Annotated Transcript Q1016

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Jones: (End of song) You see what I’m doing? Hmm? See, I’m loving you. ‘Cause I see, I love you. I see the hope and the future in you. That’s what I’m doing when I sing it to you:

I promise to love you forever
I know you’re the strength of my love
And since I have made this endeavor
You take me through with you somehow.
You can bet I will.

Love you, love you
I’ll be loving you
Love you— forever faithful and true
Daytime and nighttime, all the year through
I’ll just keep right on loving you.

I promise to love you forever, (calls out) Phillip,
I know you’re the strength of my love
And since I have made this endeavor
You take me through with you somehow.
Yes, love you, love you
I’ll be loving you
Faithful forever, be faithful and true
Daytime and nighttime, and all the year through
I’ll just keep right on loving you.

Once again,I promise to love,
Think of somebody now, think of somebody
—with the strength of my love

And since I have made this endeavor
You take me through with you somehow.
Oh yes I will

Love you, love you
I’ll be loving you
Faithful forever, be faithful and true
Daytime and nighttime, all the day through
I’ll just keep right on loving you.

Yes, I promise to love God forever,
I know you’re the strength of my love
And since I have made this endeavor
You take me through with you somehow.

Love you, love you
I’ll be loving you
Faithful forever, be faithful and true
Daytime and nighttime, and all the year through
I’ll just keep right on loving you.

Thank you. Well, we had two choruses, that’s good. Sometimes we have to make them profitable in this way, too, this is a part of it, you can’t learn music and inspiration on other uh, worship nights. We may continue. Hmm? Hmm? Continue as you feel, if you— if someone wants to ex— exercise their faith for another, just three or four minutes by saying some admonition, do so.

Voice in crowd: (speaking in monotone tongues for several seconds) God has come. Love has come, in other man. And the light has come in other man. True apostolic (unintelligible word— sound like “charity”) exists.

Several people shout.

Jones: Shh!

Man in crowd: — upon this earth. It has come. And it is coming. And God has (unintelligible)

Jones: Shh!

Man in crowd: Jim Jones has come to bring socialism to the United States of America. Hallelujah, hallelujah hallelujah!

Many people shout.

Jones: It’s beautiful. It’s beautiful. I would add one thing to it. Christian socialism. That’s where you take them, that stage. You take them stage by stage. Or apostolic Christian socialism. Very beautiful.

We promise to love it forever
I know it’s the strength of my vow
And since I have made this endeavor
You take me through with you somehow.

Love you, love you
I’ll be loving you

Yes. (rest of congregation continues to sing chorus)

Thank you. Anyone else with an expression. Want to make expression? Go ahead.

Man in congregation: Behold, I have said unto thee. Give up thy capitalist ways. I have returned with my power and glory to build a new Jerusalem. Hallelujah (several echo.)

Jones: Yes. To build a new heaven and new earth would probably be more sound theology (Reference to Revelation 3, esp. Rev. 3:12).

Woman witnesses in tongues: —had all things in common, and distributed to these, as they had these, (unintelligible word) had this, here, true Christian socialism, here now on earth. Ah hallelujah. (several echo.)

Jones: You’ll need to preface these things with “The Lord hath declared,” or “The Spirit speaketh,” expressly to the church, something of this nature, to give an endorsement. But now qualify your thoughts in the days ahead with knowledge. Get some knowledge in there. Go through these scriptural concordances and find them, blue— beautiful quotes that you can push it in between a scriptural phrase, and it’ll be of great help in building the ideal. One voice will reach someone where another one won’t. One testimony will open a door, and no one else could succeed. My voice might be associated with its tenor, uh, with a— with a type of voice that has been ah, reflecting negation to the person. Well, they shut you off. Or my s— my prototype, my physique might be of a negative nature to someone. But some voice out of the great anonymity of the collective whole speaks, opens the door, when I’ve not been able to open the door. But we have to get knowledge there. So let’s increase it with knowledge. I’m going to expect more knowledge at next meeting. Hmm?

Crowd reacts.

Jones: More knowledge. Anyone else? I like uh, sweet love’s tongues, and listen to it, sweet love’s speak— speak forth.

Woman speaks in tongues: The Lord God is (unintelligible word). Behold, the people his word. Yeah, he is—

Jones: Umm-hmm. Yes. Now, with a message like that, to lengthen it a little bit. If someone even picks on her tongue— she has a beautiful tongue— gift, if someone then gives the admon— the prophetic uh, interpretation, because it’s a language, almost, her, it’s just as, someplace deep in the ve— very recesses of her consciousness. I would even— I wouldn’t make a stake on it that it’s a language that she’s used at some, at some stage, in her unfoldment, in some prior life. (Pause) But we’re not here to theorize about the supernatural meaning of it anyway, we’re here to utilize it for good.

Several voices: Yeah.

Jones: Beautiful.

Man in crowd: Might I suggest—

Jones: Mmm-hmm. You might.

Man in crowd: Four or five— four or five words, a half dozen words, half a dozen words in tongues, (Pause) and six dozen words in interpretation do not relate—

Jones: No.

Man in crowd: —in terms of (Unintelligible word)

Jones: You need to parallel. And you have to, you have to make your tongues comparable to the— I mean the sounds should be comparable. Unintelligible? Unintelligible sounds should be equivalent time.

Man in crowd: That’s right. You go thirty seconds, you should go thirty seconds (unintelligible phrase)

Jones: Yes. True. Work on that. Yes, Simon?

Simon: (tongues)

Jones: Mmm. That’s good.

Simon: I say, Behold. The people as one. And now, they have all one language. (Witnessing unintelligible) The loving shall be reprieved (feedback distorts) — our Lord God, Jim Jones, our socialist redeemer has things for us to do. We shall accomplish. (Unintelligible word)

Jones: Bless you. Bless you.

Crowd reacts, applauds.

