Jean Brown reports, 1977

[Editor’s note: The dates of the reports are as follows:

  • A-14 = 11/22/77
  • A-13 = 11/23/77
  • A-6 = 11/28/77
  • A-9 = 11/28/77
  • A-12 = 11/29/77
  • A-15 = 12/1/77]


[Handwritten note at top of page: “Harriet read”]

TUESDAY, NOV. 22 [1977]

1.RE: HODGES: He was very friendly, said the issue over Laurie was nothing, that he actually thought she expressed herself articulately. He sends Hill his regards. He knew of Herb Caen article and asked me about it. I said it was true and tried to explain from standpoint of Minnie being suicidal and George unable to face losing her re. career – he understood, I believe. Was positive. Said he prays for Hill frequently, appreciates what he is doing for people. San Leandro is a wasteland. It is a tribute to congregation and to Hill that this can all be discussed openly. I told him we have always known, as had Marceline. He was not judgmental in the slightest. Very kind.

2.RE. DAVIDOW: Explained about George as in instructions. Explained the split seemed to come at time of our solid friendship with his friends, that George was opposed to this, something of his background in fundamental religion and anti-comm. He said, “These things happen. There certainly is a historical precedent.” What impressed him about PT is our “faith and firm belief in the rock on which our movement is built.” I assured him Hill and all of us were solid along the lines of philosophy as he was. He gave me the name of the ambassador and how to reach him for the anniversary letter.

3.KAHN wasn’t home, his wife says he is much better. Out for a walk. Will reach him tomorrow. Also trying to reach Bramsford.

4.Tom called COLEMAN. Tom’s report: “Talk with Coleman today. He listened. Asked for a copy of the article about George. And also a copy of Wednesday’s article, as he hasn’t had a chance to look at them yet. His only response was, ‘Well, you’ve got problems.'”

5. RE. JEFF OF SCIENCE: He was helpful, very interested. Met also with another man, Patrick Lufkin, whom Jeff invited to the meeting. I explained to them about the new report from Washington, they are very familiar with Lous [Louis] B. Sims. He is the head of Interpol. It has switched from being in T [Treasury] department to Justice Dept where it now is. Jeff said he smelled Interpol throughout. Send interested parties should file and aggressively pursue FOIA. That is how they got their documents – though it has taken them 3 years or more to get – the essential stuff. We should get exact, flawless documentation and have a media campaign. A counterattack scares people back off. They just do. They find another rock to hide under.

I told him the parties did not want to implicate the source, and he understood. Since some things just aren’t leakable because they are highly traceable. Said someone in the news could do it. The man there could leak it to a well-known news man, one who is reasonably supportive of us and would send it to us – one of the few ways to get what parties are looking for, with protection of confidentiality.

Said document, make sure everything is credible, precise and true. Then scream to the press. They learned something from withdrawing from press years ago, learned that though whatever they said was misquoted and misconstrued for years, make a deal with the media by cultivating one, a few reporters, gaining credibility and dispelled the notion that all scientists go around like zombies with their eyes staring out of their heads as portrayed in media. Said they have finally gained credibility with press on their Interpol stuff, after years of being ignored, maligned. Empathized.




Said if we could come up with something, if not the document itself then affidavits from people who saw it – (if that is possible without damaging something more important to us in trust with the officials there –) then they would be glad to consider giving it a media push in the channels they have established – our case could be publicized as another case in point against the kind of thing Interpol does, the kind of exposure they are trying to bring to bear on the agency. Use their base.

Again they said to pursue FOAI [FOIA] avidly. Go after all correspondence from the as aforenamed agencies about PT. Cross reference, find the loopholes and contradictions and sue. Get some investigations going, however we chose to do it. Get Private eyes or trace ourselves. Take a prime source like Minnie and trace her whole background, everyone she would have had contact with earlier, and everyone she is contacting now. Get her history. Connections will show. Give people we are going to get to the bottom of the conspiracy – the weaker ones and one time stitches will scatter. I said our attorney frequently puts a stop on ideas. They laughed and said that they never ask their lawyers about their strategy. Lawyers are perpetual stoppers. He suggested we challenge CK’s license. Call the investigative agency licensing bureau – ask how this man with such a long record is practicing. Recommends we go fishing. [Handwritten marginal note: “Yes!”]

