid.

Jones: Held a person against their will, a twelve-year old child. Screaming! That causes the– the wh– the whole community to be alerted. We have never had that kind of forceful rape.

Male: That’s right, Dad.

Jones: Never!

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Male: Start speaking up.

Patty: Dad?

Jones: Yes?

Patty: When I was trying to get loose from him–

Jones: I’m sorry (Unintelligible)

Patty: I told him, I told him it was hurting me, I told him to let me go, he just kept on saying, “Shhh, just hold on to me and stuff and it won’t hurt,” and stuff. And I kept on telling him, let me go and stuff, and he wouldn’t. And then Billy came in–

Jones: We know, we know you wanted to be free. We know.

Baisy: Dad, it’s just –

(Sounds of Baisy being struck.)

Male: Start speaking up!

Baisy: It’s just, it’s just that I was carrying on the way I used to– uh, it’s just stupid, I’m just, uh–

Female: Stupid?

Jones: Stupid? You’re a rapist, you’re a child molester!

Crowd: (Angry response)

Male: You’ll kill him! Because you’ll kill him!

Jones: You better keep him away from the kids in back.

Female: Goddamn stupid ass motherfucker!

Male: That’s right.

Female: Your stupid goddamn ass.

Female: Don’t hit him so hard.

(Sounds of Baisy being struck.)

Female: You’re a criminal.

Male: Damn!

Jones: Hold it, hold it, hold it! Hold it!

Male: Oh! Goddamn! Shit!

Female: ‘Cause she hit him in the wrong place.

Female: Man, she hits hard!

Female: Ain’t nothing funny!

Male: Huh? I’m laughing at (unintelligible)

Jones: (unintelligible word) You could avoid this shit, if you’da confessed the last night.

Male (Baisy?): That’s right, Dad.

Female: Dumb ass!

(Sounds of Baisy being struck.)

Female: Hit him in the– hit him in the– in– in his butt.

Jones: Let her get it out, let her get it out, she’s the one that was raped, let her get it out. Let her get it out.

Crowd: (Shouts)

Jones: Hit him in the balls. Hit him in the balls! Hit him! (Pause) Back off, back off, back off from him, back off from him, back off from him, let– back– no, no, I don’t mean her! Everybody get away. Let em, let ‘em loo– let her loose. So people can see.

Male: Everybody down, everybody down, everybody down. Everybody down.

Jones: The rest of you, get out, so people can see. There been others raped out there. There been others raped out there! Get down, you fuckers, get down.

Crowd: (Shouts)

Voices in crowd: That’s right! Put that Judo on it. Hit his fucking ass! Kick him, kick him! Hold on tight! Yeah, you hurt! It don’t hurt! It be all over now! Hit him again! Hit him again!

Jones: Hold on to your precious balls, that you put into little babies.

Voices in crowd: Hit him again! Hit him again! You’re a real man, aren’t you?

Jones: All you better look that– that decide you want to rape a child. You better look real well. We’ll– we’ll gladly stand up to face anybody about this. And Guyana’ll back us up in it.

Voices in crowd: Hit him again, hit him again, hit him again. Stupidest! Goddamn liar! I get to your fucking ass. You better stand up! Stand your goddamn ass up, I get to your ass. I’ll make the motherfuckers fall off your ass!

(Tape edit)

Jones: –young man? Think about her, think about her, we’re doing you a curative process now. You think about how you held her down, think what you were doing while she was screaming. Hit him again, and you think about it.

Voices in crowd: That’s right! Hold on tight. Stand up, Jerry!

Jones: Think about it. Think about having her poor little body under yours. A little child! Think about it! Think about it! Think about it! Think about it! Charles Garry said that was wonderful, even a psychiatrist said our technique was excellent on a man when we did that before.

Crowd: (Cries out)

Child: Feels good, doesn’t it, Jerry?

Jones: Okay. Okay. Now s– drop your pants.

Female: Low down fucking pig.

Jones: Drop your pants!

Female: All the way! Creep!

Jones: Now turn around! I don’t want to see it– s– that thing you throwed in her! A child!

Female: Give him a good hit!

Crowd: (Cheers and cries)

Jones: Hmm? Okay. Now, now–

Johnny Jones: Hey, let go, let go, let go! Let go!

Jones: Now put your pants up.

Crowd: (response)

(Tape edit)

Jones: That’s why it’s so swollen too. And big. Now you got a big one.

Female: Now it’s like you want it, big. Keep fucking up, it’s gone be amputated!

Jones: (Laughs) Now you got the biggest one in town. You feel good?

Baisy: No, Dad.

Crowd: (response)

Male: Open up– (Unintelligible word) over your eyes– Look at that (Unintelligible word). You got in trouble before. You just a little asshole.

Voices in crowd: That’s right. Same dumb shit. A big asshole!

Jones: It’s swollen five times or six times its size. I hope by God you remember it.

Baisy: I will, Dad.

Jones: The last guy remembered it, and it was a little bit harder than you got.

Voices in crowd: That’s right, that’s right, that’s right.

Jones: I hope you do remember it. I still want to hear from your– your mouth why you continue to press when a child is screaming, when she– All she thought was a cuddling operation, and it ends up in a goddamn rape.

Baisy: I don’t know, Dad. It just– uh–

Crowd: (Response)

Jones: You better– you better start talking. You better talk about your orneriness.

Baisy: Uhhh–

Crowd: (Cries out)

Male: Suppose someone is fucking you in your butt?

Jones: You don’t know how it feels. And she– you– you tore her.

Female: You know, you hurt her, right? She’s telling you it hurts. Why did you continue–

Jones: Hurt it. She didn’t even know what she was getting into, she didn’t even know what was taking place, and yet screams and drag– drags out security. (Pause) That’s how much of a scream it was, like somebody being killed. Did you think it was pleasure?

Baisy: Uh– (cut off by Jones)

Jones: Her screaming and asking you to quit, quit, quit? You been looking at Hollywood movies?

Baisy: Yes, Dad.

Female: You think she liked it, right?

Jones: Sure, he did.

Baisy: Yeah.

Jones: He thought she liked it, her screaming and crying and wanting to get out from under him and saying it hurts.

Female: Did you enjoy hearing her scream?

Jones: You be– you beast!

Female: You must’ve enjoyed hearing her scream, didn’t you? You must’ve enjoyed that.

Baisy: Yes. Yes.

Male: What you got to say, Jerry? Because you were– you were a smart ass when you wanted to get your mouth fixed. Every time I walked by, you had something smart-ass to say about your mouth. So let’s see you talk now.

Child: Say something.

Baisy: Only, only thing I can say is I’m an asshole and I shouldn’t a did it.

Female: You’re more than an asshole!

Voice: Do you know why you did it? Why?

Baisy: Yeah, I know why, ‘cause it’s–

Jones: Because he looked at Hollywood movies! You goddamned stupid son of a bitches! When a woman says it hurts, she means it hurts! It’s not like Hollywood, “don’t, don’t, don’t, don’t,” and they want it! Nobody wants it when they say don’t. They don’t mean they want yes. They scream “it hurts,” and cry out! You idiot sadist!

Baisy: That’s right, Dad.

Jones: Sadistic pigs!

Female: Jerry, say something. (Unintelligible word) from your goddamn ass!

(radio noise in background)

Male: You best speak up.

Child: You better start speaking, Jerry.

Crowd: (Cries out)

Jones: Your balls can be as big as the b– broadside of an elephant’s. Now, we’ve s– we’ve– uh, we’ve made– we’ve made penises bigger than elephants. And you– you have nothing yet. You’ll have a big dick, but you won’t envy it. (Pause) Not for a long time.