Jones: I would say that’s very direct. I would say that’s very direct. And to you that don’t understand God in the body, you’ll just have to talk to brother over there, so he will understand God the body. He’s caught in it, so you’re gonna have to understand it, in a way, he’s out of it, he’s in it, so you’re gonna have to understand it. (Pause) God is the same today, yesterday and forever. He said I am the same. Christ is the same. Now, somebody gonna have to talk to him, ‘cause he’s been in— exposed here, way, wisely or unwisely, he has been. It’s not mine to uh, direct or police, but it is thine to do that and be trick— quick to instruct. If one understand the error of Scriptures, then you can open them to new truth. And somebody’s going to have to do some work in that area. All right, now. Peace. On with the business of building character. If God is love, then (feedback). Whatever you folk are doing here, if God is love, then certainly there is no question that this is the most God force, or Godenic power in universe. ‘Cause there’s no place more loving, more honest, more true— Now some of you are going to have to listen to me, because you’re going to have to do some interpreting over there. (Pause) I don’t know how we get into these binds where people have no preparation, and we’re— we’re caught in it, so we’re gonna have to get with it and get the instructions across, and afterwards, gave a gathering. Now if God is love, then nobody can go wrong in this atmosphere. ‘Cause this is the most loving place — not satisfied where we are — but it’s the most loving place. We look after children when they’re little, till they leave this world. We take care of people from the cradle (Pause) and we’ve avoided the grave. And that makes us even more God, by scriptural commandments, because we stopping death. Talk about God in the collective sense, if you can’t take it in the personal sense. So we are stopping death, we are stopping social diseases, all the injustices to this family, we resolve. As far as lies within us, we do it. And certainly, though we’re not satisfied with our performance, no group — none of these so-called Christians — come anyway near what we’re doing. And if the— If they were correct, which is ridiculous, because that Scripture about the Antichrist in Matthew 25— You got to know Scripture, folks. There’s no substitute for some of this. When they’ll come at you with the twenty-fourth chapter Matthew, say there’ll be lo— false Christ, lo here and lo there, and they will do these things and that and so forth, but that same chapter says that this generation shall not pass away till all these things be fulfilled (Matthew 24:23-24. “Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect;” Matthew 24:34, “Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.”). You’ve gotta know that, ‘cause somebody’s gonna stymie you. What does it mean, a generation is 20 years, that was speaking to that time zone, right there. It had nothing to do with 1972.

Man: So true.

Jones: But, in the first place, if it did. When the Antichrist can be better than the followers of Christ, you got a weak Jesus, honey.

Laughter. Amen.

Man: That’s right.

Jones: He’s mighty weak. When those that they call the anti-Jesus people are sweeter, lovinger— more loving, more kind, more holy, more good, more gentle, more peaceful — certainly more peaceful — more sharing— when the anti-Jesus people are more loving and sharing and kind and good than the Jesus people, you better look at your Jesus. He is indeed weak.

Man: So true.

Jones: I’m talking from your frame of reference. We know where Jesus is.

Crowd: Yeah.

Jones: If it didn’t sound like Bagadosha, I’d say exactly where he is. But I don’t care whether someone knows where he is, as long as they have the Spirit of Jesus. That’s the difference between me and you Christians. I don’t care where the spirit is, as long as it’s there. You Christians have gotta say— (Pause) you gotta believe that He’s this, that and the other thing. He’s a healer, baptizer, gonna come again in a Rapture, gonna send certain people don’t dress right and don’t look right to hell and others to heaven. You say, unless you believe that, no good what kind of spirit you got. I say, as long as you’re healing the people, as Jesus said, and helping the people, as Jesus said, you’re not against us, you’re on our part. I say, that I’ll draw a circle and take you people in, while you draw a circle and cut us out as something to flout, shun, and dis— and to avoid. So I— I— I don’t uh, care whether you know where Jesus is, I know where he’s sitting, I know where he’s standing, I know where he’s breathing. But it don’t make any difference to me whether you do or not. If you have the spirit of Jesus, I will accept you, whether you accept me or not. Now that’s a bigger love than the love you’ve come out of. That’s a bigger love than your church entity affords. ‘Cause your love is conditional. You say, I love you, if you love the same doctrines that I love. You gotta believe the same scriptures that I believe. If you don’t, I don’t even speak to you. Don’t tell me that’s not what you believe, because that’s what you do believe. That’s what you’ve been taught to believe. Don’t bid Godspeed to anybody that don’t agree with your little ol’ doctrines. (Pause) (To self) Oh, it’s hopeless anyway. But try it. (Short laugh) Can’t get people’s attention long enough yet, you have to hit ‘em in the ass with a big stick.

Few laughs.

Jones:  (Forced laughter, loud) Ha ha ha ha, I did it. I did it.

More laughter.

Jones: I talk in religion, didn’t get nobody’s attention. I said, I hit somebody in the ass with a big stick, and they listen.


Jones: That’s why sometimes you have to speak that way, to get people’s attention. You can pray and you can peal and you can sing, and you won’t get their attention. (Pause) (High laughter) It’s sweet. (Laughter) (Off mike) I look at you, and I get somebody else’s attention. I got somebody looking at us. See, if they’ll look at me, and look at us a while, maybe they’ll hear that they’re all wet. You see? If they’ll look at you and me, maybe I’ll get their attention. I’m not even talking to her, I just look at her, ‘cause I got you to look now, looking at me, and maybe you’ll hear me say, that you’re all wet. You been— you been in (Slows for emphasis) error. You’ve been misinformed. You’ve been misused. You’ve been mis-used. (Pause) So sweet. (Pause) But you can’t tell me who Jesus’ grandfather is, then you better listen to somebody that’s practicing love. And you don’t know who Jesus’s grandfather is — Matthew 1:16 and Luke 3:23 tells you two different things. Both Matthew 1:16 and Luke 3:23 tell you something different about his great-grandfather (Matthew 1:15-16 “…Matthan begat Jacob; And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ”; Luke 3:23-24, “And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli, Which was the son of Matthat.”). And both chapters disagree as to how many granddaddies he has, as they trace him back to that important Abraham, the Melchezedek Order [Genesis 14:18-20, Psalm 110:4, Hebrews 5:5-9]. Can’t even agree. Fifteen more granddaddies. Now if you don’t know how many granddaddies Jesus had, you’re sad. (Pause) I better look at you again, ‘cause I ain’t getting their attention.

One person laughs.