He will give the information I mentioned to him re. Sim, Murtaugh etc. to Vaughn. He is working on the Interpol connection and anti-FBI suit. Will keep close touch with me. Seemed sincere in desire to be of help. When I asked more directly for help springing the document in East Coast, they just said it takes time and got back on the FOIA thing.



WEDNESDAY, NOV. 23 [1977]

Nothing serious, just a coupel of things to mention. Since the problem came up on my job (i.e. Canter saw me in front of the Examiner building picketing and called my boss on me) I have had to spend a lot of conscientious time on my job from 8 to 5. My lunch hour is the time I used to call people who are contacts for us, like Karl, Dennis Roberts, [Albert] Kahn and others. I don’t make it home until after the radio is faded out and so there is little or no direct feedback from my department to you until the weekends. I don’t know if this is a problem, but wanted to explain why you don’t hear from me more. I usually meet with June [Crym] and Marcie at Eric’s [Charles Garry] after work to go over things, which is working out pretty well.

Most of the burden of getting the instructions carrying out is on Sandy [Bradshaw] and Marcie. I think Sandy is really trying to do a conscientious job, her only big problem that I can see is Leona [Collier]. She has had a couple run-ins with her, such as Marcie has undoubtedly explained to you. Marcie worries a lot about that – she worries about nearly everything. I don’t mean to make any judgments by saying that. I just think she feels the weight of it all very much. Once she gets going with things during the day she seems to do well. I usually have a conference with her every morning at 7:00. Both of us are pretty worried about relations with Garry, how to get done what needs to be done, strategies etc., and I completely lose credibility with him. It sounds bad – I don’t know if it is really that bad and don’t mean to sound an alarm. He is set on certain things and will not retract his ideas. He does not like our strategies. He was mad at the call that went to Dick Hodges, mad that SB and Teddy went out on a walk to Schwartzes, and he insists, as in the reports you’ve probably already seen, the true story of Jeremy [John Victor Stoen] is detrimental to his case. What case I am not sure of, since it is already decided, and how it is detrimental, we wonder if it isn’t more his distaste for being associated with us in this. It is hard to tell. I think he is genuinely convinced revealing Jeremy’s story would be abused in the press, but the problem is that he refuses to consider our side of it. When we ask his permission and he says no, that is the end of it. But if we do something without his knowing about it and it gets back to him, such as the call to Hodge[s] which Rex did, he gets hostile. His stance is that unless he can share information with us in confidence then we have no working relationship. He was furious with me for not telling him who made the Hodges call, for not owning up to it. He was furious about SB and Pat and Irene saying she could not control everybody. He was angry with us when we were reluctant to follow through on the plans to have traitors talk to relatives on the phone. The situation may not be any worse or better than it has ever been with him. One thing is true, I think, and that is if we continue too many more times to do things like this without his knowledge or permission and it gets back to him, we will jeopardize relations with him.

It was interesting what Jeff Quiros said of the scientists, that they never let their lawyers do their strategy nor dictate to them. They hire the best that money can buy when it comes to the courtroom, but in other fields they do not let attorneys tell them what to do or not to do. Said they are notorious “stoppers.” I will keep in touch with Roberts and Sheehan just in case. Any instructions as to what kinds of things to relate to them, what kinds of advice to seek are welcome. I would appreciate, too, some ideas on relating to the scientists. Jeff seemed to concern and sincere guy. The other one I met, Patrick Lufkin, struck me like a stuffed-up, self-important fat boy. Not unfriendly, just seemed more interested in his own knowledge of his field (Sims) than in our case. I would feel somewhat confident talking to Jeff about some of our problems and will continue to do that. But if you have any guidelines, I think that would be helpful for me.



