Q049a Transcript

Transcript prepared by Fielding M. McGehee III. If you use this material, please credit The Jonestown Institute. Thank you.

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Biologist: — uh, uh, oh, it started uh, all the problems that uh, come up, uh, come up with a community, such as po — pollution of the — oops — uh, water, uh, uh — no, shouldn’t say that — about the water — (Stutters throughout Jones’ instruction)

Jones: No. No no no no. Say, I checked — say, I checked closely to see if there’s any pollution, and we haven’t found any thus far.

Biologist: I checked — checked the uh, other, other, other — uh, oh, shoot — the uh, uh —

Jones: Don’t get nervous. You gettin’ — Take your time. He don’t have to — If he want you to talk, you can take your time. (Pause) If they don’t, then just — screw him, you see.

Biologist: (Stutters)

Jones: No, don’t do that.

Crowd: Laughs.

Jones: Say, I study for plant funguses, and I — we work in our little laboratory back there. Get your — kind of rehearse a few things that you say. That’s the thing. People who have tension of speech, which I used to have, stuttering, (speaks calmly and slowly) you gotta be sure you take it easy, you know, and have — I’d study an answer for any kind of damn thing that you think they might ask you, okay, biologist?

Biologist: Yeah — uh, yes.

Jones: Thank you. You may pass. (Pause) I think we have fairly well covered that. Now, the rest of you —
General conversation and laughter.
Tape shuts off for undetermined time.

Jones: (Relaxed, offhand) — with the law, I wouldn’t say I was on my way to jail, necessarily, I was — I was doing things I shouldn’t, but here I — I wouldn’t do anything for nothing. I’m happy, peaceful, but I think we better have a similar approach to Guyana. Sure. Hell. That makes this community that much more of a model, don’t you think?

Crowd: (Scattered) Right.

Jones: Hell, they got problems with crime in this country. They want us to take some of their criminals, um, but they don’t expect to do us — do it right now. (Pause) (Reads question) How many hours a day do you work? (Aside) I’ll have to go on the —

Woman: You don’t have to work any hours, but you can put in —

Jones: (Interrupts, incredulous, like interviewer) You mean a young per — uh, the ordina — people don’t work?

Woman: You can um, put in hours in the areas, you know, that you um, want to, like, I take on, like lab and I also have a interest in agriculture.

Jones: No, but wa — watch. Say, seniors don’t have to do any work at all. (Pause) They’re not required, but oth — others, we work an eight-hour day. Sometimes we’ve had cases when the harvest was getting in, we’d work extra, but we’d get the time off later. You see what I’m saying? (Pause) Do children work?

Woman: No, they don’t. (Pause)

Jones: I’d say — I’d say they do, if they — they want to. A lot of them like to do things, to learn about nature and planning. It’s a part of their classroom activity. It’s a training program. It’s not work, in the sense of uh, hard labor, it’s to learn how to do things, and learn how a plant grows, and they go out for work-study to see the equipment with — under safety — you know, under safety guidance, with safe — with their teachers. (Pause) Does everybody work in the fields?

Woman: No, the seniors, um, the seniors take on things like, um, knitting and making rugs and quilts and things.

Jones: They have — Does everybody else work in the fields?

Woman: No, they don’t have to.

Jones: I’d say, but a lot of folk like to. How many hours do they work?

Woman: It’s, um — Maximum is eight hours. They put ’em in on —

Jones: Okay. Now, I — I — I’d say a lot of people like the — like the fields. It’s so — I don’t think we should shun the, the, the fields. Say, I like it out in the field. I — I prefer it, frankly, to anything I know. Somebody — if you do, you know. Uh, but I don’t have to. You’re not made to do so. You go to — You go before counseling, and you make your work selection, and we’ve a — no problem of people having to do work they don’t want to do.
Man: Because they’re so many different departments, and you should be able to name them.

(Tape turns off for undetermined time, about two minutes real time.)

Jones: A number of things that’ll help Guyana be self-sufficient. (Pause) Well, that’s what we want to do. We want — we don’t want to be a burden here, we want to be a help. And we help make cassava, they need cassava, and so we’re planting the cassava, and now we’re working on charcoal. Say, one of young men’s in town right now — he is, Amondo [Griffith] — working, learning the arts from the government on how to make charcoal because the — they’ve got a uh, a good trade agreement with Norway and Sweden to buy a lot of charcoal. You got that? (Pause) (Louder) Huh?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: I hope some of you have. Yes, what is it, son?