Jones: Now I got their attention. (Pause) It’s true. I don’t need to cuss, I never have needed to cuss, but if I get you to wake up by cussing, I’ll cuss till you wake up. (Pause) (Cadence speech) If speaking sweet nothing — and that what you been hearing — lot of Hallelujah gibberish and Glory to God gibberish that doesn’t say a thing. Your sweet talk, while you just go on hungering, go on without love, go on in your loneliness, go on in your uncomfortable state, no place to live, no place to take you in, no one to give a damn whether you live or die. Sweet talking you all the way out of your money. Sweet talking you, in their fine garb and robes. Sweet talking you, as they drive around in their Cadillacs. Sweet talking you, telling you, you’re gonna go to heaven, and you don’t know whether there’s any heaven, because they don’t look like they’re dressed up for heaven, they look like they’re dressed up to go out on the town. The preacher look like they’re dressed up to go out and shack up with somebody. Ha ha, that woke you up. (Pause) Look like they’re dressed up to go every place but heaven. Why, if you’re getting ready to go to heaven, you put on a robe. (Pause) Not going to take anything with you, just— might as well go naked. If you’re holy. ‘Cause everything will be holy anyway, you’ll be like you were in the first Eden, you’ll be k— in the consciousness of Adam and Eve, you won’t know any sin, (unintelligible phrase), you look at a cock, and it’ll look like a— it’ll look like an, an emerald on a crown. Cock will look like a gem, and a breast will look like— just look like one— maybe the breast of an angel, and that’s true. Aren’t you glad?

Crowd responds.

Jones: (High laughter) So you be back there naked, ready to go to heaven. The only reason preacher don’t get naked is because they got too little to show, that’s why they don’t get naked. (Pause) (Spoken as aside) We’re still with you. (Minister’s tone) They can make themselves look more seductive with their fine clothes, but inside those fine clothes, they got those old wrinkles from eating the fat of the land while the people starve. Eating too much meat—grease, while the people aren’t even getting chitterlings. They don’t want to go naked, they— not because they’re holy, they’d like to go naked, a— if it— if it’s in the right atmosphere. But (unintelligible word) up there trying to lure the saints, ‘cause they want to look good, to lure the saints. (Pause) Now I don’t know how much truth I’ve taught, but you know what I’ve achieved? The people here tonight didn’t know anything are listening for the first time. All of the honest polemics and the nice lyrical phrases of the scripture didn’t cause any brother to listen, (Quiet voice) but now he listening, and he’s thinking. (Normal tone) He may not think just like us, because you don’t have to think just like us to be with us. But you gotta think!

Crowd reaction.

Jones: So, if everybody gettin’ ready to go to heaven like these churches say, they’d all be naked, instead of having Cadillacs. Or at least they’d have some rags, something that they don’t need, wouldn’t want to put much money in. If you’re gettin’ ready to take a trip, you wouldn’t want to invest in something you couldn’t take across an ocean. You sure wouldn’t buy a great big electrical refrigerator, if you were going to the jungle, where there was no electricity. You wouldn’t get a Cadillac if you were going to take a trip where there was no uh, Standard Oil, thank God. No Standard Oil or Union Oil or Atlantic Oil in heaven, thank God. In this socialist paradise I’m working for, there’ll be no such thing as that.

Crowd: Right.

Jones: So, you— you— if you’re going to go to heaven, gonna walk around on streets of gold and have wings, what you need with Cadillacs? All you need is just get your— just get your (Pause)

Woman in crowd give answer, unintelligible

Jones: You were listening that time, so I didn’t have to say it. (Pause) Yes, just clean yourself. Free.

Single voice: Amen. Amen.

Jones: (In full throat) Down to the skinny skin skin. So there nothing left hanging off. No flesh. Just free yourself. That’s what you do if you gettin’ ready to go to heaven. They don’t look like they’re free. Those dirty, lying, sons a hell. Those evil shyster preachers.

Crowd: Yeah.

Jones: If you’ll know what I’m talking about when you get through tonight, you’ll know whether you want to come back or not, I’ll tell you that. (Pause) Dirty lowdown sons a hell. Hebrew called them sonsabitches. Jesus called them sonsabitches, that’s what he called them. Said you’re sonsabitches. (Pause) Said you’re sonsabitches, that’s what you are. (Pause)

Man in crowd: Evil way.

Jones: Why do you listen to that stuff? Now either get with it. Now I’m— I’ll tell you. Ninety-six hours here is long enough. If you don’t know this is better than anything you been in, (low intense voice) hit the road.

Crowd: Cheers.

Jones: You don’t see that there’s more care here — nobody asked you any meal ticket here, nobody coi— when you come in their homes, say, how much money you got? Nobody asked you whether you got a dime. When I picked up older people all over this nation, I never said, how much money you got? Said, get on board, little children. We’re not going to wait for heaven, we’re going to go out in Redwood Valley and build heaven, by God. (Pause) I didn’t tell anybody wait for heaven. Didn’t tell them when they were in their misery, leave Mother Brown there languishing in want— with the old sores that were on her leg that wouldn’t heal, I didn’t say, Mother Brown, by and by. They’ll always— the last parting note— the evangelist says, the last meeting, well, keep the faith, honey, we’ll see you. If I don’t meet you again on this side, I’ll meet you over on the other side. I got your money now, I’m gonna hit the road, and you can go to hell, till we meet you over on the other side. (drags out last word) But Jim Jones don’t say, meet you over on the other side. He says, get off your ass, get on board, we’re going to the Promised Land.

Crowd: Cheers.

Jones: That’s the way it is. Come out and set you down, my people— my people— why do they do that, because they got such a nasty mouth God like I am. Why do you think they feed you? They didn’t make a practice of feeding people till I came along. They didn’t make it a practice of taking the people and not asking them how much money they had. They didn’t make it a practice of adopting babies and taking no thought for their race. Some of you forget that, too, ‘cause you, a lot of you were racistic ‘fore— afore you met me. You did see color, till you met your God on earth.

Man shouts from crowd, unintelligible.

Jones: Yes. (Pause) He was racistic when he was— before, when he was in Pentecost, now he’s one of my best troopers. Fought me in Pentecost, this minister over here, fought me when he had the Holy Ghost, what you call the Holy Ghost, fought me when he spoke in tongues, fought me — Jack Beam.