Female: There’s a lot of women out here been raped, young man.

Voices in crowd: There sure is! That’s right!

Jones: Who said that, sister? Yes, yes, yes. A lot of women out here been raped, young man.

Female: The point is, you are not an asshole, you’re a rapist!

Jones: You are a criminal, that could be facing a gallows in a few weeks.

Crowd: Right! Right!

Female: And how would you have felt, motherfucker, if–

Jones: He face it here. He has raped and he’s of age. If we didn’t have our own laws.

Male: What do you got to say about that?

Jones: They hang your ass for it here.

Male: They hang you until you’re dead, fucker!

Jones: Not here, not here, it wouldn’t be a special white girl here. This country don’t have no race. They hang you! Black, white. It’s a law, I’m not kidding his ass. He is a rapist, and he’s an adult.

Male: Why, when I was in Georgetown, I read the paper, I read the paper, and it happened–

Jones: Why, they hang them, they hang them!

Male: Hang you until you’re dead!

Jones: Put the goddamn rope around your neck, if it wasn’t for this community. And you’d be convicted sure as hell. You got nothing but a whole– hundreds of witnesses.

Male: So that means if you think about leaving, you ain’t going nowhere.

Jones: No, I– better not. You better not give us no shit, trouble. Because statute of limitations’ll be a long while. They can try you that for several years.

Male: Oh, I don’t think they even have a statute down here, Dad.

Jones: On rape, no– no limit, no limits on it, no limits. In oth– In other words, anytime he wants to act up, somebody can report him, and he can be uh, he can be hung. Mmm-hmmm [Yes].

Patty: Dad, last night when you came in and you talked to us and stuff, you told him that and stuff, and if it wasn’t for you, Tim and them would’ve kicked his ass then.

Jones: Yes, they did, they’d done more than kick his ass. I talked to you gently and sweet, but you didn’t confess your raping. Prick. (Pause) You made it look like she was the w–wanting partner.

Crowd: Yep, yep. They always–

Female: Even if she had been– been attracted (illegible) took advantage of her.

Jones: (Angry) Shut up! Shut up! Shut up, woman! Shut up! Shut up! You shut your goddamn mouth! Don’t you dare plant that she wanted it. She didn’t want it! (Unintelligible word), the witnesses even she wanted to, what you talking about? No twelve-year-old child knows what they want. In the first place, she– no twelve-year-old child wants it, and she made it damn clear she didn’t want it. She screamed.

Male: Stand up, stand up!

Female: Screaming!

Jones: (angry) Why don’t you people shut up and quit trying to help me. I can run this goddamn program, if some of you’d shut your fucking mouth!

Male: A little bit more than him–

Child: Stand up and salute.

Child: Stand up!

Male: Stand up please.

Female: I’m sorry.

Jones: You should apologize for even planting that that child would want that.

Female: I said I’m sor– I– I said I’m sorry, Dad.

Crowd: (Scattered response)

Jones: You saying, even if she wanted it, even if she– the child– I’ve told you the truth. Nothing to help this child, this child was brought to the attention of security, from screams, (calls out) “Don’t! Don’t! Don’t!” She was raped by this prick! No use to water that shit. I don’t need your counsel, I don’t need your help!

Crowd: (Shouts)

Jones: Some of the– Half the goddamn trouble I’ve got, all you people out there second guessing. When– One faults you got, you’ll talk right when I’m talking.

Crowd: (Applause)

Jones: Peace. You always think you know a little bit more. Always can add one more line to Father’s lines. Well, do it on some other night, I don’t give a shit, but don’t pick at one o’clock in the morning to do it. (Pause) (Low voice) Goddamn shits.

Female: How would you’ve liked it if it had been one of your sisters? How would you have felt then, punk? Answer that.

Voice: Let him answer it!

Baisy: (dazed) Uh–

Female: Why don’t you talk?

Jones: Well, I guess he needs a little more.

(Sounds of Baisy being struck.)

Voices in crowd: Talk, talk, talk! Talk then, now! You better have something to say.

Jones: Okay, enough, enough. Hmm? She’s stronger than an ox. (Pause) Fourteen Portero Hill. We’ll have to remember her. Green eggs and ham.

Crowd: (Laughter)

Jones: You women better learn to fight, ‘cause you’re dealing with something else, it’s the scum that’s been brought up in capitalism. Goddamn males, make me ashamed.

Voice: Why don’t you talk, man?

Baisy: Uh–

Jones: (yelling) You better get your fucking mouth open and talk what you are now, what are– what– what about what you did?

Baisy: What I did, it, it’s– it’s a– it’s a– I– I– and I’m a rapist.

Male: Are you a homosexual?

Baisy: Yes.

Male: Why– w– why you say that?

Baisy: Because I know I am. ‘Cause–

Male: How do you know?

Jones: How do you know you’re a homosexual?

Baisy: I don’t really know but, uh, that’s probably why I– I did that, because I’m a homosexual.

Male: What is a homosexual?

Baisy: It’s a male that like other males and try to hide it, some– some of ‘em. Some of ‘em try to hide it.

Jones: Did you, uh, do you think that, uh– wouldn’t it be much, much nicer to be an open homosexual than to bother little children?

Baisy: Yes, Dad.

Jones: No home– no homosexuals who practice homosexuality are never known for this kind of shit. It’s always somebody trying to cover and act like the big tough man.

Baisy: That’s right, Dad.

Jones: It’s never the homosexuals who molest children. It’s the so-called heterosexuals.

Crowd: That’s right! That’s right!

Jones: Well, I hope now that we have a public example. You guys, big mouths. I hope we have a public example.

Baisy: Yes, Dad.

Jones: (Unintelligible word) you’ll have to watch him through the night, see that your kidneys don’t uh– your– you don’t swell up and you can’t pee. Last guy, it was– it looked like mincemeat. Don’t give us no shit.

Baisy: Okay, Dad.

Jones: Don’t anybody in this house ever touch a child again.

Crowd: (Agrees)

Jones: I don’t– I don’t think you had enough. I don’t think you had enough. (Pause) I don’t think you had enough, when you kept on pressing into a child.

Male: Give him some more!

Crowd: Right, right! That’s right!

Female: Whoop his ass some more.

Male: Turn around, turn around!

(Sounds of Baisy being struck.)

Jones: Okay, doctor, take him away. That’s what I want you– Head down, head down, head down, or we’ll put you down there again with a goddamn s– blow to your miserable balls. Child rapist.

Child: Thank you, Dad.

Child: Thank you, Dad.

Child: Thank you, Dad.

Jones: Thank you. And you better not, nothing to say to her, ‘cause you couldn’t– nobody could’ve kept from what happened to her. Nobody could’ve stopped it. He’s a great big bully, big man. There was no way she could get away from him.

Female: Really! How does a girl– How does it, really! How could she get away from anyone?

Male: How could a kid that age know what they want? I mean, how could she say that shit?

(Tape edit)

Female: Thank you, Dad. I appreciate your love and concern for each and every one and especially Patty, Dad. Thank you, Dad.

Jones: Thank you.

Child: Thank you, Dad.

Male: You know you don’t go past (unintelligible)

Jones: Excellent, excellent job.

Child: Thanks, Dad.