By guidelines, I guess I mean how far to trust the guy for the kinds of information we can get.

Another thing that has been on my mind is the kind of base we need/want here. If Marcie leaves for overseas, I do not expect things to hold together here for long. I think people are willing to accept her authority, her right to a central coordinating position. But when she is not there, there is resentment to directions coming from any other person, and paranoia. And there is too much internal division to get together a group council or co-ordinating body. I think Marcie should go over there, but I am concerned about what will happen here. I would hope more people could be over there I then. I think our effectiveness here is at a minimum but still something to be recognized in the community – i.e. Examiner march and PR events we attend. People know we are still around and call on us. I think it is important to try to maintain that contact, no matter how minimal. I also think it is important to try to continue looking into angles of the conspiracy from this end. We don’t put much time into it, mainly because it is just Rex and me snooping around. I am willing to stay here as long as I am useful here, for however long, to do it. I’m certainly not the best one for the job, but am learning my way around pretty much…I think there should be a concerted effort to track down whatever we can about these creeps who are tied together against us. There appears to be some leads we can follow and people who are willing to help. One thing came through loud and clear from the scientists, that lots of people, media concluded, will back off when they think they are going to be exposed. It is another reason to maintain a minimal base here. My concern lies mostly to how to handle the internal conflicts that will arise again (which are settled below the surface with Marcie here) when Marcie leaves. I don’t have any solid suggestions, but do think that unless Leona is a key person in fact as well as in name, she will work to provide further.

RE: ALBERT KAHN – As soon as I explained about George’s stance, and the preference he has shown for a social life, and his dissociation because of our closer ties with the friends of Harvey, he said, “Absolutely expected in an organization like yours. Typical of groups in our struggle. There will always be those kinds of people, even in leadership.” He said to tell you he sends warmest greetings from the whole family. He is reading our reports of the work there and thinks it is wonderful. Wants to get together after the holidays. (I will contact him to get together sooner, in view of our new plans for the entertainment of Harvey’s friends as guests at the Temple.)

RE: DENNIS ROBERTS: I called re. Dennis, asked a specific question about his case that was raised in a Law Recorder article that the deputy AG had new and controversial, “volatile information that is extremely volatile and confidential about [American Indian Movement leader Dennis] Banks if returned to the state (SD [South Dakota])” He told me not to worry, that pertained only to SD, nothing to worry about here. He said thank you for calling and hung up, not interested in further conversation. I think what I should do this call and make appointments for conferences with these alternate attys, sound them out on cases such as mentioned in C.L.’s [Carolyn Layton] write-up – suits against media, against parents of Olivers and Margaret’s. They might be more inclined to look at us more seriously if there is a potential case in it, plus we need the variety of items in the usefulness of such suits.

Will pursue this next week.



NOV. 28 [1977], MONDAY

The way Eric described the Oliver hearing was that it was a farce. They really didn’t have a case, the judge (Joe Kennedy) was trying hard to be cordial to the attorney and Mrs. [Beverly] Oliver but was really trying to impress on them that their case was totally impractical. Bill [Oliver, son of Beverly] could not be brought back here unless he wanted to come.

A few important things to note: The judge did not accept the fact that Bill was married as a criterion of emancipation. He said he would have to be self-supporting. Charles [Garry] insisted the marriage ment [meant] he was emancipated, but the judge didn’t buy it.

Said the attorney was an ass and stupid. Charles was mad at him because he was so stupid and because he tried to malign Charles to the judge. Charles told the judge he didn’t want to listen to this garbage and proceeded to walk out. He told the judge Mrs. Oliver could talk to her sons, that he personally would arrange it, and the judge said that if she were to try to go over there to visit, she would have to pay her own way.