Scattered voices: That’s right.

Woman voice in crowd, unintelligible.

Jones: Now, you’ll want to hear what I’m saying. When he had that Pentecostal ghost, he was mean. This man was mean. He tried to go along with that bunch of thugs that was throwing me out of a church. And they literally did that. Locked the doors and everything else. Said you (unintelligible— probably supposed to be, “can’t bring”) any blacks here. And he wouldn’t come, when he was Pentecost. He wouldn’t come. He stood up with that blo— bunch of bored thugs, when he was Pentecost. He had to lose that old religion to be a loving man. He wasn’t a loving man until he lost that old religion.

Scattered voices: That’s right.

Jones: He had to lose it.

Scattered voices: That’s right.

Jones: Of course it’s right.

Man in crowd: Can you say Amen (unintelligible conclusion)?

Crowd: Yeah.

Tape cuts off for undetermined amount of time.

Jones: —(unintelligible when tape goes back on) Sister [Marceline] LeTourneau can say Amen, but I know how mean you were.

Man in crowd: That’s right.

Jones: I know how mean that dirty board was down in Laurel Street. I know how mean they were. I saw ‘em beat on one another.

Man in crowd: That’s right.

Jones: I saw ol’, uh, (Unintelligible name— sounds like “Daccus”) hit Price, and I saw that other old rascal—

Woman called unintelligible name from crowd.

Jones: No.

Man in crowd: Woodward.

Jones: Woodward. Woodard, get in a fight, and we held one, one had to hold the other. They had the Holy Ghost. (Pause) I’ve seen all those old church people, the ones that’ll— the ones that made every woman in Indianapolis, and left them with children, and no money, no finances, no support, run off, took off with the money, (contemptuous tone) the worst bunch were those church people. The best Pentecostals did the dirtiest, meanest, low-downest tricks of (draws out words) anybody I ever met.

Man in crowd: That’s right.

Jones: (Conversational) Now— I don’t know why I said all of that. I musta been trying to make a point, and I don’t know why I keep trying to make points, ‘cause most people like to believe lies. (Pause) They like to believe a lie and be damned, I guess. It’s uh, comforting. There’s some kind of comfort in it. Ah, I heard a word from one of our ladies that left in— (Pause) and Jewel said, I think, Jewel said, came over to me— to me over the phone, she said, there isn’t comfort in your religion. And I thought, that’s the truth. There’s no comfort in this ministry, of having to be a son of God in the earth. There’s no comfort in having to carry the world’s weight on your shoulders. There’s no particular comfort in knowing that you gotta work out your salvation, that there’s no heaven to fly to, there’s only heaven if you build one. Heaven’ll never come, till you make it on earth. (Pause) Well—

Man in crowd: Truth. No hiding place.

Jones: (Quiet tones) I— I— So much nonsense. This Bible has been so badly interpreted. You take it— you turn it anywhere you want to. I don’t care where you want to interpret it — I didn’t, uh— this is not supposed to be teaching night, but we got somebody that can be worthwhile to good, or they can not be. They can go away mad or glad. I just opened it up here, just uh, just throwed it up to any place. Timothy. First Epistle [discussion follows for balance of address, even as other biblical references made]. Paul, an apostle” — let me see, let’s see — “of Jesus Christ.” Now let’s get this down, break it down to simple terms. “Paul, an apostle of Jesus, the Anointed”— if you want to be more exact, the Anointed for this particular time. It comes from a word meaning “Anointed Now”.

Tape cuts into singing for two seconds, then back to this service.

Jones: —Now.” That’s 2000 years ago. “Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ, by the commandment of God, our Savior and Lord, the Anointed Christ which is our hope. Christ is our hope.” He brought to them their hope of doing something on earth. “Under Timothy, my own son in the faith” — that’s what we try to practice around here — people who are in the faith of, of what they had on Pentecost socialism, sharing. That’s our sons. Not who’s our blood tie, but who is one in the faith. “Timothy, my own son in the faith. Grace, mercy, peace from God, our Father, and Jesus Christ, our Good Shepherd.” Lord is Good Shepherd in the original. “As I besought thee to abide at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine.” Now what’s doctrine? Look it up in the— And I’m not— I haven’t had any advanced study of this, but I know this much: doctrine is way of life. I’m not going to take many verses, but any number of these verses will support our life, teaching anything you pick in this Bible will support us more than what you’ve been preaching. “No other doctrine, neither give heed to fables.” Fables are superstitious stories of the past. Now, hear this, brother. Fable is a superstitious story about a past. A legend, like, people walking on waters in the past, or coming from virgins, without a father, in the past, or multiplying bread instead of a multiplicity of spiritual law uh, a legend that comes out of it that is actual bread, or flying up in the sky. That’s a fable. You get what I’m talking about. Fables. “Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies.” (1 Timothy) (Pause) Jesus said, who he was born and where his heritage— What’s the difference? — you see, in other words, what Paul’s saying. Trying to trace who came from Melchezedek. Trying to trace where— who’s Abraham’s seed. Who is a Jew? What is a Jew? Romans 1 tells you what a Jew is. Circumcision of the heart (Romans 2:29, “But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.”). 

Man in crowd: So true.

Jones: There no such thing as the natural Jew in this consciousness. The Jew is one that lives a, a lifestyle characteristic that Jesus taught and exercised on the day of Pentecost when he left the earth through his disciples. Now, he says, what does these fables do? He says, “they minister questions” — and they surely do — “rather that godly edifying, which is in faith, so do.” Find something that’ll build godliness. What is God? Love. So find something that’ll get people to love one another. (Voice rises) Don’t talk about fables and genealogy. It’s crap. Fables about Noah in the ark (generally, Genesis, chapters 5 through 10), and Jonah in a whale (Jonah, chapters 1 and 2), and a devil in the hell, pitching coal on a fire. That’s a fable, a stupid, dumb fable that nobody would believe. Herb Caen said today in his paper — I thought a good one — he said they said got some doctor from Ohio that’s supposed to be the most electrifying preacher— the most electrifying speaker in the world today. He said, What’s electrifying, the asses over there saying, that anyone who doesn’t believe that Jesus Christ is the Lord and Personal Savior is going to hell and is stupid. I’m ma— I’m adding a phrase there, but th— this is— in other words, he’s stupid— he said, what is electrifying about that? In 1972, is this astounding, that some idiot will get up and say, that it— it— that this is electrifying, that unless (singsong voice) you accept Jesus Christ and the Virgin Birth, that you’re going to hell and you’re stupid. In other words, he said, He’s stupid. He’s certainly not electrifying. That’s stupid, to be preaching that in 1972. I guess, some of you don’t agree that he’d look funny.