Jones: ‘Cause she’s on there based on the fact, his uh– his line, she didn’t even bother to even try to expose him. But I got the witness– She didn’t try to defend herself, I got the wi– witnesses from our own security. (Pause) I’m telling it, the fact, just the way it was, he r– he raped her and she screamed and tried to get him off of her, and he wouldn’t do it. He wouldn’t stop. They had to come in and pull him off. That’s true, that’s true. (reading) Willie Malone shoved Carol Kerns in the face yesterday, abusive and threatening, called her and Karen Lendo a name, loud and mouthy in an apartment this morning, taken to coordinator’s office both times, hostile to Penny [Kerns]– (emphatic) and Mother [Marceline Jones]?

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: (emphatic) And Mother? And Mother?

Crowd: (Reacts)

Male: Stand up! Stand up!

Jones: (singsong) Don’t you give no shit to Mother.

(Sounds of Willie Malone being struck.)

Male Child: So fucking tough, yesterday.

Jones: Okay. Get away, get away. Back ‘em off, back ‘em off, back ‘em off. Yes, son?

Male Child: Uh, Dad, yesterday we was in the pavilion sitting over here–

Jones: Tell all these people to sign these proper forms, starting now.

Male Child: He was saying yesterday that he can control all the children better than these bitches around here.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: Well, he had his chance, he had his chance, and he’s fucking it up bad.

Child: And he called Penny a fat bitch in the uh, dining area over there this morning.

Jones: Called her a black bitch?

Child: A fat bitch.

Jones: A fat bitch.

Marceline Jones: I also heard that he was talking to someone else, to Vincent [Lopez]–

Jones: (reading) Vincent said he couldn’t win with eight hundred people.

Marceline Jones: And you said–

Jones: Willie replied that the way to do it is to take one person at a time.

Crowd: (Stirs)

Jones: You punks, you goddamn punks want to just tear up our organization. Who you going to take one at a time? Hmm?

Crowd: (Reacts)

(End of Side B)


(Side A)

Willie Malone: – about what George Jackson, that when they– when they isolate him, that– the only way he could survive –

Jones: (Angry) Don’t you dirty the name of George Jackson– Don’t you–! Don’t you dirty the name of George Jackson. If George Jackson had had this movement, he’d be alive! Don’t you dirty his name. You’re not worthy of his goddamned name. Don’t you speak his name, you prick! Don’t you mention it, because this organization would’ve saved George Jackson! It’s pricks like you that sold him down the river that caused him to be dead! You’re not a George Jackson, you’re a punk!

Crowd: Right! (Extended applause)

Jones: You goddamned miserable punks, you gangsters that want to identify with George Jackson, and if he’da had some of you miserable punks working with him, he wouldna been killed by the pigs. He’da had this organization, he talked about it. You haven’t read his books! He talked about this kind of organization we have, you miserable goddamned punk. Don’t you ever dirty his name again until you can learn to cooperate and follow rules, you miserable punk!

Young male: And he– he said like only way you could survive like if you be in a box– and if you take off your clothes, keep on puttin’ ‘em back on, you never, you know, lose your head, nothing like that and he think he’s gonna survive in a box.

Jones: Oh he– great great great punk–

Young Male: Dad?

Male: Uh–

Jones: We’ll put him in the fucking box with the frog tonight. Then see if you can stay away from the frog. One touch of the fucking frog! How about that, Willie boy? Big old Gangland Willie boy? How about the bi– how ‘bout– how ‘bout– How about going in the box tonight with the frog?

Malone: Dad, uh–

Jones: How about the frog?

Malone: Truthfully–

Jones: Why don’t we get the frog? Why don’t you put your hand in there with the frog?

Malone: Dad–

Jones: Come on, Willie boy, put your hand in there, put your hand in there, Willie boy–

Scattered in crowd: Where’s the frog? Get the frog.

Jones: Put your hand in there, put your hand in there, Willie boy! We might as well be free from you. Nobody’ll see it! Nobody’ll see it.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Stephan Jones: Thank you, Willie, I told you to, right?

Voice: Dad, when you talk about being a crazy–

Jones: We got no problem– It’s your problem: You touch a frog, you’re dead.

Voice in crowd: Well, when you can take anything you think–

Jones: You can take anything. How about it, Willie? How about it, Willie? You want to touch a frog tonight, Willie? You punk, you goddamned gangland punk! You’ve caused us trouble week after week, month after month, got my blood pressure boiling, punk!

Voice in audience: He brags and he doesn’t change, he brags–

Jones: Oh I see, he’s tough, he’s tough, he can handle anything. Handle this frog, Willie–

Malone: I know I can’t, Dad.

Jones: Handle that pup, open it up and take it–

Crowd: (Calls out)

Female: When Dad was talking about, uh, Willi– about being a crazy nigger, that the only way you could win is to be a crazy nigger, Willie started saying– You were talking– Dad, you were talking about being a crazy nigger and that’s the only way you could win and Willie started saying–

Jones: Watch it, watch it, watch it (Unintelligible word)–

Female: –that’s right– right, like he– the only way he was going to win, by being a crazy nigger.

Jones: You want to die, do you, Willie? I don’t give a shit tonight. You want to die, Willie?

Malone: No– No, I don’t, Dad, but I’m not afraid to.

Jones: Huh? What’s that?

Malone: I don’t want to die, but I ain’t afraid to.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: Well then, go ahead and die.

Malone: I don’t want to.

Jones: Huh?

Malone: I don’t want to.

Voice: Come on, put your hand–

Jones: Here big– big tough– Hold it! Best think it through. Let the son of a bitch jump out.

Voice: Don’t let it–

Malone: Dad, uh–

Voice: Don’t let it jump out!

Jones: What about it?

Malone: Dad, uh? You know, Dad, like I said, I don’t want to– you know, I said that I was just, uh, pissed at the time. I mean I didn’t say it was your fault, I mean at first I tried to uh, hold it against you that, how come I didn’t get off the crew– But I don’t feel it was your fault, I felt it was Penny and them because they didn’t give you the right information. Yeah.

Johnny Brown (?): No. No. No. No. Last rally, last rally, last rally–

Malone: Yeah, two days–

Brown: No. It’s no two days, Willie, it’s your at– it’s your whole attitude, and you don’t– and you don’t never exhibit a good attitude.

Jones: You’re not afraid to die? You’re not afraid to die?

Malone: No, I’m not.

Jones: Then you’re not standing for anything. I’d be ashamed to die if I were you.

Voice in crowd: That’s right!

Jones: Defying an organization for socialism. I’d be ashamed to die.

Malone: Dad, uh–

Brown: Quit talking to me.

Jones: (Unintelligible word) What– What reason we got to think you won’t change? I– I think you’ll– I don’t think you will change, the way you’re going.

Malone: Dad, uh, if it– if it was some other way be– You know, I– I feel that everybody’s up here, you know, uh, hittin’ on– I wo– I’d rather let some senior that has some pain, not Sebastian and the rest of these guys–

Crowd: (Reacts)

Malone: I mean– No– I mean, I know you’re gonna kick my ass, but, you know–

Stephan Jones: Well, you don’t know that any other time– You’re so–

Voice: – one at a time.

Jones: You’re talking about our pain, you’re talking about our seniors’ pain. If you were talking about our seniors’ pain, you wouldn’t be up here keeping ‘em up at one o’clock in the morning.

Crowd: Right.

Jones: You want the seniors? You want the seniors?

Malone: Dad, really, I–

Jones: John, get out of the way and let the seniors have him.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Voice: Oh, yes–

(Sounds of Malone being struck.)

Male child: C’mon, Willie– so tough now–

Jones: All right– All right– all right– (Pause) You want– you want some more of the seniors?