The atty. kept saying “There is someone here who can tell you just how awful it is in Guyana.” The judge was not interested and refused to let the lawyer bring this person up. We assumed it was Yolanda Crawford, though Charles did not know.

The judge read everything Charles had submitted in the statement he filed at Juvenile Superior Court, including the transcript of Charles[‘] tape with Bill and Bruce. But he would not entertain the person the other attorney had to tell “how bad it really was.”

The judge told Mrs. Oliver – “We have no way of bringing him back. Do you want me to file an order when he will be 18 in just 27 days??” When she insisted, the judge obliged her, though he admitted to the court, according to Garry, that it didn’t mean a thing. There was no way they could bring the young man back if he did not want to come. “All the court orders in the world won’t get him back.”

Charels told Beverly she could visit: “I’ll see you get to Jonestown.”

RE JOE [Mazor] MATTER: Eric will not file anything until they pick it up in the press. If they do, he will call a press conference. The matter is still scheduled for Dec. 12, Eric is waiting for Joe to call him back; since he is not going to be able to represent his client on the 12th, he will have to see it postponed. He reassured us that there are two crack people working on the case to see what the underlying theories are of Constitutional law in this. When I asked him to project a date when they would come up with an answer, he said he had no idea.

[The following paragraph is bracketed, with an asterisk, and the notation “READ”]

RE: CALL FROM LARRY TUPPER: Mary Harden, who Eric said was the stepdaughter of Larry Tupper, called Eric today. Then Tupper’s wife called. Then Charles talked to Tupper himself. He told Eric that Donna Conn had told him to call Eric. Tupper said he talked to the children (the ones he is concerned about are Janet and Larry Jr.) once before when he had threatened to bring the kidnapping suit. Eric said Rita had violated a court order and that he was within his prerogative to sue when he did. Eric thinks Tupper is “sincere.” Sincerely interested in the children. Eric told him the good things, said he knew all the bad



things, but that the children were well and that if he had any children he would want them to be over there. Tupper said he knew of Eric, I did not understand “why he was representing those creeps.” Eric told Tupper when he asked that there was no such thing as a “private conversation” because everyone in the world can listen to the radio. Said there were no telephones in Jonestown, so they would have to talk over the radio.

Eric’s comment to all this, Conn and all, was “Let’s disarm these guys.” He wants, insists that Marcie talk to Tupper and let him know he will be able to talk to his children when the copy allows. He was adamant that we not the antagonistic, that he really wants to keep up communication with his children.

RE: JOE JOHNSON: Said he ran into Joe this morning and Joe wanted Jim to know that he is in our camp and doing whatever he can to fight for Jim.

RE: OLIVERS: He said if the Olivers call to talk to their sons, we should allow it, but we should definitely tape the conversation. He said the same things with Mickey Touchette.

[The following paragraph is bracketed, with the notation “FOI Letters”]

RE: DEPUTY COMMISSIONER OF POLICE – He said before he writes to the agency on the East Coast, he wants to talk to his friend who is on the verge of defecting. He already mentioned us to this man, and he had never heard of us but would check. He is still a club member, but is going to talk soon. He will only talk to Eric and two others – Eric is having a conference with him Thursday to find out what he learned of our standing in the agency he is working for (the same one that sent the letter to the Deputy Comm. of Police there.)

He recommends we pinpointed the agency in an FOIA letter on behalf of Hill – citing this exact information. June will do this on Eric’s letterhead, asap. [Handwritten addition: “– also Mary Ruth”]

RE: PHARMACEUTICAL NUMBER – suggested we go ahead and order the stuff we need through a wholesale firm such as McKisson & Robbins, use the fact that we have a doctor, a pharmacist, and a thousand people in need of medicine. Said he thinks it will work.

RE: INSURANCE – Harold and brought it all down and June and he have gone over it all. Eric wants to see the insurance originals, what’s to determine if there is any way the cost of litigation in any of this can be charged to a policy we have, of one sort or another. He thinks he can maybe find something, will have to see for himself.