More crowd reaction.

Jones: Now the end of the next verse — and I had no rehearsing of this at all, didn’t even— we don’t teach on Tuesday night. Now the end of the commandment is what? The end of the commandment — oh you stupid fools, you jackasses — look at you getting— now I got their attention, thank you.

Crowd: Laughter.

Jones: I’m trying to keep from cussing. So when I— I’m having a sense, if I look at you, somebody else looks at me. Then they listen. If that don’t work, I will get my urinal out and see if that will work.

Crowd: Laughter.

Jones: (High laughter) Hallelujah. Kukamatanda. (speaks in tongues for several words). And if it’s not (tongues), it’s (slightly altered words), it’s anyway, we gotta go. (High laughter). (Pause) Ah yes, my friend, and I’m still shittin’.

Man in crowd: (Unintelligible phrase) Getting’ close.

Jones: Oh, I’m gettin’ close. You bet I’m gettin’ close. Movin’ in. The heat is on. (Pause)

Man in crowd: That’ll make your back door slam shut.

Jones: (Shouts) Now the end of the commandment, all your stupid commandment, is charity. All God wants from you is to be charitable. And you stupid ass Pentecostals have never been charitable with anything but your hot air. All you been charitable with is your damn hot air. You never have been charitable with anything but your hot air. (Pause) You know it’s true. (Pause) (Normal tone) Keep the restroom door open. (Pause) (Shouts) You shan’t get away from my words, even if you would take a pee!

Crowd reaction.

Jones: (High laughter) Aren’t you glad!

Crowd: Yeah.

Jones: (Shouts) There’s only one way to get away from the words of God Almighty, Honesty, Justice that I am, the God of this nation, the only way to get away from me, is to get out from under the sound of my voice and out from under this roof and even then, I will be there. You can make your beds in all your hells, and I’ll be there. You can go to your imaginary heavens, and I will be there. There is no space vacant from my presence, for I am here, there, and everywhere. Socialism. God Almighty.

Crowd: Cheers.

Jones: (Shouts) Let not my words deceive you. Let my tongue, that may be somewhat ill-styled, according to your imaginary legends, let it not delude you from recognizing, that all you said God to be (Romans 16:18, “For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.”), and more, is addressing you in this atmosphere, right now. God Almighty. Socialism. (Normal tone) I need not go further. It goes on and says that, “Some of you have turned from this commandment of charity out of a pure or honest heart, and of good conscience and just pure faith, faith unfamed, and you’re turned aside to every wind and wave of doctrine, designed to be teachers of the law, kept this.” Any verse supports it. That’s what they desire, they wanted to be a teacher, they want to look like somebody, they want to be a big shot. “Designed to be the teachers of the law, understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm. But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully.” Now what’s the use for law. What is the loose— use for rig— ri— rigid doctrines, rituals, commandments? There’s only one use. Here is the use. Knowing this, that the law is not made for righteous man.

One person laughs.

Jones: (Shouts) Law is not made for good folks. Good folks don’t need God’s myths, fables, laws, regula— I’m saying a whole lot of truth, and some of you are not getting it—

Several members whoop.