Boy: Also, uh, I think we ought to bring out about us free medical care for the Guyanese.

Jones: Indeed, we should say we give free medical care to Guyanese. And we even have medical team that goes into the co — community around us, our neighbors in Port Kaituma, and other places. Do you copy?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: Oh, Jesus, I hope I don’t say “you copy” every time I talk to somebody.

Gentle laughter.

Jones: Okay, pass there. (Pause) Do you people hunt here?

Young man: Yes, we do.

Jones: Where — how do you hunt?

Young man: (Stutters) Bows — (Laughs) Bows and arrows.

Jones: What?

Young man: Bows and arrows. (Laughs)

Jones: Don’t — well, don’t laugh about it. (Pause) Say, we use bows and arrows. We got some very uh, good bows — One of our teachers — one of our principals very good with the bow and arrow. But say, we don’t get enough time for hunting ’cause we’re — we don’t — we don’t uh — we — we’re raising our own chickens and we’re raising our own pigs and cattle and fish, we do some fishing, but later we hope to do some hunting, and we got a chap over here that knows how to uh, (stumbles over words) — he’s trained several people how to use the bow and arrow. (Pause) (Unintelligible question) And we’re — we’re learning — we’re try to learn from our Amerindian neighbors more about how they hunt. Okay. (Pause) Uh, is that all you have, just bows and arrows?

Young man: Yes, right, um, small things like slingshots and small things, but that we don’t have any weapons here.

Jones: (Pause) (Emphatic) Don’t volunteer it unless they ask you. (Pause) (Stumbles over words) You — you ended it just right. With slingshots and so forth. Say, what do you use slingshots for? Well, somebody play with them out, away from where the public — way out in the community, let people just play, they like — did you ever like to (stumbles over words) use a slingshot?

Young man: Yes.

Jones: Well, I — I mean, you can ask a person, you know. (Pause). Okay, next, next next next next. Now. Let’s get down to news. (Pause) Shift, please. By the way, you don’t know of any bedwetters —

(Tape abruptly off, for unknown period)

Jones: — elitism. Some of the hardest work, (stumbles over words) uh, Jim Jones will do just the hardest work that anybody else will. Fact is, he likes it, he likes it. He don’t like, uh, office work. He likes to get out, uh, like the other day, unload a wagon of wood. You understand? He likes that.

[Man’s question too soft.]

Jones: Well, they’ll — they’ll ask you point blank, are you a socialist. Sure — Surely I believe in this communal type of living. I believe in a cooperative lifestyle. I believe in a non-violent socialism. That’s a — you — you answer it various ways. You understand what I’m saying? Okay, you may be seated.

[Man’s question too soft. ]

Jones: Nuh — (tape edit?) You have holidays off? Yes. Weekends? Yes. Do we honor the Guyanese national holidays? (Pause)

Man: Do I say that uh, we don’t see our lifestyle as uh, the answer for all systems, but uh, it works for us, and we hope that it might inspire others.

Jones: Say, some people need this kind of lifestyle. I did. And uh, we’d like to see more of it done, USA, because it’s an alternate — it’s an alternative society. Some people can’t make it in a big cities, and in the — a lot of agricultural areas like Montana and places like that, it would be wonderful if they did this type of thing. But we didn’t find it convenient to do so there, ’cause we couldn’t afford the cost of the land. You understand? (Pause) Here, if you produce the land, you can have lease for as long as you produce the land. You have a hundred year lease. You understand? How many acres? Say, well, right now we have um, 3800 acres which can be —

(Tape cuts out, other radio traffic for 30 seconds)

Jones: You follow what I’m saying? ‘Cause everybody in the United States these days, beginning to wonder if there’s not going to be concentration camps and nuclear war. (More forceful) You hear what I’m saying?

Crowd: Yes.

Jones: Please. We — please. (Pause) Tell how you licked the fly problem and, and, the most part we got the mosquitoes down, say you shoulda seen how it was when we — before we de — developed it. We all got with a fly swatter, our insecticide department, we’ve done a tremendous job. Say, you can see, see how we’ve done with the mosquitoes here, compared to in Georgetown? Suckers has to go through Georgetown, he’ll gone know damn well there’s a difference. (Pause) How many noticed the difference with those mosquitoes when you — when you got here?

