July 27, 1978 (2) handwritten report on “Mann”

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[Shorthand notations spelled out]

1. Appointment with Dwyer (Charge d’affaires, US Embassy):

A. Dwyer said we were industrious people. Told Mann of his trip to the farm.

B. Dwyer told Mann that McCoy was mentioned in 3 civil suits filed against us. He asked what they were. I told him I only knew of one – Katsaris. He asked why I hadn’t told him. I said I thought he knew because it was in the newspaper. He said, “oh.” I told him I was only one of the respondents or defendants (which possibly may be why the C.R. [Concerned Relatives] didn’t mention it to him). He asked how a case like that would work. I said I didn’t know.

C. Dwyer said he didn’t know how we’d manage after a while (money-wise). He said we can’t hope to get back our outflow and when the money stops coming in, he didn’t know what we would do. He said he’d heard we’d solicited for funds from door-to-door. Mann said, “I didn’t comment.” (I didn’t comment either, but it wasn’t put as a question.)

D. Dwyer said what worries him is that something will happen and result in all of us having to go back and he’ll have 1200 Americans on his doorstep.

E. He told me that these things were told to him in private and not for public consumption or for other Temple members.

F. Dwyer asked Mann if he gets many enquiries from people about us. When Mann didn’t answer the question after stating it, I did.

He said he told Jean Brown not to waste money flooding his office with telegrams & letters (in response to my question about whether he got correspondence from the conspirators). He said yes he gets mail from them, but wouldn’t go into specifics.

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2. He played poker again last night until 4 AM. I forgot to ask if he won or lost. This is the third night in a row.

3. Since our hours are so reversed, I am working on letters for Sharon [Amos]. I sleep at night; he sleeps in the day.

4. Concerning Dwyer –

I asked what Dwyer meant by the comment about “1200 Americans rushing his doorstep.” He got annoyed, of course, but said it was in reference to a possibility of some court order or people getting fed up and wanting to leave. I asked what kind of a court order he could be talking about. He said, “how should I know. We were talking about correspondence from people enquiring and about the different court actions against you.” I asked what kind of court order would affect 1200 people. He said, “I don’t know.” “You’ve had defectors haven’t you?” I said, “Yes, a thief [Debbie Layton Blakey].”

According to Mann, Dwyer is the one who brought up PT.

5. Mann asked me about the action against me. I said it was a slander suit from Katsaris. He said, “Well it can’t touch you here.” I said, “no, but if I popped into the US, I could be served and would have to appear.” He did not say anything vicious to me about Maria except that he didn’t like the way she handled the matter with her father when he came. He said Jean Brown said she saw Maria’s Dad one time give Maria a rather long clinging embrace & when Jean questioned Maria about it, Maria was very reticent to discuss it. I said after Katsaris started the slander suit Maria took a lie detector test to prove she was molested. He asked if she was really molested. I said yes, including oral sex. He said, what makes American men molest their daughters? I said I don’t know but there is a high rate of such incidents in the US. He said, I know, so we’ve heard, right now there is a court case of a woman who sued her father for molesting her as a child and she wrote a book called “Kiss Me Goodnight, Daddy.” She gave her father a choice – either get medical care or she would sue him. He would not acknowledge he’d ever done it or erased it from memory and she sued and won damages.” I said, “Well there you are.”

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He asked where Maria took the lie detector test. I told him Venezuela.

6. He went to the PM’s again today. He said the PM may want him to rush back to Washington to take care of something.

– He said something about the possibility of getting some loan which might go thru (good chance) – this was said to someone else over a telephone call.

– He also mentioned that Sonny Ramphal (former Minister of Foreign Affairs before Wills) who is now Secretary General of the Commonwealth, just arrived in Washington. He idolizes Ramphal & may want to get back there to see him.

7. I said one thing Dwyer mentioned – that we needed to have another source of funds is true (that wasn’t what Dwyer said, but that is how I put it). I said we needed some business investment other than farming to offset our expenses. He said what he thinks we should get into is wood products. He said you have all of your raw materials there (lumber) and should buy the machine wood lathes to make things like ashtrays, humidors, and that kind of thing. He said we could market them in the Caribbean or even overseas in North America or in the Commonwealth or in Europe. He said no one produces them and there used to be expertise in making them right in Matthews Ridge. He said one time he had some samples of different items in his office and someone from some place (I can’t remember where) came in and said he could market 200,000 of them if he could produce them. He said they could be made for 50¢ and sold at a tremendous profit. He submitted the idea to the government and it never got in anyplace. I

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don’t know if what he is saying is valid but it is worth looking into. For a percentage, I bet the government thru their embassies in various locations might be willing to act as marketing agents for us. That is supposedly one of the embassies’ functions.

8. He asked if the Bishop [Jim Jones] could come to town so they could have a chat. I said he could if there wasn’t still a court order out. He said that he thot that the habeous [habeas] corpus thing was taken care of. I said no, why don’t you come up there and talk to him. (I am still pushing to get him to come up for a visit, whether a weekend or a day.)

= Question: Can I ask if he’s met Tim Stoen or Steve Katsaris or any of the Concerned Relatives since I last saw him? What areas should I get into? When we are in bed, he is open to questions and discussions but any other time he gets annoyed.

9. Sharon had asked him if he had ever discussed PT with the PM. He said no but he’d discussed me. I asked him what they have discussed. He said he never said that. That he had discussed the Temple one time & had written him about us. I asked what about. He said he didn’t know[,] it was over a year ago, too long ago for him to remember (he said this with a belligerent edge). He said I can tell you this, tho, the PM he knows you’re here with me. I said I would expect him to know if his security were thorough. I said what does the PM think of you being with me. He said what should he think? (I said I mean because I am a member of PT & there is a controversy over us. He said as far as the Guyana govt is concerned, PT is not a controversy. PT supports the govt and that is what the govt is concerned with.) (I knew I shouldn’t have said we were a controversy because it sounded too weak – but the conversation was not getting anywhere). I made statements about other groups like Synanon & the Bakke decision

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following to put it in perspective. (I hope it was OK) He commented that the San Francisco area is getting very reactionary. He is very familiar with the Bakke decision and where it originated.
10. He asked, in his usual digging way, why do we confiscate people’s passports and money & send them to Jonestown when they arrive. I said we don’t and if he would come up, as I asked, he could ask anyone he wanted if they have their passport. He said why do you put people behind barbed wire fences? All of these things were said in his smirking cynical way. I don’t think he believes it but knows it irritates me when he says things like that.

Originally posted on March 4th, 2022.

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