Willie: No [tape glitch], but I appreciate better than these rest of these guys–

Jones: Oh, you wanna– you wanna keep– you wanna keep– you wanna keep being– you wanna keep being a smart-ass, huh? You want to keep being a smart-ass. (emphatic yelling) I have put those people in charge, mothafucka!

Male: Goddamn nerve, he’s so–

Jones: You goddamn prick, I’m the one that put them in there.

Stephan Jones: You fucking punk, we ain’t fucking up all the time, like you, so don’t you come across like we ain’t shit, you goddamned son of a bitch!

Jones: Back up here, back up here, back up here now, Geor– uh– back up here, George, I mean Stephan. Back up here.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: Back up! Now, hold it! (Pause) (Lecturing) You always want to say you’re so tough, and you always want to look like you’re right. I put those people in charge, so you’re now better than they are, you’re– you’re better than me, you– you don’t think they should be entitled to beat on you. They can beat on everybody else’s ass, but they’re not supposed to beat on you, because Willie boy doesn’t like for them to do it.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Stephan Jones: God! Listen! Willie! Goddamn it! What I don’t understand, what I don’t fucking understand, instead of you, competing with us, instead of be– getting on our fucking side, right? You’re tough, right? So why don’t you get on our goddamn side and help us fight, huh? You’re– you’re– you’re so–

Jones: Punks like you killed W– George Jackson. Don’t you think you oughta make up for it?

Malone: Yes, Dad. I didn’t say I was trying to be like George Jackson.

Jones: You didn’t have to say you were like him. You quoted him, you quoted him and you’re not worthy of quoting him.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Stephan Jones: Do you wanna be like him? That ain’t the question. Do you wanna be like him?

Malone: You– you know, I wan– no, what I really wanna be like, but I know I ain’t gonna never be there, is like Dad so, you know–

Stephan Jones: Damnit, man–!

Male: But that ain’t what you said this morning, fucker!

Stephan Jones: Dad could kick the shit out of any fucking one of us, and uh, as many at a time as he wants, and you don’t see him walking around doing it, so don’t tell me you want to be like him, all right?

Voice: He’s lying!

Stephan Jones: He’s lying.

Another Male: This morning I asked him the very same goddamned question, and he said he wanted to be like Che Guevara.

Malone: I’m sayin– a revolu– I mean–

Crowd: (Reacts)

Male: And also– and also, when we tried to, we– we tried to explain to him that he tried to– he should try to Father– follow Father’s example, he said, I couldn’t do that in a thousand lifetimes.

Marceline Jones: Look Willie, I remember well what you said about Father a few months ago: “Father bleeds, Father bleeds, Father bleeds.” And I remember what you said yesterday morning, you said, Father, you’re hostile against Father, and against me. Don’t– Look, look, all your words of manipulation don’t convince me one bit. You’re a goddamn liar.

Scattered in crowd: Right. (Light applause)

Male: And also– and also this morning when Mother was talking to him, it was nothing but just pure hostility on his face, he had nothing but a glare in his eyes.

Female: (Angry, unintelligible)

(Sounds of Malone being struck.)

Jones: Hold it, hold it, hold it, hold it, hold it.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: (aside) – can after they check him–

Male: Y’all back up. Would you all back up? Back up a minute. Damn. Back up! Will y’all back up?

Crowd: (Reacts)

(Tape edit)

Jones: All right–

Male: (off) Hey, shut up!

Male: –ass in Los Angeles. Killed by the fucking gang, that’s what we shoulda done.

Male: Yeah, he was tough.

Male: He was in jail, he was in jail–

Brown: They was chasing his ass, and the only reason he’s here, ‘cause you– ‘cause you got him, ‘cause they were chasing his ass down Los Angeles street, he couldn’t go around the corner. And now we can’t go home, ‘cause of this dumb ass.

Jones: That’s true.

Brown: Where my glasses?

Jones: Why– Why is it this, Willie, you do this? I saved you from worse than death. The Los Angeles police don’t make it easy.

(Tape edit)

Jones: Why do you do this, Willie?

Malone: (dazed and disoriented) Uh– uh– I mean, uh–

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: I’m tired of these punks. No, you are– You are not to be talked to, you’re not to talk. You’re on absolute strict silence. Your toughness is not doing anything but causing us difficulty. It’s not helping the George Jacksons. This kind of independent toughness has killed ‘em since the world began, by using your toughness against the organization.

Voice: George Jackson–

Jones: But you can’t defeat– you can’t defeat– you can’t defeat the organization.

Crowd: That’s right, that’s right, that’s right–

Jones: If you don’t want to die– if you do want to die, why in the hell don’t you just take the goddamned frog?

Crowd: (Reacts)

Malone: Uh– uh– uh–

Stephan Jones: You just said “no,” when they told you to put your hand in it, you said, “no!” Everybody else missed it. I didn’t miss it.

Male: I didn’t miss it. He don’t wanna die.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Brown: That give him too much pleasure, keeping us where we’re going, keeping Dad all shook up, he don’t want to die. That give him too much fucking satisfaction, stay around here and bug us.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: So you’re not afraid of dyin’, huh?

Malone: No, Dad.

Male: You’re a liar.

Jones: Why’nt you take the frog then? Hmm?

Malone: I’ll take it.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: And what are you gonna prove by that, big man?

Malone: Uh– I’m seen uh–

Jones: Punk. What are you going to prove by taking the frog and dying tonight?

Malone: Uh, this– snake, I mean–

Jones: The frog, is he– is he a capitalist? Is the fucking frog a capitalist?

Malone: No– No–

Jones: You silly ass fool. You think that being– being brave is an end in itself. It means not shit worth nothing, unless it’s connected with socialism. And you haven’t got it connected with socialism. It’s just Willie Malone, against the world. Gangland Willie. (Pause) So you’re going to be tough and take the frog. At least you’ll be out of our hair. (Pause) You want to take the frog?

Malone: Yeah, I’ll take it, Dad.

Jones: I’m sick of it. I said, do you want to take it?

Malone: Yeah– No, I don’t. I don’t wanna take it, bu–

Male: –grow up, Willie.

Jones: You goddamn better quit, ‘cause I’m tired of this. ‘Cause a frog, you know– if you take the goddamn frog, ain’t nothin’ in the world stops– any, we– anybody in the world can pick up a frog wants to take up the fucking frog. That’s no problem. We haven’t committed any crime at all.

Stephan Jones: Whose side are you on, man? Whose side are you on?

Male: Answer– answer Stephan’s question!

Malone: Uh–

Stephan Jones: He answered it.

Female: That shouldn’t be hard to answer.

Malone: I’m on yo– I’m on Dad’s side.

Stephan Jones: Okay, whose side am I on?

Jones: Well then stay on– stay on there.

Malone: Dad, Dad’s.

Stephan Jones: Why the fuck you fighting with us?

Male: Yeah. It don’t make sense.

Female: He just doesn’t wanna learn anything. He doesn’t wanna work hard.

Old Woman: Work the hell out of him. Make him work hard.

Stephan Jones: I don’t think the problem’s his work. The problem–

Jones: It’s not, it’s not.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Brown: It’s his whole value system–

Jones: He could make a tremendous socialist. He could– He could make one if he’d stopped this belligerent shit of defending your own ego. You’re worried about how you look more than how socialism looks. You’re not worried about how socialism looks, you’re worried about how Willie looks.

Malone: That’s true, Dad.

Jones: You’ll be one of the best if you can now cultivate, how does socialism look. What the fuck if you were given a– a false report? How many false reports have I had on me? They put me in a goddamn television, on the newspaper headlines, people I’ve healed and got out of jail, saved their goddamn lives, healed ‘em of cancer, and the son of a bitches– Listen to me, Willie! How many false reports have been told on Father?