[Editor’s note: Several of the names in this report are in code.]


MONDAY, NOV. 28 [1977]

1.Eric [Charles Garry] says OK on questions to JJ from the Examiner. But they must be done under his supervision. Irene will get the questions and let Eric see them before they go over. Maybe there ought to be a statement in the E from Hill [Jim Jones] in regards to the Jeremy [John Victor Stoen] situation. This is the only way he would hear of a public statement about the circumstances of his birth.

When Irene and I brought it up again about wanted to say something so the outside world would hear the truth about Hill and Jeremy, he objected vehemently again. NO. The outside world would not understand. They would look at it as justification for all the things the press has said about Hill. That he would do anything to keep things together. Revolutionary leaders understand and have done such things, but we do not talk about them. It would be damaging. WE accept that, but we can’t shove it down the throats of people with bourgeoisie mentality.… Go ahead and do it, but I don’t approve it. We don’t need to explain this in any way. Why should we have a Press conference about this? A conference needs to spell out the strengths, why do we not intend to let this child be returned to its “mother” [Grace Stoen]– the woman is a stranger, birth was only incidental to the child’s growth and development which is totally separated from this woman. “I want the film.” Get away from the child and this stuff. We want to say why Guyana is paradise. This will get us friends. Not the mother-son issue. Let’s talk about the assets, we have them. Not about it in terms of defensive mechanisms. Why don’t we stop worrying about this shit, like that narrow, smutty way the media wants it and would portray it. We need to affirm our assets. What we are doing. We’ve isolated ourselves into defensive tactics. We’re going to have to sell ourselves to the public. (See notes from the former write-up that Mary Ann had in files, the ones Sharon and Irene did about Jeremy’s chronology. Mary Ann LOOKED that up and read it to him, and he thought it was excellent.) Only our people deserve to know the truth and they do not require any explanation. People have done this and more to bring freedom to the country, but they have not said what they have done. Don’t give them a case when they don’t already have one. Disastrous. I feel so strongly it is bad, that I won’t have it. (this is all pretty much verbatim from Eric tonight.)

2.Re. letter – Luckhoo CAN get the letter. I know. He is very powerful.… “If there is a letter, Luckhoo can get it.” Nothing else on this.

3.He will call the lawyer in Schwartz case tomorrow. Will tell him that he, Eric, does not have authority to represent us but he does have authority to settle the case. This we understand is his feeler to see if the atty. will settle out of court. He did not explain further, nor why now is the time he chose to do this.

4.Someone called him from LA today, no names retrieved by Charles, who claimed to be friends with someone who heard the radio broadcast and wanted to talk to relatives in Guyana. He said yes, there would be no problem, and that a phone patch could be done. He told us that we need this kind of stuff.

page 2.

5. Said Dolores McMurray had called him wanting to know whom to contact to give money to the church. Said she received and wants it to go to PT. Eric said there is no problem in taking it and when she calls Martha, as he instructed her to do, we should take it. If we want we can say we don’t want it, will only take whatever she can give whenever she can. There is in his mind no problem for us or for her (apparently this is some money she gets for Renée from the government.) No special documentation necessary. He said she was an imbalanced but very nice person.

6.Re. Kilduff – he brought up an interesting point. Said he’s not seen anything in the Chron about us for a while, esp. noticeable silence from Kilduff. He thinks maybe he temporarily shot his wad on the Head case. Lost credibility with the staff there. It’s a thought.

7. Again he said he would not object to Hill making a public statement to clarify about Jeremy, but it would have to be done along the lines he (Eric) indicates. Again stated our direct approach to the subject would only alienate people, especially the feminists.

[Paragraph bracketed] 8. Re. the JOE MATTER – received a call that 12/12/77 was continuation date. The Asian had called to tell him. Eric will call the Deputy AG and tell him the date is inconvenient, as he has a court hearing in Gilroy that day. In the meantime he is having the law which the AG is using in this matter researched – he is not sure the case is valid. Will let us know. Nothing immediate with this, no continuation date definitely set, then.