General crowd noise.

Jones: They got bit like hell, they said, just going outside the community, say, just take a walk down the road, and you’ll see how well we’ve control mosquitoes. Just take a walk down the road, ’cause those folk got bit just going down to the train today. (Pause) Bit like hell. (Pause) You don’t appreciate what we’ve done here, and the miracle of protection that’s here. (Warning tone) But we don’t talk about that. (Pause) Do you have church services? No. Everyone practice their own form of religion, that’s not important here. Any long sermons? Absolutely we don’t — don’t have any sermons at all. What kind of games? Chess, dominoes, so forth and soon. Not crowded? No, no. Say, well, I don’t see many houses. Well, some people live off in secluded areas. They say, where — where are they? (Laughs) You go ask them. That’s why they live in secluded areas. (Laughs)

General laughter.

Jones: Say, say like, uh, like who? Then you can point them to Tom Kice. We have one of the best men in construction, Tom Kice. He’s building a place, way out in the cathedral, which he gets — you say, what’s that? Well , it’s a ca — a beautiful place, looks like a cathedral in the jungle. (Pause) It’s way down that way.

Conversation too soft.

Jones: Say, it’s way down there. I — I’ve only been there once, I don’t know just how to get there, but he does. (Laughs softly)

Conversation too soft.

Jones: (Laughs) That he is. (Pause) All right, now, I think that is down unfortunately for the rest of you, to news. Now —

(Tape abruptly off, for unknown period)

Jones: — (excited) — open to the public. He was set up, hoping and funded and equipped with your tax dollars, my tax dollars, ever since we been working our asses off, we were supporting Adolf Hitler, hoping that he would stop the socialist revolution in Russia. But he kinda got hungrier that they counted on. And he was very suspicious of the Jews that were in the capitalist system of Britain and USA. He didn’t like Jews. He thought they were — He was bigoted. He was race-crazy. And so he expanded too much and forced the arm. The USA couldn’t let him take over everything. So they had to get in the war. But they let Russia take most of the battle, didn’t they? I wonder co — how much history will later show conniving went on, because the major battle wasn’t against England. (Pause) Never. He didn’t invade England. It was driving into Russia to destri — destroy Russia. There’s where the battle had to be won. And it wasn’t until US really stepped up their interest in Europe until the Russians had shown by God that they were going to stop him there. That’s a horrifying fact. Twenty-two million lives. All their agriculture. All their industrial factories. Back where they were to start with, and yet today they have free medicine, and only pay three dollars — three cents of their dollar on rent. Free health, free drugs, free education. All that amazing — it shows the superiority of socialism. Whatever differences you have with the Soviet Union, whatever (stumbles over word) you have with China, it shows the superiority. And they have underground shelters for their people to protect them from what is the reality, according to most scientists, of nuclear war, that could happen any time. And USA has none. (Calls out) Get that in your brain. It was right there before your eyes to see. They said the Russians rape, but you saw no Russian kicking any — any citizen. You saw no Russian doing any act of violence, did you. And believe me, if they’da had one, they’da sure as hell showed it, wouldn’t they.

Crowd: Right.

Jones: Who did you see doing the acts of violence? US soldiers, whipping with switches and kicking people in the butt and beatin’ ’em and throwin’ a rock that hit a man up the side of the head and he staggered and then — I thought the most atrocious — a woman had one loaf of bread, and he cr — throwed that loaf of bread out of her hands, and slapped her, and then she came back and he shoved her back again. And humiliated a little old man, make him empty everything in his pockets. Ah yes, and then they — all those boys, US, Russian — all of the European millions died for Rockefeller and Krupp and all those great industries, and none of those warmongers ever went to jail. Who did we have to set there and listen to last night, talking about Adolf Hitler? [German architect Albert] Speer, (Pause) who’s the head of the armaments industry of Hitler’s Germany. Now he’s gone talk how bad Hitler was. Why didn’t he do something while Hitler was doing all this shit? (Pause) Nut — no real — no real bad portrayal. Did you hear anything bad about Adolf Hitler, really?

Scattered: No.