Jones: (Shouts) Good folks don’t need God’s commandments, laws, structure, religion. Good folks don’t need it. Righteous man does not need religion. Righteous man does not need religion. Only ungodly, only unrighteous, only devils need religion. Religion is an opiate to those that are righteous. Religion is stench in the nostrils of those that are holy. Religion is hell to those that are godic. Religion is dirty to all those that are in the knowledge of truth. (Calm) “Designed to be teachers of the law.” Understanding neither nor what they say. But we know that the law is good if you use it only for one purpose. For those that are not good, use it to people that need it. If somebody can’t be good for good’s sake, then scare hell out of them. (Preacher’s shout) Put a whammy on them. Set up a rule. Establish a regulation. If they can’t be righteous because they have evolved through the karma of enough reincarnations to know what holiness is, (voice calms) then put a law on their backside. Or their frontside. And tighten up the laws, and put the screws for however lowly they are— the lower they are? the narrower they are? the more sinlike they are? the more evil they are? the more laws you need. If they’re evil, you gotta have a lot of rules. If they’re bad, you gotta have a lot of doctrines. Gotta tell how many seraphims and cherubim can stand on the head of a pin. You gotta tell how many gates there are into the city. (Distracted) Now I want that brother to find out where in the hell he’s going— and it better be a light-complected— I want to find out what he is doing here. If he is here to hear the truth, fine. If he isn’t, get his ass on the road right now. (Pause) Not wondering around here to, to locate ourselves. (Pause) Now I’m back to where I was, speaking about the truth. Well, Mother LeTourneau, if you’d leave too, you— you’re evil, because, anyone who has righteous faith— you see, you don’t have to— I don’t have to hear what you’re saying, I know what you’re saying. You— you— you see, if you have a knowledge, if you were— if you would leave, it’ll be because you need the law. (Minister’s cadence) If you left this atmosphere, and rejected it tonight, it’d be because you’re a sinner. If you left, it’d be because you are still in the old bondage of the old order. Because if you are lawless, then you don’t like anybody to reflect against the law. You want doctrines preached, if you’re lawless. But if you’re righteous, nobody needs to tell you to know God. No one that needs to tell you to do good to your neighbor. No one has to say, know God, or to keep the commandments of God, for the laws and the commandments of God are written on the sta— inner most shrine of the heart. No matter in that hour of (unintelligible phrase— sounds like “son shift”) shall say, know God, for all shall know him from the least to the greatest  (Hebrews 8:11, “And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.”). (Pause) (Slower) Only the lawless like church. Only the lawless like religion. Only those that are in part like some little instructions. But when you see the whole, then you know it’s all socialism. It’s all equality. It’s all harmony. It’s all goodness. Then you don’t need anymore. You have it, as far as religion is concerned. (Shouts) “Knowing that the law is not made for righteous man or good people, but for the lawless and disobedient. Disobedient. For the ungodly, and for sinner, for the unholy, profane, for the murderers of fathers, and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,” children killers, Vietnam destroyers, warmongers. That’s who needs religion. (Pause) (Sneers) Good American Christians. “For whoremongers.” Now what’s a whoremonger? Whoremonger never loves. He just uses. Jumps from one to another. For people that use people. The only place in America that I’ve ever found — and I’m not happy with where we are — but it’s the only place in America, that really, learning about loving. Every place else, every place in the damn world, it’s like, I love an orange. And they take that orange and they squeeze it, and they squeeze it and they squeeze it, till there’s no life left in the orange. And they throw the orange down. That’s what religion is for, for you whoremongers that never could love. You, the great lovers that come in, say, I can have a woman a night, that’s saying nothing about you but that you’re a dirty old rotten whoremonger that could never love anybody. (Pause) And it’s gotta be a woman every other night, too. Not the same woman. Not twice. ‘Cause you might have to love then. (Pause) Can’t have too much contact. Got to be very limited contact. Few minutes, off and on. Don’t want to look in the eyes, don’t want to hear her words, gotta be (claps hands) get out quick. That’s what religion is for. (Calm, intense) Whore. Mongers. For them that defile themselves with mankind. “For men-stealers,” it come from the word meaning, those that steal the freedom, steal from people’s freedom. Slavery. Take people into slavery. Come from a word that those that deal in slavery, those that keep people in second-class citizenship, those that make bonds, people out of, out of humankind, those that would take someone, and, because of their race, make them a slave. (Shouts) That’s who need religion. “Righteous people don’t need the law. Knowing this, that the law is not made for righteous man, but for the lawless, disobedient, ungodly, sinners, profane murderers, manslayers, whoremongers, and those that defile themselves, because they can never give anything, but take. (Calm voice) The liars, the perjurers, and, if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine.” Now what the heck has it been talking about? Not a thing about what you believe about hell, not a thing about what you believe about the supernatural, (Voice rises) not a thing about what you believe about God, it’s been talking about character. For four verses, (Claps hand) it’s been talking about character, and it says now, that any other person that is contrary to sound way of living, doctrine, needs this. If you don’t, and if you’ve got perfect love (pause) don’t need any of it. All the law in the Prophets is fulfilled in one saying: Love God, praise God, in a body, in a human being. He is the light that lighteth every man and woman (John 1:9, “That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.” See also, Matthew 5:14, John 3:19, John 8:12, John 9:5, John 11:9, and John 12:46). If you love your neighbor, then you don’t need any other of the crap, it’s all gone going going going gone. The only contracts, when the house is paid for, you throw the contract away. That’s what the Bible is. It’s a contract, until you stupid people learn how to love. And when you become the Word, son made flesh, you don’t need a Bible, you could use the Bible for toilet paper with more effectiveness. Because you become the hope of the world. You become a city, set on a hill, that cannot be c— be hid. You become the light of the world. You become a living epistle, read and known to all men. (Off mike) I don’t suppose a word— (fades out). (Back on) Good. Good. Everybody ought to hear this, uh, in this atmosphere, ‘cause we got a lot of religious folks here that gather on Wednesday and Sunday. Lawless people. “According to the glorious gospel of the Blessed God.” There’s all kinds of gods. But Paul said the Blessed God— you have a god in Nazarenedom that is a God of Hell, or Pentecostalism, it’s a God of Hell. But he said, “According— I have been preaching according to the glorious gospel, the good news of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.” That’s so good. And I’d go on. And you give me any one of your verses, but I’m not going to take any more time. Any one of your Bibles lend itself to my teaching, and you say, we don’t know the Bible. You don’t know the Bible, that’s your trouble.

Scattered shouts.

Jones: Well, in the— in the stead now, we’ll— we’ll move on. If you’ve got— If you’ve got your thoughts corrected — and I want— I wanted this to be made some of these holy people to set down and listen to this sometime, ‘cause they always talkin’ ‘bout, we want to get more church. We want to talk more about heaven, we want to sing a little bit more about the spirit, we want to hear a little bit more about the (hushed tone) supernatural. We like to hear some more of the mysteries, the fables, the legends. We want to hear the genealogies. And I say, you’re lawless. You’re disobedient. You’re defilers. You’re the murderers of men, women and children. You’re the slaveholders (voice rises to shout). You the men-stealers. You that want to hear about God, when the world’s hungry, you that want to hear about heaven, while the world is dying, you that want to hear about hell and a God — some old stupid God on a throne — you that want to hear about all that, while the world is dying for a little bit of love, (voice reverts to hushed tone) I say that you are lawless. (voice rises to shout) But the righteous socialist man does not need the law. He does not need religion. He does not need genealogies. He does not need ritual. He needs no songs about a future heaven, for he’ll take any sod and clod of dirt and make it his heaven. Give him a moment, and he’ll turn all your hells into heaven. Just give him a moment, and he’ll make a heaven out of all your hells that you religious people have created. I thank you.

Man: Thank you.


Man in crowd: You talk about (unintelligible). You talk about truth. God has truly spoken (unintelligible)

Crowd: Amen. Clamoring.

Another man: When the law is written upon the heart, there is no need for a written law.

Jones: (Quietly) True. True.

Woman: The Lord has sent. Behold I shall make the way so plain, that though a man were a fool, he shall not ever end.


Woman: I love this place.

Man: Even if they can’t read.

Another woman, unintelligible.