Malone: Millions, Dad.
Stephan Jones: Tell the truth, do you feel bad about that? The truth!

Malone: Yes.

Stephan Jones: Why don’t you act like it?

Jones: Now don’t give me no more trouble. Show me– show me– you– you could make up for this if you, a tough guy, could show me that you could be a nice guy, it’d make up for the hellish blood pressure tonight that’s just making me sick as a dog.

Stephan Jones: And not just in your–

Jones: Can you go back to your seat and do this?

Malone: Yes, Dad.

Stephan Jones: I said, listen Willie, not just your work. You’ve already proved you can work–

Male: Your attitude, your attitude–

Stephan Jones: The way you talk to people, all right?

Jones: And you know that– you know that people got to give rules and authority. And they’re not going to do it perfectly. They’re not perfect. You weren’t perfect when you were doing it. So get back there and act like you can be on the team. And get off all the– Get on the right end of the team.

Stephan Jones: You know the whole reason the gangs didn’t make it in the goddamned States, it’s ‘cause he was– they was proving themselves din– to each other, right? And you were killing each other off, right? Why don’t you try to, uh, do something–

Jones: You could take fifty men, if you’ll get your ass together.

Stephan Jones: That’s the fucking truth. You got something to fight for then, not just Willie.

Male: That’s right.

Jones: ‘Cause they came here tonight, Willie, after you, my ass would be the one they’d have to take. And you ought not to put me through this. Just like it was in Los Angeles, it was my ass that got you out of there.

Crowd: That’s right, that’s right.

Jones: So you think about Father’s ass, and every time you cause trouble with somebody, I don’t care how min– much you may think you been wronged, you’re causing trouble for me.

Female: That’s right.

Malone: Yes, Dad.

Jones: Sit down.

Malone: Thank you.

[Shortwave radio talk in background]

Jones: Vennie Thompso– uh, Thompson, I don’t know what to do with this kind of bullshit. First night she was hostile and said she didn’t do anything to get on. In the morning she said, “that man Pastor Jones said I only had to stay one night,” she said “that man Pastor Jones said I only had to stay one night.” She said that all the people are– who reported Garnett to council in L.A. were liars. Nasty, bad attitude, talks back continuously, says she has arthritis aches and is cold, can’t do this or that. Elsie Bell got mad and yelled at her. She called Dad Pastor Jones again today. Complained throughout the whole day.

Crowd: (Stirs)

Jones: Why don’t you get your damn nasty ass together?

Thompson: Well, Father, you know, you know, I apologize with you but– for him– not too long ago– and I tried– tried my best to not to say it– I said Father, and uh, and we had a meeting, you said, “Vennie, you can say it, you can say Pastor Jones.” Remember David [Wise] was having a meeting here, at the church? But, still–

Jones: No, we had a law that just reversed all that, nobody’s called me Pastor Jones–

Thompson: Still–

Jones: No, no, you haven’t been listening to me. That’s a long time back. We said it was all– everybody said it was Dad or– or Father–

Crowd: (Agrees)

Jones: There was no in-betweens.

Thompson: But they were having, when the man gonna come down here–

Jones: (yells) I don’t give a shit what was said back there. Since then we’ve changed the rules!

Thompson: –(Unintelligible word) change the rules.

Jones: That’s got nothing to do with this, all this bullshit behavior.

(Tape edit)

Vennie Thompson: –hard to say–

Voice: –damn thing–

Jones: I am not! You said all the people that reported Garnett were liars. No wonder Garnett has trouble. Nasty attitude, you kept– so we– Oh, shit, this– Yeah, one answer to this kind of shit, and I know what the answer is: put ‘em in the bed with the frog.

Voice: I think this is just bullshit that you pulling, you should do what you’re told, and I told you l– last night to do what you’re told and keep your mouth shut, uh, you’re not gonna get off the crew. So I think she– I think she should be sent to the box, ‘cause she, she–

Jones: Okay. Are you going to get your ass together and get this shit– Now you got to stay on there till you do. You can’t be nasty, you can’t be smart-ass, you can’t say that LA counselors lied on Garnett. He isn’t saying so!

Thompson: (sighs)

Jones: Did they lie on you, Garnett?

Garnett Johnson: No. Everything that was, that happened–

Jones: Tell her, tell her, tell her what? LA counselors what?

Garnett: LA counselors, every time I went to counselors, it was my own fault, I was the one that was fucking up, no one was blaming anything on me or nothing. So I don’t know where you got that shit from. And you [tape glitch] to uphold me and everything I– I did bad, you always uphold me in it.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: ‘Cause she wants you to uphold her and her bad.

Garnett Johnson: True, that’s true, Dad.

Jones: And she got fucked over now, you’ll see how it work. If you people– where your mothers and uh, grandmothers have indulged you, if you turn on ‘em, you’ll see how much they really– and tell them and make them line up and show them their faults, you’ll see how much they uphold you. It’s just a cover– C-Y-A: Cover your ass– Yes.

Female: Mom, you used to call Garnett was like he was, one night he told you, he said, “you’s not helping me at all, say you ought to talk against me some time and not talk up for me,” and I couldn’t help but cry ‘cause it– he was telling the truth.

Jones: (Chews ice) Are you gonna get on that ass and straighten up– you gonna straighten up, Vennie?

Thompson: Yes, sir, I is–

Jones: Okay, well, get on that, get on that Learning and straighten up. And all you seniors quit thinking your nasty ass attitude is gonna keep you off Learning. She’s been on– going on a third day now. (Pause) Now take note, some of you contrary ones that think that your age is going to keep you off– (reading) Barbara Walker– uh, that’s it, she’s in the box. (Pause) Jair Baker reported Vincent for trying to get Penny back on Learning. What’s that– what’re you talking about? Vincent Lopez, back on scrub boards is checking throughout the day– Joe Beam, who’s writing up daily reports on Vincent. Vincent refused to tell Penny the second time she asked what Willie Malone told him yesterday about taking one person at a time. Vincent has been kiss-assing up to Penny and other supervisors to look good, but bragging to Jair that he is manipulating Penny, and he asked Jair if he wanted Penny back on Learning Crew. Oh, shit on this–

Lopez: Dad, when we was, when me and Jair was scrubbin’ clothes back there, me and Jair was talking about, Jair was telling me how he wanted to get off, he wanted– he was going to write you a letter and tell you this and stuff, he said– and we was both talking negative about Penny, and uh, so, so like, like I was doing real good with Penny and everything. And– and you know and every little thing someone did, she’d try to get me to write ‘em up, and you know now that I’m messing up, she’s getting Jair, you know it’s just a thing that she’s doing, you know, she’s real paranoid and everything.

Jones: Okay, tell me this, my young man. Also reported that when he was uh, very sick, uh, Tom Partak who’s changing his name to Tom Smith, who doesn’t want to go back to St– to the States now, never wants to go back, he said, that’s a breakthrough for him, he was sick and diseased with it.

Crowd: Brief applause.

Jones: Why did you ask him if– if he hated Dad? Tom thinks he was pumping him to try to get something on him. Tom was very happy with Cleave [Swinney], doesn’t want to go back to the United States at all now, wants to change his name to Tom Smith. Why?