Jones: He kissed Eva Braun, and he uh, spoke — he wanted us to go away to the south, go over to USA. Why? Because, he said, that’s the new man. Capitalism. That’s where the new emerging man — I haven’t succeeded, but go there. Don’t let the Russians catch you. Then it tells how Goebbel — Goebbels [Nazi propaganda minister Paul Joseph Goebbels] has to kill his family. But don’t hear anything really bad about Hitler, who killed seven million people. He kissed Eva in her lip — on her lips, and for the first time, the secretary said, he raised his voice, only to get them to leave the bunker. And he didn’t want his wife to come. Wanted her to leave, (stumbles over words) even though his eyes were pleased as he came. But we hear about raping of women, and all kinds of bullshit about Russians. And yet the same thing before, the US tried to show Hitler’s Germany using that same kind of lie, and that’s how brainwashed the American people is, they heard about these German women crying about how Russians and Poles and everybody else but German were raping their women and killing their babies. And they turn around and pull the same job on the American people, and they didn’t recognize it. You see what I’m saying? We are — We — We have been brainwashed. Don’t take much to brainwash us. What hurts me more than anything, is how stupid the American public has become, ’cause they’ll — they can shove anything past ’em, they won’t see it. (Pause) All right, you did a good job there, comrade. Next. I must quit talking now, so we can move fast. What did you get in the news?

Young Woman: (unintelligible) the Portuguese colonies, that Premier um, Francisco Mendez, known to his people as Chief Hotay, he um —

(Tape turned off for indefinite period)

Jones: — that last part of the statement, that’s something for them to learn. Next.

New girl: Rita Dennis, and um, the thing about —

(Tape turned off for indefinite period)

Boy: — Um, the U. S. is um, training 14,000 missionaries of all arts and torture to go to Rhoda — Rhodesia and fight. I mean, mercenaries.

Jones: (Wearily) Yes, there’re actually four thousand some hundred of them, four thousand three hundred, that are US. There are so many that are West German who are the inheritors, proudly they say, of Hitler’s Third Reich, and uh, British I guess have got them in there, and French too. The Zimbabweans are in conflict with them now. They tortured six youngsters, took them out of school, tortured them and castrated them, trying to get them to tell where their parents were, where the fighting forces of the liberation front was, and those six brave children did not give a word, and died. Tortured, without giving ’em a word. Because, the reason they know, if they knew where they were, and no one found their unit. (Pause) They did not talk. Now, that’s something that our children and our seniors and we all as adults here should think about. (Pause) Six black schoolchildren, stood up against the racist pressure of torture and death, and did not talk. Yes. (Pause)

Boy: I remember, um, about um, Vernon, saying um, that he thought it was a waste that um, in the fields, grass would be planted where food could be planted, and he also said that um — he mentioned that the ri — the rich people would have to um, now give up their land, or else they — he’d take it — that it’d be taken away, and um, he also said that um, Guyanese — he felt the Guyanese were brainwashed in a way um, with US commodity, you know —

Jones: True.

Boy: He mentioned that um, for instance —

Jones: But he didn’t know how he thinks. All the time. Yes.

Boy: For — for instance, he said that the uh, black-eyed pea was uh, better tasting than the uh, s — split pea, and he said that um, all mangoes here are better than al — apples, and that we should substitute all this for — (Jones speaks over him)

Jones: That’s right.

Boy: He learned (voice fades) —

Jones: Apparently the conspiracy’s reached even to a judge, by the way here, you know the judge was handling the custody case, (unintelligible phrase) John, and uh, the judge today went to court after seven months not deciding it, and refused to decide it, said that he was getting pressure from the United States. The undertone they thought was that we were doing it, showing our enemies are so evil, that they will even threaten a judge, but it was turned over to a judge who has been to our house to dine many times, so I don’t know what that’ll do, he’s been very, very friendly to us, but that’s an interesting development I thought that uh, maybe the lawyers had not heard. It’s an interesting development. He just refused. He said he cannot make the decision on the case. You know any rationale-minded, they certainly didn’t — did not uh, particularly help the, the uh, adversaries, ’cause we’re back to Stage One, and it all begins over again for review by another lawyer. By another judge. (Pause) However, we were told that the arrest order had no effect. Now what — Do you know what the kind of rationale that would be behind that you might tell me? But go ahead? (Pause) Ne — Next. That’s fine.

Young Woman: I can elaborate on um, the movie Uptight.

Jones: Uptight. Yes. It should be.