Jones: Beautiful. Beautiful. That’s what it is. When love is come, all they impart that tells you how to get to it when you got it, what do you need the description— if you’ve got a gold mine, if you’ve found the treasure, what do you need with (voice rises to shout) a map? If you found the treasure, if you found God, why are you still back there in Matthew, Mark, Luke and back there in Romans, or back there in Deuteronomy, or Nehemiah, why are you back there when God, the gold mine, has come in the might and the power of socialism in the midst of his people. Throw away your old written traditions. Throw them away. (voice comes back to normal) As far as your need for them in consciousness, use them to save people from the dirt and the debris and the murder of lawlessness that they’re in. But for your own edification, never use them. Use them only to set others free. Thank you.

Voices still clamor for several moments.

Woman: This is like heaven to us.

Man: This is heaven. (Pause) Almost.

Jones: We feel the love that takes us in. We feel the love that counsels us and tells us we’re on a— on a wrong road. We feel the love that when you go out and make a mistake, no matter what your mistake, they know who to call. Some of the authorities came after a rich rancher’s son today. Who did they call? They called Jim Jones. Who do they call when their troubles come? So much is disgusting. They can’t come, but they can call when they get into trouble. But they know who’ll take on the system, when their courts picked them up. Mrs. Cleveland I’m talking about today, big rancher down there, and she called right for Jim Jones when her son got in trouble. She can come in here just once in a while, (pause) she’s just a little too white and a little too rich, until she gets in trouble. And we know— we know where heaven is. We don’t want to hear— I want to tell you, we wouldn’t even listen to your heaven if it wouldn’t a saved good people like some of you that are still lost. We don’t want to hear about it. It reeks us, it makes us sick, it’s a stench in our nostrils. Heavens and angels with wings, the streets of gold, and tomorrow. You people live in Tomorrowland. You make me sick. I’ve had too much Tomorrowland. Some of us have sweat blood to make it a Today, to make it today as the day of salvation. We sweat too much blood. And we shall not go back. Some say— some say, you emancipate them. You free them of all. You just free them. You make it so plain that you can’t even keep them in— in— in tow anymore. Very well. (Pause) (Calm) Very well. I still choose to be honest. There is a danger, because some of you hear that the laws are for lawless people, so you decide, well, now I don’t have anything to be afraid of. The fact is, if you are lawless, you still are an unhealthy creature to be thrown out on the environment. So you better stayll— still stay around somebody that knows how to keep you out of trouble. Because some of you’ve got it in your head, but you haven’t got it down to your (draws out word) fingers when you’re in a store, or you haven’t got it down to your twat when you’re in the bed. (Pause) So until you know how to get it down to those extremities, you better stay around. There’s somebody that can keep you out of trouble. So don’t be too quick to say I’m not— I’m not lawless. ‘Cause I got a good feeling there some of you still are. Because when you’re truly socialist, don’t talk to me (unintelligible word) about stealing — (mimicry) “I got the awfulest urge to steal anybody ever had” — I can do it well, too. Man, I could go into store and lift the store and they’d never know what happen. ‘Cause I know when somebody’s thinking, when they’re looking, what they’re doing. (Pause) Don’t tell me, because I’ve had this gift for many a year. In those days of my childhood, I (draws out word) really made a go of it. Yes, I did. Until I was ten, 12, I knew, there wasn’t a merchant I couldn’t fool. I got stuff I didn’t even know what it was for.

Crowd: Laughter.

Jones: I walked out with a hydraulic pump at ten years of age.

Crowd: Laughter.

Jones: I wheeled it right out on a wheelbarrow, and they never even knew what went by them. Because I knew what he was doing on (unintelligible word), and I got this thing, what am I going to do with it? I dumped it in an alley. (Pause) And nobody ever picked me up once, nobody got my fingerprints, nobody ever come near my dwelling. Nobody ever looked for me. So what makes me not steal? I could steal, and get by. I am too socialistic to take that chance that even a passerby would see me. I know the only Christ the world will see is me.

Crowd: Yeah.

Jones: So, I’m not gonna steal for that reason. (taps table) When I go to the counter — now I’ll get to where some of you are, you’re not all stealers — when I go to a counter, I don’t speak nasty to people, because I know the only Christ they’re going to see is me. Oh, and I go and wait and meet somebody, I’m kind, even if they’re mean — unless they’re just reprobates, and there’s nobody else around, I’ve got a mission to do — but for the most part, I eat crap 24 hours a day. Operators are getting me on the phone, just mean. I gotta lotta phone work to do. And they’ll get ‘em on these lines, poor black people, and they’ll mistreat them, ‘cause they— they— they stereotype an ignorant person or an uneducated person, just, they think, by the language or the accent, so they interpret that that person’s ignorant or black. And I put up with more crap out of those people, but then I will try to win them by some kind of kindness, because I know, socialism’s at stake. Brotherhood’s at stake. I— I thank the operator, I say, you don’t realize that this is a— this is a prominent denomination la da la da, I get in the— that this is a very wonderful member of this church, and we have these and that and the other type of person in our congregation. And I offer to be of assistance, I said, you’ve been kind, even though I know it’s been a drag on you. What is your operator number? More operators have been given praise letters by me, I suppose, than any human being on earth. And you know we do that all the time. An operator’s kind, we get their supervisor, I’ll call through at long distance exchange, I’ll say, will you turn me over to your supervisor? When I’ve got ‘em — you gotta make a long distance call — when you got ‘em, I’ll say, please give me your supervisor, I want to thank them. They’ll over stay on to hear what you do. They stay right on there, listen to what you’re saying to their supervisor. So here’s brotherhood connected— everything I do, I want to use it for socialism, ‘cause I know the hope of the world is in me. You say, well, you’re different. No, I’m no different than you.

Male in crowd: That’s right. That’s a cop-out.

Jones: I’m just an example of what you should be. So every move you make, when you whiz down the road and throw out trash, when you speed around somebody and give them nasty treatment, you edge up— ah, edge up on somebody with your bright lights, you better think. You better think. I looked at some behavior the other day. We’re so determined to know— make ourselves known. I saw a group of (stumbles over words) people, we wear distinctive hats. You know what I mean? They stereotype you. Distinctive hair. They dis— they— they stereotype you. Cutting up, carrying on the road, down the road they went. Where’d I see it? I saw it up here. (Pause) That’s nice, isn’t it? It’s good to parade your blackness if you are upright. But if I was not living upright, I would get down behind the seat these days. ‘Cause some of us are struggling too hard to set mankind free. I wouldn’t be parading my Afros, unless you have some African civilization underneath your hair. If you haven’t got some of that great civilization that was lost in Africa, I’d shave my head as bald as a peacock’s (significant pause).