Lopez: That was a– that was a long time ago when we was in the bush, Dad, when he– he– he asked me, he said, what– he– he said, what’re– since you– since you always get in trouble, he said, l– let me ask you this question, he said uh, he said, “If I keep on doing this and saying I want to go back, what do you think they’ll do to me?” and we was talking, uh– I– and I asked him, I said, “Do you like–” said, “You hate Dad, huh?” and he said– and he didn’t answer me and I said, “Why don’t you just come on and answer me?” and he– he wouldn’t answer me.

Jones: How long ago was this?

Lopez: This was around uh, it was a wh– I don’t remember wh– It was a while back when I was in the bush with R–

Jones: Tom Smith? How long ago was this, Tom?

Partak: Oh, it was at least a month.

Jones: What in the hell are we dragging something up a month?

Male: Who wrote it up, who wrote it up?

Penny: I didn’t know when it was, Dad, I’m sorry–

Jones: Oh, you did too.

Penny: I’m sorry.

Female: Then stop–

Jones: You– You must– You– Goddamnit, you must’ve known it was uh– Uh– You had to know that, if he told you– When did he tell you?

Penny: Uh, he told me today, Dad.

Jones: Oh, he told you today.

Penny: He told me today, Dad. Tom told me today.

Jones: I see–

Lopez: See, this, this is what I feel. She’s– she goes– like when– she’s scared of me, you know, she thinks I can intimidate her and everything. So you know, like, like one time, like she, like I was doing good, and she said uh, “Well, Vincent,” she said, like, “Tom said I could criticize–”

Jones: You know you’re not another Willie Malone, though? If you get on our side, goddamnit, you could help the George Jacksons and the Che Guevaras who you look like.

Marceline Jones: Did you say you could manipulate Penny?

Lopez: Yes, Mother, I said that.

Jair Baker: Uh, uh– And he uh– he also said– Vincent was telling me, every time he uh, gets his way out of a situation, I was saying, “Vincent, what are you going to do when you get off of Penny’s crew,” and I said, “You’re gonna be right back in the same trouble, you gonna– you fooling everybody, you just cheating yourself, and when you get (clears throat) and when you get off– and when you get off– when you get off Penny, you just gonna do something wrong and come back again,” and he said, “No, I can fool people, Jair, uh, I won’t get caught this time.” And about, I– me– I have–

Jones: That’s one thing he can’t do, because he gets caught all the time.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Lopez: Uh, Dad, when we was back– That’s true, I did say that, but we– we was, he was talking negative to me too, and uh, about– Okay, that’s true, that’s true–

Jones: So, what was he saying, what was he saying?

Lopez: He, he– like he said, uh– He, he s– Like he said, uh–

Crowd: (Murmurs)

Jones: Shush, shush, shush, shush, shush, shush.

Lopez: Like he, you know– We was just both wrong, we– we shouldn’t’ve been talking negative, we was talkin’ about–

Jones: What was he saying? Now, don’t talk about sell-out, it’s not sell-out and uh, y– you’re shutting up because you’re looking at your elder brother. Now, don’t, y– It is proper to tell, in a communist society, what is wrong, whatever your motivation.

Stephan Jones: Only reason I said it is because they both do this shit. I could see it if it was at somebody that was, you know, at least trying to tell a lie, but these fuckers will talk negative, and he’ll turn Vincent in to get off the crew and he’ll do vice versa–

Male: Oh, shut up!

Jones: I want to hear what he said, I want to hear what he said.

Lopez: Like he said at one time, I said, “Man, we’re gonna have to get some– some– some extra chicken,” he said, “Yeah, that’s true, because, you know, it ain’t equal, like one time I went up there, I didn’t get nothing but a small piece,” he said that when he– when they pass out chicken, he said, “It ain’t equal.” I said, well, you know, and– and then uh, h– so that was over with and then, then he said– He was just talking about, you know, Penny’s just using me, because I was writing Jair up, she had me writin’ Jair up. And she’s– and he was trying to get me to stop writing on, he said, “Well, she’s just using you and stuff.” So, you know–

Jair: That’s not true, Dad. What happened was, I was– I– I wrote you a note, and I was saying– I was asking you, could I move out of Dorm One ‘cause I– I– I– I felt, I felt–

Jones: Oh goddamn, there’s such, mon– much better things to be doing than this shit.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Voice in Crowd: Thank you, Dad!

Jones: This is outrageous. I can’t believe I’ve been doing this all my goddamn miserable life. I gave up seven and a half million dollars to sit in this shit! Called a gangster all over the goddamn country, and I’da been hailed if I’da give in to ‘em. (Pause)

[Shortwave radio talk in background]

Lopez: Uh, he– he did say that, Dad, and you know, we was, I was comple– I was wrong, I shouldna been talking negative to him and– and uh, like– like, one day, like, one day I was– I was, uh, like, I– I had been doing good for around three or four days and– and Tom said I could criticize Penny, and so I did, and she said– she– she got all upset, you know, she sai– “You’re,” she said, “You’re just trying to intimidate.” I said, “No I’m not, I’m just, you know, just trying to tell you how I feel,” and she said, “Well, I don’t care if you’re doing good for three days,” she said, “I’ll– I’ll put you on the scrub board,” and I went and told Tom, you know, and she got scared, I know she did, and she said, “Well, let’s– let’s just talk about our problems,” you know, after I told Tom, she said, “Let’s just talk about our problems and relate to each other,” like, like– you know she, like, like, when we was up at the tent yesterday, I was writing a letter to you about, about–

Jones: Oh, Jesus Christ. Can somebody put an end to this?

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: I’m sick of this, I’m sick of it, I’m sick tonight of it, I’m sick of it. I’ve suffered all night long, and there’s no mercy in this place.

Stephan Jones: That’s right. That’s right. You stay on the crew, I don’t care how long you stay on the crew, because I talked to your ass and you still do the same shit with Jair, talking negative and shit. Penny, maybe you ought to work on your shit, because you– you– you– God! You’re– you’re bad as these guys half the time! You ask him why he’s hostile, he tells you, then you come and talk to me because he told you why he was hostile. You’re just– Goddamn, you’re like a fuckin’ kid. You’re the same manipulatin’ sonofabitch I– I knew in the first fucking place, and you just, you just cut it out and you stay on the goddamn crew too. I– It’s– it’s ended, excuse me. You sit down. Thank you. Salute me, or I’ll break your neck.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Jones: Now you goddamn miserable people in the pharmaceutical department. They got medicines, I pay the cost, thousands of dollars to bring it across the sea, and you won’t take the goddamn medicines. Now you tell me why in the hell you didn’t. (Reading) Missed medications frequently l– and today: Lena Benton. Gloria Griffith [aka Gloria Warren]. Kathy Jackson. Marg– Margaret James, four times. Tinetra Johnson. Billy Jones, three days. Johnny Jones. Fannie Jordan. Lydia Morgan [aka Lydia Atkins], two days. Callie Mitchell. Bea Orsot. Rosa Peterson. Kay Nelson. Gloria Rosa has a– anemia and does not pick up iron three times a day. Vennie Thompson. Janice Warren – oh, son of a bitch – Eyvonne James. Leon A– Le– Liane Amos [aka Liane Harris]. Gene Chaikin. Elaine Backmon [aka Viola Elaine Backmon]. Rene McMurry [aka Deidre Rene McMurry]– These people should be given a warning, they have been s– uh, several announcements, several uh, that’s service times to not miss medications, ‘cause Dad spends thousands of dollars for our health care. And you are wasting money and people’s lives by not taking medications as ordered.

Female: I have never missed my medication–

Jones: The money–

Crowd: (Reacts)

Male: Shut up! Shut up!

Female: You didn’t take your medicine, that’s all there is to it!