Woman: Um, Tank Williams uh, sold out his brother Johnny Wills for a thousand dollars. He —

Jones: (Exaggerated tone) A thousand dollars.

Woman: And he went to a bar and splurged all that money —

Jones: When he was — acting like he’s gonna help his girlfriend with her children.

Woman: Uh, yes. And uh, there were four um, mistakes that the um, group made uh. First of all, uh, they shouldn’t have rejected Tank Williams.

Jones: How many listening to this? This is something you ought to know, ’cause someday you may have to f — struggle for revolution someplace. May have missions that’ll carry you around the world. Listen.

Woman: Um. Second, they shouldn’t have had him —

Jones: (Calls out) Wake up. (Snaps fingers)

Woman: — gone out (unintelligible word; could be “freely”) with all the information, and uh, thirdly, um, uh — they shouldn’t have plan — made plans in front of him. And uh, fourth, um — (Pause) um — (Pause) Um. (Pause) (Jones speaks as she does)

Jones: Joe [possibly Earl Luches Joseph Johnson], you want to help her there?

Joe: Showed black chauvinism and uh, sadomasochism, and then it also showed sentimentality in the film.

Jones: Yes. It said revenge, too, you revenge your enemies. You don’t avenge your enemy. Uh, you — you get justice, but you’re not uh — personal vengeance is not a socialist principle, is it?

Scattered voices: No.

Jones: You try to defeat class enemies. And just because someone hurt you — and I want our children to be taught that, beautiful child here who’s very intelligent said I’d like to go back to the United States and get people who made fun of me when I was in school. Not a good reason. You understand what I’m saying.

Scattered: Yes.

Jones: Not a good reason. Okay. Next, please. (Pause)

Hoarse boy: The news that um, that I picked up, is um, that um, the city —

Jones: Where’d Patty get gone to?

Patty: (Away from mike) Right here.

Jones: Thank you, dear.

Patty: I wouldn’t leave this for anything.


Jones: I got a hell of a question for you, Patty.


Jones: Naw. What’s that? Go ahead, go ahead. (Pause) I knew she was bringing up the tail end there. Let’s go.

Hoarse boy: That the um, city — the city bus workers make m — make more money than the um, police — police and sergeants do.

Jones: Sergeants and lieutenants of Memphis, Menne — Memphis, Tennessee. However, the police have been given a court order to go to work. Now if that’d been a black group of people, they’da already been in jail. (Pause) But in Memphis, the police can get by with it. But it’ll be an interesting thing, to see what will happen if these police keep on that road. Will the governor of Memphis order the mi — the National Guard to fire on them? (Pause) Make them go back to work. It’ll be interesting. I doubt it. They’ll — Sure — They’ll sure have to be dangerous. What?

Voice too soft.

Jones: They — they did. They took their guns off of them. The ones they found, but there’re some of them that didn’t have their guns with them. They took all their badges and guns off of ’em. So they may get local police against the army in USA, which should cause some divisions. Won’t stop nuclear war. Won’t stop what they’ll do to black people. But it would be an interesting diversion and pressure off of our people that might stave them, to get out of here more quickly. We’re gonna get them out. We’re gonna — All for one, one for all. Right? Thank you. Next. Next.

Young man: Well, I been at the boat, but uh, you told us to watch the movie Uptight, and I can explain some more reasons that she — she missed.

Jones: Umm-hmm?

Young man: Um, their or — organization, uh, they lacked of one purpose of letting a wh — a wh — white man uh, get in the organization, because they thought it was — was the wrong time, and when this white guy knew uh, things that uh, coulda helped them and uh, it was a racist thing and um, they uh — they also uh, threw out Tank without — They shoulda kept Tank in um, the movement because of um, he knew a lot of information that coulda gave ’em up — gave the organization away, which he gave up his own brother um, because of just some money, and uh, you know, reason he gave up, the reason he wanted the money was ’cause of his uh, the lady that he was staying with uh, she um — he — (Gets fresh start) Tank kicked out the welfare man, and so she ended up with nothing, and Tank couldn’t s — uh, get her nothing ’cause he was always drunk or spent money on uh, to get drunk and —

Jones: As our senior said here, it was sitting here 78 years that uh, the Algerians woulda done something. They’d had their drunks taken care of. No revolutionary shoulda been dealing with an alcoholic in the first place. Not in the first place. They shouldna even tried to deal with him. Do you agree with that?