TUESDAY, NOV. 29 [1977]

1.RE: TALK WITH GOODLETT: The attack on us, the report that showed up in Guyana – “Not surprising. When big government decides to malign and destroy, they do anything. Look what they did to Hoffa.” Re. Stoen, he said “I wouldn’t let that keep you from coming back. There will always be provocateurs. It is amazing it was delayed for so long. Misplaced confidence hurts.”

He went into a lengthy explanation of the philosophy of early Christians, how they paid for years for their beliefs in the Coliseum. Finally Constantine recognized that the state could not like the early Christians and so institutionalized the church. Since then the church has been a defender of the status quo, has served to control the masses and deluded the people. (This explanation was in relation to something we couldn’t quite figure out. Not sure why he got into all this.)

Then he said he had been to jail a lot of times. Anytime you challenge Caesar’s power you pay the price. When you have to rely on other people as you do in this type of organization, you are going to run into less than steadfast people, people who don’t recognize that the gospel of redemption is the gospel of the poor… (He got off onto that again, I think maybe he was trying to make us feel better about TOS’ [Timothy Oliver Stoen] defection. It really seemed quite religious. Probably what he was getting at was that TOS couldn’t stand to be a house nigger with the rest of us.) He went on to say that people break. He was surprised TOS had broken though, because though he did not know TOS that well, he understood that he was so close to Hill [code name for Jim Jones].

Said we have got to retrench here. He said the worst thing we could give up, if it is getting tight and we have to give up something, would be the Peoples Forum. That is crucial. Keep up the voice. The paper had a lot to do with why Hill was hit. It is an effective voice in educating the people; he visited a guy in Yonkers, NY who havd a copy of PF sitting on his table. Said this is when they consider you dangerous. This was part of the reson they reached a decision point about going after us. It was all over the country. He said we don’t operate in a vacuum. We move across state boundaries. Peoples eyes are being opened by Jim. Get the truth out. Report our side of this thing.

Then he went into a kind of argument Pat [Richartz] gave. Hill should come back. Here is the “heart of the beast.” “Eventually a man has to face his accusers… With every delay the rumor mongers have a field day.” At this point Marcie  and Vera told him Hill was by no means in retreat nor staying there because “they have anything on him.” They explained how being in Guyana is a prison, ‘like a jet airplane in a Model T.’ That he would come back were he not responsible for the lives of 900 people, and also because of the custody issue. Marcie explained about Jeremy [John Victor Stoen]. Coleman was neutral, not unsympathetic. He said he had not known previously.

He suggested we print the document in our paper. Said he would talk to Charles about his reluctance to jump ahead with some of the things we told him we wanted to do in the way of press releases. Said you have to be “crazy niggers.” The Goodletts were always ‘crazy niggers’ and therefore survived. You have to fight back, you have to be ready to die, because all you have to lose is your life and your chains. Again Marcie in particular explained to him that this is exactly what Hill would do if he could – jail, death, that he and his family had faced this



long ago and it was far more difficult for Hill to stay confined to the FL [Freedom Land] and commit himself to the lives of his people while all this is going on here. Goodlett  said if he comes back he may well have to face the possibility of jail. Advised that Hill not “wait until everything is in order” before returning. Said this is America, and we are in insipient fascism. Things will never be in order. Cited the Bakke thing, said the issue is of course much broader and gave the historical perspective why Bakke represents the inequities of the whole system. Said we have to keep pushing (referring to we in the movement) the economic power brokers, see that wealth is disseminated rather than concentrated further in the hands of the adversaries. Said it is the “C’s” who are living out the true mandates of Christianity.