Male: You all get a warning, that’s it–

Jones: I– I get– provide it for you, and it costs like hell. Why do you people do this?

Brown: In my case, it’s– it’s laziness, Dad, and I’ll– I’ll take my medicine from this point out.

Bea Orsot: I’m supposed to miss five days, I’m supposed to miss my hormones five days, and that’s why I’ve been off for five days.

Crowd: (Reacts)

Male: You missed your medicine, you missed your medicine!

Female: But I missed it–

Billy Jones: I’ll start taking my medicine too on time.

Scattered in crowd: Thank you, Dad. (Pause)

[Shortwave radio talk in background]

Jones: Kay Rosa’s doing fine on her job, good attitude, Ollie [Smith] says she had really– does really well in the kitchen. And that’s good, Kay. We’re very happy to get that piece of news. Shift, please. I can’t see.

Crowd: (Stirs)

Jones: I can’t see. I just can’t see, that’s all.

Stephan: Somebody get up here. Schacht? Larry, he can’t see.

(Tape silence for several moments, except for radio interference)

Crowd: (Stirs)

Brown: This is uh, Praises: Uh, Armella Tardy, on spare time worked very hard to plant flowers in front of, uh– in back of Dorm Three, is helpful and cooperative on her, uh, job in the nursery. Uh, Novella Sneed, garlic crew supervisor wants to praise her. Ethel Belle, garlic s– crew supervisor wants to praise her also. L.V. McKinnis, praised for his good work on the janitorial staff. Uh, Georgia Catney, very good worker, uh, Lee– Leola Morehead, very good worker. Mary Walker, volunteered to help clean the tables. Uh, Erma Winfrey, doing very good uh, job cleaning the tables. Mike Lund [aka Michael Rozynko], Ben Barnett [Barrett], Earnest Jones, praised for the w– work they did in the aluminum house. Aaron Hendricks, Steve [Stephan] Jones, Al Touchette, Clifford Gieg, Emmett Griffith, Stan Gieg, Mark Cordell, Mike Lund, Lew Jones, Johnny Jones, Lew Jones Jr. [Jim Jones Jr.] and Larry Jones, uh, uh, they offloaded, oh and David George, all helped unload the tractor at the aluminum warehouse. April Klingman has made a great improvement in her behavior, has no more fits and is cooperative at home. Tad Jensen [aka Tad Schroeder], attitude has improved, is cooperative with supervisors. Randy Cordell [Randy Carroll] has shown great improvement, hardly throws fits anymore and is cooperative. Uh, Dante Carroll used to cry at the drop of a hat but now he doesn’t. Michael Felton, doing well, is cooperative, hardly throws fits anymore. Lisa Winston [aka Alizzia Winston] uh, did not cry today when she got her sores treated. Ronnie Berryman deserves praise, he has shown a lot of sensitivity and warmth toward the children. There is a– there are very few men that will become involved with early child education. JoAnn Johnson [aka Willa JoAnn Johnson], a very good houseparent and teacher. Ollie Smith, very good with children, shown a lot of sensitivity uh, to their needs. (Pause) Uh, Willie Graham is a senior member of the preschool staff, and she never lets down. Mary Ford has done wonders with Raymond McKnight since, uh, she has become his house mother. Jeff Smith earned the most stars for th– uh, this week in elementary school. Shan Anderson [aka Shantell Anderson] earned the most stars for this week in class. Tyrone Cartmell [aka Tyrinia Tyrone Williams] has made the most improvement in attitude and cooperation–

Jones: That’s amazing, that’s amazing.

Male: Dad says that’s amazing. And the last one: Romaldo Hicks, Tracy Parks, Stephanie Swaney, worked very good at the chickery on Sunday.

Jones: One thing that’s bothering me–

Male: Microphone!

Jones: One thing that’s bothering me. Now, I hear Larry Jones– I hear Larry Jones is uh, raise– raises a real, uh, uh, worker there and I heard uh, some of these people manipulate their children to beat hell, but I’ve, uh, uh, Rita Lenin [aka Rita Tupper] point– pointed out something that was bothering me, because he’s uh, very uh, precious and I hear he made a good work report. Rita was saying that he’s unhappy over where his– over his brothers, what’s going to happen to them. Larry, do you want to talk about this? ‘Cause– Because this bothers me. (Pause) Are you happy here, son, are you worried about anything?

Brown: He’s– he’s coming? Well, let’s come quickly please.

Jones: In reference to the other question, there been no issue Rita made over that, that’s just uh, nothing to even worry about, there been no issue, when one party may have made it, but I don’t know anything else. (Pause) What the hell’s the difference anyway. Fuck the world.

Voice in background: That’s right.

Jones: Uh, what son is, what is, uh, what is it, uh, that you’re worrying about?

Larry Jones: I ain’t worried about it anymore, after the last–

Jones: I’m– I’m not scolding you, darling, I’m– I’m just interested in you. Because Stephan likes you, and he thinks that you’re doing a good job. You seem happy?

Larry Jones: Yeah.

Jones: But you don’t go to s– you don’t– do you ever watch movies at all, honey?

Larry Jones: Not really–

Jones: Don’t you like ‘em?

Larry Jones: No, I just don’t like to watch ‘em.

Jones: Well, what is it about it that you don’t like to watch? It’s okay, it’s okay, I was just interested.

Larry Jones: I usually get bored, so I just don’t watch ‘em.

Jones: Well, I agree, I agree with that, I do too. Did you like The Day of the Jackal?

Larry Jones: Mm-mmm [No].

Jones: Hmm?

Larry Jones: Not really.

Jones: Why not?

Larry Jones: Uhhh.

Jones: Didn’t you find that fascinating, him trying to go kill that dictator? (Pause)

Larry Jones: Yeah.

Jones: Did you watch it all the way through, or did you ever know, did you watch it all the way through– Did you understand it?

Larry Jones: Not really.

Jones: You do any reading, hon?

Larry Jones: No. (whispering, but right into the microphone) Goddamn.

Jones: You think that, maybe that’s why you get bored then, you don’t understand some of the things that was happening, was that it?

Larry Jones: I think so. Yeah.

Jones: Uh, Tell ‘em, uh, what was the movie about? (Pause) Day of Jackal.

Larry Jones: I didn’t understand it, really.

Jones: You didn’t at all? (Pause) Well, it’s a difficult plot. I wonder how many children didn’t understand it. How many children didn’t understand Day of Jackal?

Brown: C’mon, hold your hands up. How many people didn’t understand The Day of the Jackal? Children.

Jones: You teachers ought to be teaching ‘em, you ought to be teaching ‘em.

Female: (Unintelligible)

Male: Elementary?

Jones: Elementary? They ought to be taught, that ought to be taught, that’s a complicated movie. Ought to be told how the passport, how they forge a passport, and how– the identities, they lose it, the first part of the movie. Did you see Children of the Damned, Larry?

Larry Jones: Uh, not the whole thing.

Jones: Why not, hon?

Larry Jones: ‘Cause I didn’t wanna.

Jones: Why not?

Larry Jones: Just want– no reason. (Pause)

Jones: Well, son, I believe you could’ve understood that, I believe you could if you’da looked at it.

Larry Jones: Yeah.

Jones: That showed young– that showed young people, young people– uh, uh, they were way advanced of adults, and they had all this concern for peace and justice. The only mistake they made was to kill themselves. They oughta used their power on the bastards around them. You ought to see that. (Pause) You– You say you’re happy here?

Larry Jones: Yes.

Jones: You– you must’ve given your mother some impression that you’re doing a lot of worrying.