Crowd: Right.

Jones: Then they wouldna had to reject him. You don’t start working with him in the first place. An alcoholic is not dependable. Unless he recognizes he’s a drunk, and hits the wagon, and you watch him several — several months, and years, see that he’s on the wagon.

Scattered: Right.

Jones: Okay. Thank you.

Man: Thank you.

Jones: Now I’m requiring only this news that I — what I told you that you’ll be — know how to answer, the people that’s in this news, so the tape will be played — this tape must be — (emphatic) that’s all. Tuesday, that’s all that you’ll held be responsible for. Plus the Doctrine of Three Worlds. Which is gonna maybe change the destiny of mankind. China believes in world war — world one. Soviet Union and USA. Main enemy, they say, is USR — USSR, because it’s gaining more power than USA, because USA’s been shown to be a paper tiger in Southeast Asia. Second world is all the European capitalist nations, and the third world is China and the underdeveloped nations, and since 1959, based on a philosophy that nuclear war is bound to come. And now China’s prime minister says within a year. Okay, you’ll have this tape. And that’s all you’ve got to s — to study. Anybody that studies more will be free and this next test passes, you’ll be free from the next test. (Pause) Do you understand what I’m saying? (Pause) That’ll give you freedom that week to do things you want to do. If you get excellence by passing all the other news I give — do you hear me what I’m saying? — that all you have to do to pass to keep from extra classes, is to get tonight’s tape. All right. Be sure to s — keep that separate.

Young black man: What I know is — What I know is that Rhodesia and South Africa uh, attacked Mozambique, and they used US planes, hoping that Mozambique would retaliate so that they could uh, move in NATO troops.

Jones: One of the most terrible acts of brutality that US showed was that they lifted the ban of arms against Rhodesia, just about when the black people were about to get free. When the government was falling, that was illegal, even when Bishop Missuela rejected the government — rejected the government now, and is pulling out himself, yet US capitalism — US capitalism shows its true nature by starting to give aid in these last hours. All — on the surface, but all along, they’ve been giving assistance. Thank you.

Woman: (Unintelligible) First (laughs) okay, uh —

Jones: Yes yes yes yes.

Woman: [Israeli Prime Minister Menachem] Begin said that he would go down in the dust of nuclear war before he’d give in uh, that (Pause) the treaty was already signed, and United States exploded the Hiroshima bomb to show their powers to Russia, that it hasn’t been 200 years since black babies were used as bait in Florida to catch alligator, that —

Jones: (Wearily) Yes, that’s true.

Woman: That um —

Jones: They were used as bait. That’s right.

Woman: That uh —

Jones: Black babies in Florida —

Woman: Today — in Florida —

Jones: — to catch alligators. That’s the truth, my dear.

Woman: And uh, today, er — they found the remnants of uh, Loui — this — whatever causes Legionnaires disease in air conditioners, and three people —

Jones: Indiana University, right.

Woman: And that President N —

Jones: Three are dead, and 19 lingering near death.

Woman: And that — in the movie last night, that the — showed the Russians and the Americans shaking hands, at the very end of the bombing of Dresden, and that uh — shit — that President [Jimmy] Carter, who was once a progressive, has gone completely right on this capital gains — it was voted out — voted about the bill on the capital gains today.

Jones: Yes. Um-hmm.

Woman: And —

Jones: He took a right wing stand for capital gains tax — No no no. He took a left wing. Is — as right? Is that right? Gettin’ confused, this late hour. He took a right wing stand on gas deregu — the utilities being deregulated, their prices being allowed to be deregulated. And two Congressmen claim they’ll uh, go on filibuster, [U.S. Senator Howard] Metzenbaum and — where’s Metzenbaum from?

Answer too soft.

Jones: Ohio. Oh, he’s liberal, yes. That — that p — that pits my mind. And Aber — Aberazek [U.S. Senator James Abourezk (D-SD)], who is an uh, Lebanese, who’s very left, um — as the — as Se — as Senators go. But Carter wants the public utilities to be allowed to get uh, all the increase of prices they want. He wants to take off the price limitations, which is outrageous, with the cost of living like it is. And the Congress is going against him there, but he is going against the um, will of the people on the — (pause) no, he’s going f — for the will of the people — (undertone) Oh, what the hell is it now?