Again, said Hill is a threat to the system because he is educating the people, opening their eyes. Referred to the struggle again, saying it is not down there, it is here. Alluded to a sanctuary there. Again we interrupted and said that it was indeed no sanctuary, a movement to be emulated by all the Third World people. Said all [Black] Panthers, all exiles have come back home, because eventually all realize that the battle is here. He said he agreed what was being done in Guyana was important, that Hill was in the role of the protector now, not of the ‘hanger on the first tier.’ Marcie reminded him that Hill is a fighter. Not in retreat or sanctuary. He restated that he did not mean to minimize the importance of what is happening in Guyana – said Charles Garry, whom he loves and named his only son after – was more entused about what he was privileged to see in Guyana that [than] he has ever seen Garry enthused about anything. “I share that vicariously.” He is working with the People (Hill is). He learned long ago that you cannot make a better world for the people, you have to make it with the people and Hill is doing that. But somebody has to be out there scouting the enemy. Described himself as this scout. Said he could not advise Hill what to do, since he was not in the same position as teacher and protector of all those people.

But again emphasized the importance of the FORUM. Sadi [Said] to name the names, state the facts. Print it all. We told him we wanted to, that Hill had been telling us to run all this in the press as releases for days. But that we were confronted with Charles’ reluctance. He said, you can print as “Friends of Peoples Temple” or the “People who are Fighting Back for the Peoples Temple.” Said he feels that Garry is reluctant to print things that say “Hill says this, Hill says that.” There are ways around it. He said he will talk to Garry, will tell them he thinks – as we do – that we ought to go more on the attack in the press. We are in a war. Use the Forum, use handbills. Get it out.

We told him about the phone calls and the tape of the Ron Owens show. He was concerned, said he agreed with us that we have to tell our enemies where to get off, not cater to them in a time of war. “You have to work within your parameters.” We told him we agreed 1000 percent, and would he please talk to Charles about this. We felt Charles was on the spot now, would have to make some response to these fools. Ecplained how we were used by Mickey Touchette. He was in total agreement we should not mess with these fools. Said “Let them use the public mails.” You have to develope a certain resistance in your feelings to the things they say, the shit they sling. We asked him to please talk to Garry at once and tell him this, because it was certainly going badly for us this way. He agreed to.




RE: CONVERSATION WITH ERIC. Something is going to have to be resolved. He won’t take any more deliberation about the movie or about the calls. If we don’t want it, he says to tell him. If we refuse to accept calls, we should tell him and he will knock it off. But he will not bring the subject up again, he says.

[Handwritten note in the margin bracketing next two paragraphs: “Important note: I forgot (in my rush to get to the airport on time) to put the quotation marks around Garry’s words. These two paragraphs are his words.” Many of the quotes in these two grafs are inserted by hand.]

He wants the film adamantly, because it shows our strengths and the timing is right. “We could decide to do a film in the future and it might mean nothing. The time is now.” He says he will not say another word about it. He is frustrated because he “has nothing to work with.” “All of our excuses are lame,” in his opinion, whether it be the development of the project, the fact that it isn’t built up enough yet – whatever. He will have the film. He said “this is annoying,” and he is tired of listening to himself talk. “Please do it. It is taking too much out of me to fuck around like this.”

Re. the calls, Marcie expressed to him she is having misgivings about contacting Tupper after all the shit he has caused. He said he wants the calls made. He asked, where does this put him? “Didn’t I say over the air they could call? Haven’t we kept them from calling? Don’t people listening to the airwaves know that our contact is good when we say it is not and we have no excuse? Why are we paranoid? What are we hiding.” He said if he had not been there, he would generally suspect something was wrong – we were hiding something. But he knows we are not. “Why don’t we sell our wares? Why don’t we use our strengths? Let them talk.” When Mickey was in the room with all of us, she was sweet as pie. It was when she got together with all her cronies that she got brazen to say the lies. They have planned this, they know us well and calculated we will react like this and are playing it to the hilt. And they are getting mileage off us. We are playing to their game. We should let them talk, let the families there, such as Don Sly and Mark, talk to Neva. Tell her it is wonderful, they are happy and well. Disarm her and all of them. They say things, we TAPE. (He was utterly frustrated that the call to Mrs. Beavers was not taped by Tom. This would have been exactly the kind of ammunition he needs to talk to Ron Owens and tell him they are all motherfuckers.) What “weakness” does this show on our part? Our strength is exactly showing the world the wonderful things we have done, how happy the people are. They should tell the relatives this, in a group. If they insist on talking in private, they should be told they will have to pay their way there. He said, “Is it wrong that I tell them to go there and see for themselves? If it is wrong, tell me and I will wipe it all off the slate. But I cannot go on like this, giving maybe answers to them…”