Rita Tupper: Uh, the reason I came up with that, it’s been some time since he’s asked me, but–

Jones: Oh.

Tupper: He asked me if I thought his brothers would be coming, and he has made the statement that he was worried about them, uh, getting killed and about the– the two little children there. Uh, the reason I was concerned, he– he seemed awfully quiet, and I just, you know, I just didn’t know if that was still going through his–

Jones: Well, I’m not complaining about the observation you made, I think it’s uh– that’s why I’m picking it out, it’s one of those legitimate ones. What uh– what uh– why are you quiet, son?

Larry Jones: I don’t know. I don’t know what she’s talking about, being quiet.

Male: He hasn’t been quiet (Unintelligible word).

Jones: Hmm? You don’t know what she’s talking about? Hmm?

Larry Jones: No.

Jones: You teach him P.E. and he’s not quiet, huh?

Tupper: Maybe he’s just quiet around me. I don’t see him much, but when he c– if you ask him something, he just doesn’t say much, or he’ll come over if I’m working on letters and lay down and go to sleep and, uh–

Jones: Mmm-hmm [Yes].

Tupper: I– That’s just my observation when I’m around. I haven’t been around him that much, but I was just concerned that he was maybe keeping stuff inside or something.

Jones: I suspect he does, to some degree, but if he knows he’s doing it and– You still prefer, you’d– we– you’d prefer to be here whether they decide to come or not, would you?

Larry Jones: Yes.

Jones: You– You like Stephan? Is– He likes you.

Larry Jones: Yes.

Jones: You feel, you– you– things working out for– for you fair, fairly well?

Larry Jones: Yeah.

Jones: If you don’t like movies it’s– No, no, the end of the world’s not gonna come on that but I would try to understand some of them sometimes. And teachers should, tomorrow, uh, explain Children uh– Children of the Damned and The Day of the Jackal, right?

Voices in crowd: Right, right.

Jones: (yawning) Okay, you can stand up.

Male: Everybody stand.

Male: Come on, come on, quick.

Crowd: (Stirs. Voices discuss radio feedback and “two pages” with Jim Jones off mic)

Jones: I can’t read nothing, so– I can’t see nothing.

Male: These people must be admonished (unintelligible). People are ignorant about (unintelligible)

Male: Ida Albudy, we need you to– to unlock– unlock the, uh–

Jones: Patty, little Patty, everyone must be very friendly to Patty. And because they’ll– she’ll feel– all of these kids make this mistake, they feel–

Voice: Shh!

Jones: –dirty by something, some uh, other silly-ass kid who’s sexually insecure and wanting to cover for his own sexual, uh, problems, uh, so everybody show a lot of warmth to her, and I thought it was so sweet that Sister [Shirley] Baisy, our good bumper dancer was uh, doing that.

(Organ music plays in the background)

Jones: Uh, he patted her, and that I think that was so sweet of you, I– I was very touched, the black mother of the boy who had offended. And you should feel guilty, son, and change your life. You should change your life and realize how terrible it is, you– you hear what I’m saying? How terrible it is to do a thing like that to a little girl. And you better work on it. You don’t a– you don’t act to me like you’re moved enough by that. How what– what you do to scar a child. (Pause) (unintelligible) (Pause) I really can’t make the observation, what’s his face doing?

Male: (Unintelligible) he has his hand up.

Jones: Hmm? I see his hand, I can’t see his f– eyes. How do you feel about it now? (Pause) We redo all the agricultural thing, with the follow-ups. Those– The farm analysts, will you take the follow-ups? I don’t think we did it. Will you do it before we leave? Where were– Where is the thing? Where is the thing with the farm? What’re you going to say, son?

Baisy: Say, I’d– I’d like to apologize to you and the family for my stupidity, and I’ll straighten it up.

Female: What are you going to do about Patty?

Baisy: Yeah. I’m sorry, Patty.

Voice: (Unintelligible about a truck)

Jones: Well, the truck is brought out from Georgetown, where it’s leaving that truck in when the– when the point is, can’t we get that boy, that young man– that, there, is it Ricky, Ricky would be a good, uh, is that what this says? When will the tr– what is it?

Male: It says, “When will the truck be brought out from Georgetown?”

Jones: When will the truck be brought out from Georgetown? That truck’s not to be brought out from Georgetown, it was supposed to be making money. Why aren’t they doing something with him?

Male: The dump truck was to be brought to town. The other one was to be brought out and that’s not the dump truck.

Jones: The dump truck was to be brought here, right?

Male: That– That doesn’t make sense–

Jones: What’s that?

Brown: The flatbed should be left in Georgetown. The dump truck should be here. Right?

Charlie Touchette: The dump truck’s here and the dump truck is coming in Georgetown, just– just like all of our (Unintelligible word, sounds like “Defenders”) still got an eighteen-inch deep bed. It can be a dump, or it can– can haul freight in it, either one. It makes more sense to have a more personal truck in there, ‘cause you got a dump here. Why have two dumps here?

Jones: What is he talking about now? I– I’m not– I’m not the best coordination here.

Male: He says, he says– They were gonna leave the flat– the flatbed in town and bring the dump truck out. Charles [Touchette] says we already have a dump truck, and it would be better to have a dump truck in town, because it’s more versatile and you can make money loading, hauling dirt, or at the same time loading cargo.

Jones: Well, can’t they– in the meantime ‘til that one comes here, ‘til then, then we can bring the flatbed out here, can’t we in the meantime use uh– What about that young man? Could he not get– get licensed so he could do something, so he could make some money with that damn truck?

Brown: Well, the only thing is his age might be for insurance, Dad, that’s the only thing.

Jones: Well we– I want someone to get this thing. There’s somebody in there can do something with it.

Brown: All right.

Jones: We got to bring Bruce back. It– No– no use to think about him. Who else is in there?

Female: Ujara’s (unintelligible)

Jones: Ujara’s there for the time being. That wouldn’t be a bad idea.

Male: Right, make–

Jones: Let’s get Ujara [Don Sly].

Brown: (Unintelligible beginning) to the walk-in cooler should again be discussed in the public forum.

Jones: Walk-in f– cooler, we don’t need a walk-in foo– koo– talk about it, we got one back there that should be brought, shouldn’t we? What does– What does he want us to talk–

Brown: It says, (Unintelligible word), a walk-in freezer cooler should, uh, again be discussed in public forum.

Jones: Why?

Brown: Whoever wrote this up, say something please?

Male: Put ‘em together now, it’s been sitting up there useless.

Female: Mike Touchette was the one that addressed it in the analysts’, he thought we should possibly consider, uh, getting our cooler together again, we had, uh, we–

Jones: Can you get it– can you put it together?

Male Voice off mic: Plywood, we need plywood for it.

Jones: Need what?

Male Voices: Plywood, we need plywood.

Jones: What about some of the plywood we got. Is it all used?

Male: It’s all used. The plywood that came in the last set of crates is all used. We’ll have to wait until– to see what the– how much plywood comes in in the next set of crates.

Jones: Well, it seems like a freezer’s in order, so that– they– they’re going through the shipment today. Any more stuff on there?

Brown: Uh, no, that’s it. (unintelligible word)

Touchette: To build– to build that walk-in cooler and freezer, it’s gonna take a building to put it in, it’s a big unit. Jack Beam was saying there’s, there’s one (unintelligible) down on the boat if we get the boat.

Jones: If we get the boat. What is– What is this about the– what’s– what’s wrong with this unit, we can’t–

(Tape edit)

End of tape.

Tape originally posted March 2010