Man in crowd: Go ahead.

Jones: (taps on podium) I would shave it. Now that’s something for you to think about. Or anybody else. Young Turks with your rebels, white or whatever, and give your peace sign swinging around down the road, I’d keep my peace sign to myself, just like I said over here in this house today. I said, I’m tired. Some of you people from peace mission, I’m tired of hearing “Peace” when there ain’t no peace. I didn’t say it that way, but that’s what it means. (Shouts) Peace don’t mean a damn to me, unless you mean what you’re saying. Come up to me, I said to you, I rather some of you sisters over there say “War,” ‘cause you don’t mean peace, you mean war. (Pause) So when you say peace, you’re embracing what God is. God is love, justice, peace. (Normal tone) And when you say God’s name, don’t blaspheme. You taking his name in vain. So why are you up here cussin’. You said “ass.” That’s not cussin’. When you (shouts) cuss is when you say (quiet) “Peace” and you mean war. When you say, I bless you in Jesus’ name, and you mean everything else but blessings. Then’s when you’re taking the name of the Lord in vain. Don’t you worry about that old fellow saying son-of-a-bitch. He hurt nobody but his mother, and she might have been one. But when you say “Peace,” and there’s no peace, you’re reflecting on everything that’s holy and everything that’s sacred. (Dismissive tone) Well, I could go on all night, let’s forget it. Let’s go where we are. We’ve got uh, not very much more time to go. (Pause) Now we had some swinging times, by the way, over in those houses, and we’re gonna have continued swinging times. No compromise with ch— childish foolishness. I want it to be understood. If I won’t tolerate it in older people, I’m not going to tolerate it in anybody else. I said there’s no ordering around, no raising of voices, no unkindness, no talking behind anyone’s back. I said, you’re not being discussing these age homes about anyone else unless all are together and they’re being moderated by Eva [Pugh] or myself or one of the staff. That’s the way we want it everywhere. So people can feel like they’re not getting cut down every time they turn around. (Pause) Now if we got that through tonight, Tuesday night be worthwhile, ‘cause you know that most of you still guilty of gossiping. Anybody never talked behind anybody’s ba— uh, back, stand up. (Pause) Well, we’re all guilty then, huh? Go on, who is next?

(Voices off mike)


Different occasion that tape cuts to. JJ on phone call? Others in room with him.

Male: —ain’t gone work for some reason, I’m not— I’m not getting anything over here. Darrell and David Golden. Come up please, and uh, let’s see. (Voice comes through better) Like a fox.

Woman’s voice unintelligible

Male: And let’s see, there another. What’s the— what’s the little child’s name, is it— (unintelligible name). What’s her name?

Jones: Marceline, why don’t you— before I make this public, about uh, the uh—

Male: Robert? Robert what? Robert Johnson also, Robert Johnson.

Jones: Okay. That’s all right, he can go out. Why— why— before I make this public about (Pause) what has been said about the Mendocino State Hospital, why don’t you boldly go up and talk to the administrator.

Male: Robert Johnson.

Jones: You’re in a position, I wonder if you could do that. (Pause) Just boldly ask him. I don’t trust that man any further than I could throw him, you know.

Woman’s voice unintelligible

Jones: Well, get it straighter. I’ve— I’ve still got tomorrow night. I don’t want to get into—getting people running loose. (Pause) ‘Cause Monday you were quoting to me that he said you know he was extending his plans, he was gonna have a new, new class of tech— that’s what you told me, I don’t—

Man talking at same time, says: No No (unint.) No, Robert, not you, not you. Robert—

Woman: Robert? Robert?

Man: Come on.

Woman: We want all the kids away.

Another man: Come up here, Roger. Stand up here.

Jones: Well, I didn’t hear that part. Well, just get it, and we’ll go in there tomorrow night.

Man: Robert? Come up here, son. Stand up, Robert, come on. Just like everybody else. Now Robert, come on, stand up.

Other man talking, unintelligible.

Man: Oh, where are all the other kids should be awake— awakened also, they shouldn’t be anymore sleeping, none of the children sleeping.

Unintelligible conversation and feedback

Jones: He says you got your speakers too close to each other, and that’s what causing the trouble. You have to switch those speakers farther apart. (Pause) Let’s go.

Sounds of setting up.

Jones: I want to get it straighter. (Pause) Well, they’ll ask two or three more. I want to do it, before I put it out on the floor.

Male: I want to say uh— I wanted to say for the benefit of uh, the rest of you that this would not have come up, uh, except in the you— in the children’s meeting. Except for the gravity of the situ— of what has, has occurred. (Pause) (Struggles for words) —remember that, it had been instructed that, generally, matters of children should be taken of among the children, if possible. But then, before this Sunday, I believe it was before we went to Los Angeles. Now ah— this just preliminary to what uh, is the real issue tonight. Ronnie Beikman and uh, Robert — what’s his name? —

Woman: Johnson.

Man: Robert Johnson were back there under the tables with other kids, and they were exposing their privates, and uh, the (unintelligible).

Woman: David.

Man: David had encouraged them to urinate on the floor back there. Got uh, (struggles for words) Ronald to do it. Of course, we took the two of them in, in the restroom, counseled them rather severely, three of us did, and counseled them severely, and as a matter of fact, uh, there was corporal punishment im— imposed. Now, um, the— the David Golden denied vehemently introducing them to the idea. He, he finally made a few, few admissions. I finally get him to admit it, I said I don’t want to take this to our, our pastor, ‘cause he’d know whether he’s telling the truth or not, I said, if you le— you level with us, we’ll let you go this time. He said I did s— I did do it.

Jones: Say, Dave, now, tell me, honey-bun— nobody’s— nobody’s going to spank uh, on the subject, ‘cause it’s something I understand.

Man: Look— look up at Jim, boy. Everyone of you.

Jones: I do not uh, go through any more than understanding (tape cuts out)

Tape originally posted April 1999