My opinion is that by this time we have an intractable situation on our hands. I understand that at the bottom of the issue is probably not even so much whether the relatives sould talk or not but that Charles, probably out of his enthusiasm when he returned, opened his big mouth and in effect put us in the position of being dictated to by him and the traitors. I truly think he is sincere and thinking that this is the best strategy to deal with people who are negative and who are wondering here, whether liberal, left or whatever. There is also the dimension of him having stuck his ego on the line, and now he is in an impossible situation. He either delivers the phone calls



or loses credibility in the community as a “dupe,” which is what Ron Owens said. I think he made a rash move and forced us into a position that is a departure from anything we have done before in entertaining or catering to trators. But the mistake has been made and now we have to deal with it and the situation has reached a climax. If we tell him NO and do not comply, he will have lost something personally because he has that much ego and community reputation vested in it now. I think he will not throw us over, but will not be aggressively active on our behalf, not with the kind of enthusiasm he had when he first got back.

I understand, (at least from my own perspective I think I understand) the feelings from down there. He has railroaded us into something without any consultation, without weighing our feelings in this – and he is reaping the results now in suspicion and bad feelings. I have been pretty vocal about my feelings towards these people and this situation we have been put into, with Mickey Touchette especially. I believe he holds me personally responsible for the hang up on these calls, that I am blocking it. Although tonight Marcie and I both questioned again why we had to do this when we could not win either way, and whatever we say the [they] will crap on our heads – that there is a principle involved. But those things should have been part of discussions previous to his saying publicly we would make these calls possible. Now the situation is untenable because it has been made a public issue and if we pull out on him – what he has already committed us to do this – well, I already said, the mistake has been made.

I think we have to go through with these calls now because of Charles. He made it very clear how much it means to him. I am not saying this because I think we should “capitulate” to his wishes, but because the importance of the thing is now between Charles and us. He has a definite logic to his points, that they say things we can tape, that we may possibly use this against them in the long run. One at a time we can deal with them like this. As a gang, when they do things like the phone call the other night, we cannot deal with them. Either we say we don’t give a shit what the community thinks about us because of the assy things these fools are saying on the air, or we do give a shit and we use the airwaves to make positive strokes for our own strengths. This, to me, (plus the importance these calls have taken on for him) dealt with one at a time and with full back up down there to counteract their undermining – it should be seriously considered. I hate like hell to say and do this. I resent these fuckers and they can eat shit – but Charles has chosen this as his program and we are going to have to do something he wants – the film or the calls or something to give him some feeling we are listening to him or he will not be the advocate for us we want him to be later on. He is seriously pissed tonight. More frustrated. I would like to tell him why this reaction on our part but he won’t understand. We have tried dozens of times. Now we either say no and reach a breach of understanding with him or we proceed with the calls and/or the film. Soon.

This is being written hastily to make it to the plane. I am sorry for its confusion. I would like to tell Charles what I think is at the bottom of our differences over this – that decisions like this one he made without benefit of our feelings and consultation create a hostile and suspicious reaction in us. But I truly do not think he will understand this, not from me. Not from any of us here. And I am not even sure this IS what is at the bottom of the problem. I think he is trying in his way like this to defend us, regardless of the



ego involvement he has in it at this point. I think we should give him some satisfaction on something SOON.