Answers too soft.

Jones: (Tired) I got that damn thing all fucked up, I think. On one side, he’s on the wrong side of the question. As he’s for deregulization, that makes him wrong. That makes him on the side of capitalism. He doesn’t want to regulate big corporations’ prices. Utilities. But in the matter of capital gains, he says that the tax burden has got to be taken off of the middle class and the poorer class, and more capital gains. But not only uh, that, the Congress, uh, is going to make him go further — he made a compromise, but the Congress wants it to go further until there’ll be no capital gain. That means the US corporations have an open carte blanche — open day to take all the profit they want to and put the burden on the little man. (Pause) Important decisions. Thank you. Thank you.
Young person: (Unintelligible word) We can’t sell any damn sheets, and uh, I need some more watches, real bad for all the new people.

Jones: Yes. New watches, yes. Watches and things like that, that can be sold. All right, shift please. (Pause)

(Tape abruptly off, for unknown period)

Jones: — appreciation. Long since. But I do see success in the community. But it’s still — it’s very hard because I’m quite tired. Going through some of the physical things I am. But I’ll be around to be that friend that will not desert you for a long time. Okay. Shift, please, as we continue on. There was somebody that said —

(Tape abruptly off, for unknown period)

Jones: — but we may — a stitch in time, you know, might save us nine. Be seated, please. (Long pause)
(Tape abruptly off, for unknown period)

Jones: — to those who’re looking upon, because we gotta build a model, we gotta give people hope in black America, there’s no hope, anything — with all of our faults, it’s better here than there, and we want some of them to come, and that’s why we want — we’ve just got to see a good story goes out, because they’ve got no place to go to but to be b — blown up to smithereens. You understand what I’m saying?

Scattered: Yes.

Jones: N — and how many know, th — from their heart of hearts, that this is m — far better than anything you’ve seen in the States.

General hubbub.

Jones: Okay, then — then, those that don’t, you shouldn’t be where she is, telling su — things that are wrong with — We want to improve it, and um, I don’t know exactly what the — what, are they accusing him of, one-time offense, or is this several time offenses?

Woman: (Speaks quickly) It’s — it’s — it’s been leading up to it. I should’ve reported when it first started happening.

Jones: I — I say, is it once — time, or is it many times — (woman talks over him)

Woman: Several times it — it’ll happened. On different occasions.

Jones: Tim — To my son Tim?

Woman: No no no. This — this — this incident that recently happened was — (Pause) uh —

Jones: I’ll deal with my own household first, I always do that.

Woman: It was Sun — Sunday — It — it was — it was about tea. Day before yesterday morning, I could say — what, I can’t even remember the days now, but I do know the, the incidents what I should’ve had today. And I went to get some food and in a line, and — we’re working on security, and our Marilee [Bogue] asked for a cup of tea, ’cause we — we was on security. But now they say the nurses and uh, other pe — peoples can come to the — round to the entrance and get uh, tea, because I see the positions in there. But then there — there’s uh, oh, Ruby — Ruby uh, Johnson is involved. She says she’s still a, a nurse, and they were giving them preferable — it sounded like a little, but I mean it could build up to something worthwhile. Small thing (unintelligible garble) — because they were making different than them, bu — and then, other people go down and get whatever they wanted to get, and right behind is — I — I hated to see it — uh, Mary (Pause) (talks away from mike) Robby went — went into the back and they gave her — them some uh, two cup — a cup of tea. (Talks away from mike) Yep, uh, Marilee — chowder, what — I don’t know what she — she went into the back, and they come out with uh — each one had a cup of tea. Ava [Jones] had a cup and, and then Tim had a cup. And then, when uh — (Pause) I know what she brought it out here, but then Mary — Mary — Mary coming up there, that — that’s his first cup of tea that got in, and when they come up here the next time, Mary w — brings a cup of tea — she — she ask her to bring the tea. This didn’t bother me so much, but the prec —

Man: (Fades in, unintelligible sentence) — maybe just underline it and, you know, highlight — give us what the charge is, so we can get on — If you — If you’re gonna give us the charge, that, you know, tell us what that is, then we can proceed.

Several voices.

Man: Just — It bogs down, I mean —

Voices too soft.

Tape turned off.

End of Side 1.

Side 2.


Tape originally posted May 2000